do you believe in the conspiracies?

[45calibre]

I believe in a few conspiricies. Not sure about 9/11. I do believe about the Mason's/Illuminati.

First, start with the Denver Airport. look at the pattern of the runways. Then TRY to find photos or video of the Airport under construction. There is an entire city below that Airport. You don't have to believe me. Look for yourself. Next, trace back the history of the Swaztica. Longer before the Nazi's, but why the Nazi's chose the symbol. Then go even farther back and look into the Sumerian Tablets and their translations. They talk about Reptilian Creatures falling from the sky and giving the people great knowledge and power, but enslaving those who refused to follow them. They also speak of Sodom and Gomoah.(SP?) You remember, the two cities in the Bible that God Destroyed by a gigantic fireball... Those cities, too, are mentioned in the Sumerian Tablets.

I could go on and on about this, but I'm already on at least 2 lists. I think this post has just put me on a third...

Tell me more about the runway what happened to the city?

 

[45calibre]

And about the reptilians. Do you believe in jesus? Where does all this stuff come in?

 

[SavageEagle]

Tell me more about the runway what happened to the city?

Sounds like you misunderstood. The runway's are aligned like so....

Airport - Google Maps

If you can find pictures of it under construction you'll see that they had a lot of digging equipment going underground. Sure, Airports need the tunnels for various things, but 3 and 4 stories underground. I've heard as far as 12 stories and farther underground.

Now tell me why you would need 4 let alone 12 sub basements at an airport that size?

 

[Bigum1969]

Sounds like you misunderstood. The runway's are aligned like so....

Airport - Google Maps

If you can find pictures of it under construction you'll see that they had a lot of digging equipment going underground. Sure, Airports need the tunnels for various things, but 3 and 4 stories underground. I've heard as far as 12 stories and farther underground.

Now tell me why you would need 4 let alone 12 sub basements at an airport that size?

Lived in Denver for 10 years, including the time they built and opened Denver International Airport. The underground digging was for the underground train system. Another one is for the baggage transport system. Sorry, I think you're a little off on this one.

BTW, the airport is massive. I mean massive. It takes up a huge amount of land and all its parts are separated by long distances -- hence all the underground connections. No conspiracies.

 

[Winchest55]

I am not big on the conspiracy thoeries but i am always open to listen. i may have missed a post or 2 or misread it. what are you saying exactly is the importance of this airports lower levels? what are they there for?

 

[SavageEagle]

Lived in Denver for 10 years, including the time they built and opened Denver International Airport. The underground digging was for the underground train system. Another one is for the baggage transport system. Sorry, I think you're a little off on this one.

BTW, the airport is massive. I mean massive. It takes up a huge amount of land and all its parts are separated by long distances -- hence all the underground connections. No conspiracies.

That's great that you were there, but the train system, did you ever use it? How many stories down is it from ground level?

And here's the kicker...

Why build the Airport over such expansiveness and with such a design when they could have built it on much smaller grounds designed in a much different way?

 

[Joe Williams]

That's great that you were there, but the train system, did you ever use it? How many stories down is it from ground level?

And here's the kicker...

Why build the Airport over such expansiveness and with such a design when they could have built it on much smaller grounds designed in a much different way?

So, tell us how you happened to come by your expertise in airport design? What, for example, are the requirements for how long one must wait to land or depart after a heavy has used the runway? With those time limits in mind, what design changes could they have made to better accomadate the 1,900 operations a day they are currently supporting, knowing that that count will go up over the years? Given the demands of allowing 1,900 operations a day with heavy aircraft, what changes could have been made to allow continuous operations on other runways, allowing for wake turbulence requirements, and still make the airport smaller? I understand you are fascinated by the shape of the runway layout, but what changes would you have made to allow operations regardless of wind direction, while trying to avoid creating runway intersections which, aside from other dangers, prohibit using multiple runways when wind conditions permit? It's a subject that fascinates me, and I would be seriously interested in the ways you have discovered to overcome these and other issues.

 

[public servant]

Good Lord people...it's all outlined in "The Da Vinci Code" and "Angels and Demons". If we can't trust Opie Taylor...who can we trust???

Hey wait a minute...that guy looks just like....OMG!!!!

 

[public servant]

I am not big on the conspiracy thoeries but i am always open to listen. i may have missed a post or 2 or misread it. what are you saying exactly is the importance of this airports lower levels? what are they there for?

The mystery unveiled...

An Open Letter To The New World Order Denver Airport

The Denver Airport Material

 

[Crystalship1]

So, the question I have is why did the Illuminated Masons elect Obama?

Because they were told to by Colonel Sanders, of course!!!!

