Experience with IMPD!

[grizman]

That is all.

You are posting ! I posted a legit request for fair ethical treatment from a public servent. Where is the fecal matter in that?

 

[UncleMike]

No the taxpayers could save money by farming those jobs out to a call center in India.
I have a novel idea, how about doing your job and showing respect to the public and not violating our god given rights.
That would really turn things around and put an end to what you call bashing and what we call putting you on the spot for your actions.

You are posting ! I posted a legit request for fair ethical treatment from a public servent. Where is the fecal matter in that?

You accused another Member, who happens to be part of the Law Enforcement Community, of not doing his job, not showing respect to the Public, and violating your "God Given Rights"
All without proof that he has done any of those things.
That is !!!!!

 

[LPMan59]

so why did the OP get frisked?

 

[E5RANGER375]

so why did the OP get frisked?

fishing (cops might say investigating or searching to make sure there isnt a grenade launcher in there) for something to charge him with in my opinion. but he gave them permission so were they wrong? not this time in my opinion. I see so many times on cop shows where drug dealers actualy consent to searches and the cops find drugs , dumb asses!
If they would have kept their mouths shut they would still be rollin' through the hood on twenty fo's.
im not a cop so instead of telling, im gonna ask ....... why not just run the persons ID first while they are in the car. make sure it matches the plates, or there is no record. if it checks out then give them a ticket or warning and let them go. if they have a questionable record, then take it to the next level, or ASK permission to search. why not this way all the time?

 

[ol' trucker]

Hahaha

 

[grizman]

You accused another Member, who happens to be part of the Law Enforcement Community, of not doing his job, not showing respect to the Public, and violating your "God Given Rights"
All without proof that he has done any of those things.
That is !!!!!

Sarcastic response to his sarcastic statement!
I have news for you, NO LEO's life is worth more than mine, no LEO's opinions are worth more than mine, no LEO's have more rights than I. I have no more than anyone else either! to use the logic used by LE alot, How do I know he isn't a bad cop? How am I supposed to know he treats people with the same respect he ask's from them. It is possible he is not what he says he is. He maybe hiding something from me. The badge and uniform are not proof positive that a fair honorable man within is it? This is no more disrespectful than the way some LEO's treat everyone they encounter is it? I can tell you despise having you integrty questioned! So do I! nothing there or here was intended as a personal attack. You took it there first. Don't like it when the shoe is on the other foot huh?

 

[Love the 1911]

Sarcastic response to his sarcastic statement!
I have news for you, NO LEO's life is worth more than mine, no LEO's opinions are worth more than mine, no LEO's have more rights than I. I have no more than anyone else either! to use the logic used by LE alot, How do I know he isn't a bad cop? How am I supposed to know he treats people with the same respect he ask's from them. It is possible he is not what he says he is. He maybe hiding something from me. The badge and uniform are not proof positive that a fair honorable man within is it? This is no more disrespectful than the way some LEO's treat everyone they encounter is it? I can tell you despise having you integrty questioned! So do I! nothing there or here was intended as a personal attack. You took it there first. Don't like it when the shoe is on the other foot huh?

Grizman, on behalf of all LEO's, thank you for your service to this great nation. Your first post seems to indicate that you feel that there is not a LEO in this country who's life is worth nearly as much as yours because we aren't shot at regularly. You also tell us repeatedly to be professional and not act like a bunch of "punkazz high school bullies." Perhaps the tone of your posts lead to all this pissing and moaning.

A few questions: you wrote "God-given rights" multiple times. When you are taking someone's life per an order, is that a violation of a God-given right? Is taking someone's life comparable to running the serial number on their firearm?

I will gladly lay my life down for you, but not because it's worth less than yours. That's the oath that I took and despite you not liking LE because some treat people poorly every day, I will uphold my oath.

