Evansville Sued for Violating Gun Owner's Rights

[indytechnerd]

In my latest post there, I offered up Dave Grossman (On Sheep, Wolves and Sheepdogs). People are just so DENSE!

 

[Roadie]

I would never support anything against the right of someone to carry openly or cc. The majority are the anti's. If concealing in certain public areas where the majority roams keeps them quiet, then for pete's sake, cover it up. Balance and or co-exist is all I'm trying to say here. Like I said, don't take this wrong. It's just my view on this incident.

..and you are still missing my point, and the point others have made in this thread.. Remember, the MAJORITY wanted Rosa Parks to give up her seat to white folk, by your logic she should have done so to placate the masses.

This post gives a good analogy, I would like to see your take on it..

I compare these situations to this...

Your driving along at 55mph which is the posted legal speed limit for the road you are on. Cop pulls you over and says "Sir you are driving too fast. We have had a complaint from other moterist and we think you should be driving 35mph. 55mph is just too fast in our opinion. You have to drive 35 mph because you may scare someone"

You have done nothing illegal at at but are still being harrased by LEOs trying to enforce opinion.

-Gary

 

[Hoosierdood]

If the zoo put up a sign cc only would you still go?

I would still go, and I would OC. As has been stated, they can't post that sign. And respecting the property owners rights? The tax payers are the property owners, and the property owners rights WERE violated when Ben was told to cover up.

 

[BDBHoover]

Roadie....... repped

 

[WebHobbit]

He was still permitted to carry concealed. The zoo was only asking that he cover the weapon up. Don't get me wrong and launch an assault here but out of respect for the property owners and drawing less attention from the anti's, I would have just politely concealed it and went about my buisness. It's not like they were trying to completely disarm the guy. Correct me if I'm wrong.

The Zoo NEVER asked him to conceal. They questioned if he could even carry at all in the zoo. He explained to one of them the law and she said "OK have a nice day" and walked away. Some time later they called the cops on him. That's what happened.

 

[GuyRelford]

Tonight's story: 14 News, WFIE, Evansville, Henderson, Owensboro - Video Landing Page

 

[beararms1776]

The Zoo NEVER asked him to conceal. They questioned if he could even carry at all in the zoo. He explained to one of them the law and she said "OK have a nice day" and walked away. Some time later they called the cops on him. That's what happened.

Thanks for clarifying that. Ben was given 2 choices here. Cover up the sidearm or leave. I stand behind his action because it's the law and his right. However, (this is just me personally), I would have been just as comfortable to conceal it. That's just me though.
But because I would never oc anyway, that doesn't make me a bg. I still support our right. There should never be battles amongst oc's, cc's, or legal owners of firearms.
Has anyone read the letter from Sen. Tomes? He does have some good points in it.

 

[beararms1776]

..and you are still missing my point, and the point others have made in this thread.. Remember, the MAJORITY wanted Rosa Parks to give up her seat to white folk, by your logic she should have done so to placate the masses.

I'm not missing the point here. My personal opinion of what I would have done vs. what the oc'er chose, doesn't change my support for our rights.
What would you say or call him if he posted the story but instead, chose to cover his weapon?

 

[Exodus]

Yes I do, very much so and I don't even have a ltch.

Thanks for clarifying that. Ben was given 2 choices here. Cover up the sidearm or leave. I stand behind his action because it's the law and his right. However, (this is just me personally), I would have been just as comfortable to conceal it. That's just me though.
But because I would never oc anyway, that doesn't make me a bg. I still support our right. There should never be battles amongst oc's, cc's, or legal owners of firearms.
Has anyone read the letter from Sen. Tomes? He does have some good points in it.

So you don't have a LTCH but you know what it's like to carry your firearm at all times? What way works best for you, what way is most comfortable, what way is easiest to draw from.

 

[indianajoe]

Tonight's story: 14 News, WFIE, Evansville, Henderson, Owensboro - Video Landing Page

Man, that news piece could have used some editing ("Elvansville" lawsuit "ammended"). The reporting didn't make it clear to me: The city stipulates that the gun owner was within his rights to be carrying, and the lawsuit was amended to now challenge only the disorderly conduct charge?

 

[Rookie]

No, it was amended because they still have an ordinance prohibiting firearms in the park. Guy doesn't have to prove TF wasn't disorderly, but he still will.

 

[Hammerhead]

An agent of a political subdivision, i.e. a city police officer, cannot suggest that someone cover up under the threat of police action. This would be enforcing a rule or policy which is specifically verboten by Indiana law. They were using their badges to influence his method of carry.

They then acted upon their implied threat and removed him physically from the location, which was the enforcement of the policy, rule or law (city ordinance).

I had a city police officer suggest that I cover up recently. She suggested that I would be bothered again if they got a MWAG call. She didn't imply that I'd be penalized in any way, just inconvenienced. Nothing was enforced or threatened, so no issue with the new law. This is where E-ville LEOs went wrong. They acted upon an outdated city ordinance.

 

[beararms1776]

So you don't have a LTCH but you know what it's like to carry your firearm at all times? What way works best for you, what way is most comfortable, what way is easiest to draw from.

No I don't know what it's like to carry at all times. I don't have a ltc and I may not even own a firearm.
I wasn't aware this was a requirement to support the 2nd or State gun laws either.

 

[beararms1776]

No, it was amended because they still have an ordinance prohibiting firearms in the park. Guy doesn't have to prove TF wasn't disorderly, but he still will.

Aren't the new laws state wide?

 

[Roadie]

I'm not missing the point here. My personal opinion of what I would have done vs. what the oc'er chose, doesn't change my support for our rights.
What would you say or call him if he posted the story but instead, chose to cover his weapon?

I would say the police and the Zoo were still wrong to ask him to cover it.

 

[Roadie]

Aren't the new laws state wide?

Yes they are, but apparently Evansville and other cities still have their local ordinances that are contrary to the State law on the books, and in some cases are still trying to enforce them.

 

[BDBHoover]

EPD violated state law when they enforced a law that has not been in effect in over 2 months..... Just like it is our requirement as gun owners/carriers to keep up to date on gun laws JUST AS OWNERS/CARRIERS...... It should be a state requirement that the police departments keep up to date on law changes on a federal, state, and local level..... They were in the wrong plain and simple because of lack of training and plain ignorance of the laws that they are paid by civilians to uphold.....

 

[beararms1776]

It should be a state requirement that the police departments keep up to date on law changes on a federal, state, and local level..... They were in the wrong plain and simple because of lack of training and plain ignorance of the laws that they are paid by civilians to uphold.....

I was curious about this to. Don't they hold any kind of meetings with officers on law changes? It seems they should be the first notified of any new changes.

 

[BDBHoover]

I was curious about this to. Don't they hold any kind of meetings with officers on law changes? It seems they should be the first notified of any new changes.

They should but don't..... It is up to every officer to stay up to date on most laws..... They only go through limited training in the academy when it comes to laws and unfortunately they don't get as much law training as they should which is why we have instances like this one...... Or LEOs transfer from another state and think that most of their laws in their native state carry over to ours but as we all know isn't the case most of the time.....

 

[Bill of Rights]

Just read the article, but it was the comments below that toasted my biscuit. "And the [STRIKE]beat[/STRIKE] bleat goes on..." Ignorant sheeple...

FTFY.

If the zoo put up a sign cc only would you still go?

I would. Then I'd call Guy, because being in the zoo would make me "subject to their" rule/policy/whatever.

From what I know of TF, he was just living his life, not seeking out any form of notoriety. If they're sitting there saying, "Please come sue us, we want to pay you money", though... I'm not fool enough to turn them down.

Blessings,
Bill