 

[Winchest55]

I guess when JFK came out people who believe in the big conspiracy theories must have loved that.

 

[SavageEagle]

So, tell us how you happened to come by your expertise in airport design? What, for example, are the requirements for how long one must wait to land or depart after a heavy has used the runway? With those time limits in mind, what design changes could they have made to better accomadate the 1,900 operations a day they are currently supporting, knowing that that count will go up over the years? Given the demands of allowing 1,900 operations a day with heavy aircraft, what changes could have been made to allow continuous operations on other runways, allowing for wake turbulence requirements, and still make the airport smaller? I understand you are fascinated by the shape of the runway layout, but what changes would you have made to allow operations regardless of wind direction, while trying to avoid creating runway intersections which, aside from other dangers, prohibit using multiple runways when wind conditions permit? It's a subject that fascinates me, and I would be seriously interested in the ways you have discovered to overcome these and other issues.

Ok, well since I"m not an aerospace engineer, I can't answer most of those questions. On the other hand, I am a person with a brain and I do know how to use it. (Yes that's a threat. Stand back! )

The runways are spread across a vast open landscape with the terminal in the center. The East and West Runways could have been consolidated on the same side, either east or west, with the terminal just north or south of the runways. The North and South runways could have done the same, only the opposite side of the terminal from the West/East runways. This would have left plenty of room for parking and all the service/commercial roads, hangars, taxiways, refueling stations, etc etc etc.

So again, why would you choose to lay out your runway in the shape of a swastica instead of something much more simple and less space consuming? Even if the plan on expanding the runways by adding more, they would still have more that enough room to add additional runways right along side the others.

 

[Joe Williams]

Ok, well since I"m not an aerospace engineer, I can't answer most of those questions. On the other hand, I am a person with a brain and I do know how to use it. (Yes that's a threat. Stand back! )

The runways are spread across a vast open landscape with the terminal in the center. The East and West Runways could have been consolidated on the same side, either east or west, with the terminal just north or south of the runways. The North and South runways could have done the same, only the opposite side of the terminal from the West/East runways. This would have left plenty of room for parking and all the service/commercial roads, hangars, taxiways, refueling stations, etc etc etc.

So again, why would you choose to lay out your runway in the shape of a swastica instead of something much more simple and less space consuming? Even if the plan on expanding the runways by adding more, they would still have more that enough room to add additional runways right along side the others.

You don't want your runways consolidated because of wake turbulence. Simplistically, when a wing is creating lift, it creates a vortex off of each wing, basically a pair of mini tornadoes. These vortex's can drift a fair way, and have been known to cross parallell runways. They can also cause crashes. They've been known to turn airplanes upside down. They are nothing to screw with. This means that a paralell runway cannot be used for simultaneous operations. One cannot depart or land behind a heavy without a three minute wait... that means if you have two paralell runways you can only land or take off 20 airplanes an hour. Not nearly enough. However, if you have the space to spread your runways out, you can conduct simtaneous operations, doubling, tripling, or more the number of operations you can conduct.

 

[SavageEagle]

You don't want your runways consolidated because of wake turbulence. Simplistically, when a wing is creating lift, it creates a vortex off of each wing, basically a pair of mini tornadoes. These vortex's can drift a fair way, and have been known to cross parallell runways. They can also cause crashes. They've been known to turn airplanes upside down. They are nothing to screw with. This means that a paralell runway cannot be used for simultaneous operations. One cannot depart or land behind a heavy without a three minute wait... that means if you have two paralell runways you can only land or take off 20 airplanes an hour. Not nearly enough. However, if you have the space to spread your runways out, you can conduct simtaneous operations, doubling, tripling, or more the number of operations you can conduct.

SO why is it Indy's Airport has never had this happen? They have paralell runways and have never had this happen. THey even have planes land within a minute or less of each other.

 

[dburkhead]

SO why is it Indy's Airport has never had this happen? They have paralell runways and have never had this happen. THey even have planes land within a minute or less of each other.

I usually stay out of "conspiracy theory" discussions because, frankly its discussing religion more than anything else, but this is something that I can't let slip.

Issues with wake turbulence are complicated. There are numerous differences between Indianapolis and Denver such that what works for one won't necessarily work for the other. First off, there's the level of traffic. Then there's the wind patterns. Those matter, as do the terrain features around the airport. Then there are the expectations for growth back when the airport was built. They don't build based on what the then-current level of use was, but on what they expected that level to be in the future. Another factor is if one simply has the land available or no.