 

[Culpepper]

Sarcastic response to his sarcastic statement!
I have news for you, NO LEO's life is worth more than mine, no LEO's opinions are worth more than mine, no LEO's have more rights than I. I have no more than anyone else either! to use the logic used by LE alot, How do I know he isn't a bad cop? How am I supposed to know he treats people with the same respect he ask's from them. It is possible he is not what he says he is. He maybe hiding something from me. The badge and uniform are not proof positive that a fair honorable man within is it? This is no more disrespectful than the way some LEO's treat everyone they encounter is it? I can tell you despise having you integrty questioned! So do I! nothing there or here was intended as a personal attack. You took it there first. Don't like it when the shoe is on the other foot huh?

So just because someone wears a military uniform: they are who they say they are, are not hiding something and are guaranteed to be a fair honorable man.

Maybe some members of the military shouldn't think they get a free ride when it comes to breaking the law because they served their time in the military, now that is disrespectful.

When it comes to questioning integrity, we all know there are never poser on the internet who claim greatness but have none.

As far the shoe on the other foot, maybe you should check your shoes.

 

[grizman]

Grizman, on behalf of all LEO's, thank you for your service to this great nation. Your first post seems to indicate that you feel that there is not a LEO in this country who's life is worth nearly as much as yours because we aren't shot at regularly. You also tell us repeatedly to be professional and not act like a bunch of "punkazz high school bullies." Perhaps the tone of your posts lead to all this pissing and moaning.

A few questions: you wrote "God-given rights" multiple times. When you are taking someone's life per an order, is that a violation of a God-given right? Is taking someone's life comparable to running the serial number on their firearm?

I will gladly lay my life down for you, but not because it's worth less than yours. That's the oath that I took and despite you not liking LE because some treat people poorly every day, I will uphold my oath.

Let me clarify I never stated my life was worth more than anyone elses just that no ones was of more value than mine.
Tone is hard to judge on a forum. The pissing and moaning come from the fact of being questioned about actions more than my tone.

My actions under orders of US government that resulted in the taking of life did not involve the killing of US citizens period let alone under questionable circumstances.
As for the running of the weapons serial #, where was the probable cause to investigate the OP's proper ownership? I realize the officers may have been instructed to do this a matter of routine by the dept. That does not change the fact that it is a questionable act under law. Now if you were to ask permission and were granted permission then that is fine as the citizen has waived his protection from illegal search and seizure willingly. See the difference?

I do not dislike all LE, far from it. You are one of very few that even admits the possibility that some bad apples exist. I respect you for that and for your service. I would be one that would risk my life to back up a LEO if they needed it. I questioned and pushed hard but you maintained civility, displaying maturity and the proper attitude when faced with a outspoken citizen.
Anyone see something here? This did not turn into pissing match why? What is different? If the other officers posting in this thread can figure it out things will change!

 

[hip shot]

Being a LEO myself, given the specifics of this situation where I was investigating a misdemeanor, possibly a felony depending on how badly hurt the victim was in the initial battery, disarming the OP and searching him is proper procedure in this case. Kudos to the officers for ruling out the OP as a suspect and treating him with respect.

I agree, with what the cops have gone through nation wide lately and especilley locally I would do the same thing..... I know the weather sucks and it is hard to find a place to shoot*** but come on

 

[pftraining_in]

As for the running of the weapons serial #, where was the probable cause to investigate the OP's proper ownership?

There is no probable cause or even reasonable suspicion test in this case. The officer ask a question of the OP and he answered by allowing the officer to check the weapon. He could of said no, however he said yes.

 

[grizman]

There is no probable cause or even reasonable suspicion test in this case. The officer ask a question of the OP and he answered by allowing the officer to check the weapon. He could of said no, however he said yes.

I don't seem to find a post by the OP stating he was asked if they could check the serial# or where consented to a request to run the serial #.

Reads to me like they just did it and he didn't object. That is much different than asking and being given consent.

 

[Love the 1911]

I don't seem to find a post by the OP stating he was asked if they could check the serial# or where consented to a request to run the serial #.

Reads to me like they just did it and he didn't object. That is much different than asking and being given consent.

I have discussed the issue of running serial numbers with other officers I work with and there are a lot of different ways to look at that. I have only run 1 serial number on a gun that was not in possession of someone who wasn't under arrest for another crime (not a traffic crime either, drugs, violent crime, illegal poss of firearm, etc.). This one instance was where a member of INGO asked how to have his firearm checked and I offerred to help out and promised to not arrest if the weapon came back stolen.

My take: if I take a weapon in the name of officer safety, I have given the owner of the weapon no choice but to give me the gun. Without giving them the choice, my access to the serial number was obtained by force. If I find a stolen gun that way, a good defense attorney will call it fruit of the poisonous tree and attempt to get the whole case tossed.

Now, if I ask for the weapon (Can I take the weapon for officer safety?) and the person complies, I have access to the serial number. Only if they say they would rather not and I then give them no choice would the above apply.

 

[PatriotPride]

My take: if I take a weapon in the name of officer safety, I have given the owner of the weapon no choice but to give me the gun. Without giving them the choice, my access to the serial number was obtained by force. If I find a stolen gun that way, a good defense attorney will call it fruit of the poisonous tree and attempt to get the whole case tossed.

Now, if I ask for the weapon (Can I take the weapon for officer safety?) and the person complies, I have access to the serial number. Only if they say they would rather not and I then give them no choice would the above apply.

Seems reasonable to me. Too many officers seem to not understand the Fruit of the Poisonous Tree Doctrine. "Officer safety" is still not a valid excuse to confiscate a firearm, but if an officer is truly THAT scared, then I would prefer that they request I hand over my firearm, and not simply confiscate it by force.

 

[pftraining_in]

I don't seem to find a post by the OP stating he was asked if they could check the serial# or where consented to a request to run the serial #.

Reads to me like they just did it and he didn't object. That is much different than asking and being given consent.

Next came the question I was waiting for. Do you have any weapons in the vehicle? I informed him that I did have a revolver sitting next to my right thigh between the seats. He then asked me to keep my hands up, step out of the truck, then put my hands on the bed of the truck for his and the other officers safety. I did what he asked of me and he secured the gun and then gave me a thorough pat down, and placed everything from my pockets and the firearm on the hood of my truck.

Once the item (gun, laptop, TV, phone, etc) is in the officer's possession, he does not have to ask permission to run the serial number.

 

[PatriotPride]

Once the item (gun, laptop, TV, phone, etc) is in the officer's possession, he does not have to ask permission to run the serial number.

Ok...I understand that. The issue is WHY the firearm is in the officer's possession in the first place.

 

[E5RANGER375]

I have discussed the issue of running serial numbers with other officers I work with and there are a lot of different ways to look at that. I have only run 1 serial number on a gun that was not in possession of someone who wasn't under arrest for another crime (not a traffic crime either, drugs, violent crime, illegal poss of firearm, etc.). This one instance was where a member of INGO asked how to have his firearm checked and I offerred to help out and promised to not arrest if the weapon came back stolen.

My take: if I take a weapon in the name of officer safety, I have given the owner of the weapon no choice but to give me the gun. Without giving them the choice, my access to the serial number was obtained by force. If I find a stolen gun that way, a good defense attorney will call it fruit of the poisonous tree and attempt to get the whole case tossed.

Now, if I ask for the weapon (Can I take the weapon for officer safety?) and the person complies, I have access to the serial number. Only if they say they would rather not and I then give them no choice would the above apply.

you have my respect!

 

[JohnP82]

Glad it all went well for you and thanks for sharing

 

[JohnP82]

you have my respect!

Very well said and understandable

 

[E5RANGER375]

Very well said and understandable

asking me something rather than telling me, will get you more respect anyday in my opinion. I might say no, but at least you asked.