Let me tell you a little about wake turbulence. There are a number of ways to describe the mechanism by which a wing produces lift. One way is that the pressure on the top of the wing is lower than the pressure on the bottom of the wing. A result of this is that the air from the bottom tries to flow around the end of the wing from the high pressure area to the low pressure are. This produces a vortex, kind of like a sideways tornado trailing behind the airplane. It is this usually invisible vortex, not the contrails or "smoke" you see behind an aircraft that forms the wake turbulence.

This vortex doesn't follow a nice, straight predictable line but tends to drop below the flight path and can also be moved around by winds through the area.

Several things determine how strong the wake turbulence will be, the size and weight of the aircraft, the aspect ratio (the ratio between the span of the wings from tip to tip and the chord, the length from front to back), whether the airplane is flying "clean" (gear up, flaps up, spoilers down) or "dirty" (gear and flaps down, spoilers up), and the angle of attack (generally related to how fast the airplane is going--slower means stronger wake).

When a plane hits wake turbulence, the big effect is changes of angle of attack locally. Angle of attack is the angle of the wing with respect to the air flowing past it, higher angle of attack generally means more lift . . . to a point. Past a certain point you get airflow separation and the wing stalls, losing lift dramatically. During takeoff and landing, aircraft are usually operating close to that critical angle of attack, not right at it of course, because a safety margin is maintained, but wake turbulence under the right (or wrong) conditions can exceed those safety margins and you drop a plane full of people to the ground in an unpleasant manner. More separation of your runways means you can bring aircraft in more quickly without running into dangerous wake turbulence, increasing the amount of traffic the airport can handle.

Denver is a "hub" airport for Frontier Airlines, Great Lakes Airlines, United Airlines (they break guitars), and a focus city for Southwest Airlines. They are the fifth busiest airport in the world based on aircraft movements with 625,844 "aircraft movements" over the course of the year 2008, that's averaging one take off or landing every fifty seconds for the entire year. Indianapolis doesn't even rate in the top 30. Indianapolis averages 163 flights daily or one every 530 seconds, about a tenth the tempo of Denver.

Comparisons of what works for Indianapolis and what works for Denver simply don't add up.

 

[SavageEagle]

OK well I see your point on all this. Again, I claimed to not be an aerospace engineer. I knew about lift, drag, etc, but I'm now more educated on wake turbulence. Thank you.

I can still think of many more layouts for the airport other than a swastika. Does this still not make you scratch your head? Was the swastika pattern really the ONLY choice they had?

In our society, symbols like this and many others, people have gone to great lengths to avoid such symbols. So why on earth would they design the 5th largest airport with such a design? Surely there were more economical ways to design an airport.

All this is really just a small piece of the puzzle anyway. It's just a place. There are a great many other things to worry about than just this. And again I don't expect most people to see the significance here.

 

[bulldog]

Conspiracies do exist .They happen all the time in the business world, but for some reason governments must somehow be immune to these same forces.I have a friend who was a 32d degree freemason that was saved by the grace of GOD.that conveyed to me he thought they worshipped the devil.He subsequently resigned his affiliation with them. I have read several books on the topic of freemasonry and this seems to be the case.Only the three highest levels are aware of this as fact. AN excellent video series expounding on this is available on amazing discoveries.com.It is a lecture series titled Total Onslaught presented by Walter Veighth. I highly recommend it. The series covers this topic as well as others and is very informative.

 

[vxtip]

do the masons go around secretly building things or something

 

[Bigum1969]

Checking back into this thread...

SE, the amount of space was used for the airport to clearly separate all the runways so that several runways could be used in bad weather The runways also have to be exceptionally long because the altitude requires planes to need longer runways to obtain adequate lift for takeoff. In the summer, this is especially magnified.

Yes, I have ridden on the trains at DIA. No conspiracy there.

They also needed to create a huge land buffer when designing the new airport. There are several communities that have sound monitors to measure airline noise. If it gets past a certain level, the airport gets fined. This was part of the negotiation to build the airport.

Believe me, places like Chicago wish they had the land to spread out multiple runways for bad weather and airline traffic.

BTW, I've probably flown in and out of Denver 50 times.

 

[SavageEagle]

Checking back into this thread...

SE, the amount of space was used for the airport to clearly separate all the runways so that several runways could be used in bad weather The runways also have to be exceptionally long because the altitude requires planes to need longer runways to obtain adequate lift for takeoff. In the summer, this is especially magnified.

Yes, I have ridden on the trains at DIA. No conspiracy there.

They also needed to create a huge land buffer when designing the new airport. There are several communities that have sound monitors to measure airline noise. If it gets past a certain level, the airport gets fined. This was part of the negotiation to build the airport.

Believe me, places like Chicago wish they had the land to spread out multiple runways for bad weather and airline traffic.

BTW, I've probably flown in and out of Denver 50 times.

How many stories down is the trains? At least 2 I'm sure.