CIVIL RELIGIOUS DISCUSSION: All things Islam...

[IndyDave1776]

Ah, I've sen you've cranked up your diesel powered laptop (used by all Orthodox online). Hey, if you are a fan of the game you'd have to like that comeback. I still admire the Colts' comeback the year they won....this year at 28-3 I started responding to texts from the midwest with ""they have then right where they want them"
Agree on the fluff part. As for the meat, lent is over . I don't go as much as I used to but was an alterboy. so I've got points saved up!
Now let's go see if we can get some sweets from BBI. I want the rolled up baklava type thing and I'm hoping he has some of that pizza shaped spongecake thing with the red syrup and cheese. (Kaftka?)
And to be on topic a bit.....I recall a few coworkers who did struggle with the cigarette thing during Ramadan. Food, water didn't seem to be a big issue, but Marlboro's.....

You must be the Orthodox parallel to a Mennonite, otherwise you would be using kerosene.

 

[jamil]

Just came across this thread.

 

[ATM]

I'd like to discuss Islam more, particularly with Muslims, but I tend to do it interactively or not at all.

 

[foszoe]

I'd like to discuss Islam more, particularly with Muslims, but I tend to do it interactively or not at all.

We could always go to a mosque...

 

[ATM]

We could always go to a mosque...

I would consider any invitation to have this discussion an opportunity.

 

[gunsisgood]

Both sides of this discussion are not being equally represented,
this should help.

[video=youtube_share;LGJKH99Toto]http://youtu.be/LGJKH99Toto[/video]

 

[jamil]

Both sides of this discussion are not being equally represented,
this should help.

[video=youtube_share;LGJKH99Toto]http://youtu.be/LGJKH99Toto[/video]

Oh. So it's kinda like lent?

 

[ATM]

The fictional character known as Allah from this fictional and historically revisionist narrative known as Islam delights in all human suffering, not the least of which, "his" faithful.

Isn't this obvious from all that Mohammed wrote down?

Who really designed it and to what ends? Is there a Muslim courageous enough to reason with me?

 

[Route 45]

Is there a Muslim courageous enough to reason with me?

 

[jamil]

The fictional character known as Allah from this fictional and historically revisionist narrative known as Islam delights in all human suffering, not the least of which, "his" faithful.

Isn't this obvious from all that Mohammed wrote down?

Who really designed it and to what ends? Is there a Muslim courageous enough to reason with me?

Is there any evidence that this is what you're doing?

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Both sides of this discussion are not being equally represented,
this should help.

[video=youtube_share;LGJKH99Toto]http://youtu.be/LGJKH99Toto[/video]

There are people who game the system as far as fasting, or who fast for secular reasons. It's a bit of a stretch to make it seem like that's the goal, but the narrative gets clicks, so it'll continue. If you cheat the fast, you only cheat yourself.

I ate an omelette, yogurt, and toast before sunrise. I did sleep until 1pm, but that's because I worked a double shift yesterday and got off at 5:30 am. My wife made wings and smoothies for last night. I think she's doing stir fry tonight. "Feasting" would be a stretch, just our normal meals but with more water, less tea. In Jordan, I'd probably have more sweets...but that's anytime I'm in Jordan.

There certainly is a temptation to gorge, particularly in the morning. If you learn the lesson of self control or unthinkingly follow the ritual without pondering the meaning and intent is up to the individual.

 

[hog slayer]

Unfortunately, fasting for a chosen deity is usually put out publicly as a cry for pity. I commend you for not doing that. I've also found it rather easy to fast... except coffee. I really struggle with no coffee.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Unfortunately, fasting for a chosen deity is usually put out publicly as a cry for pity. I commend you for not doing that. I've also found it rather easy to fast... except coffee. I really struggle with no coffee.

With Ramadan, I never saw it as a cry for pity. It's definitely a shared social experience, something that you do with your neighbors even if you aren't physically together. It's tough to describe the sense of community you get during Ramadan, at least as I did in Qatar. Fasting at other times is a more private affair. I can't recall if it's specifically stated it should be private or if that's just a notion I've picked up somewhere, but I didn't see anyone making a fuss about it.

The first day is usually cake. Pardon the pun. It gets a bit harder, although honestly it's much easier now that I'm an office drone. My son is successfully fasting for the first time this year. I'm pretty proud of him. I've never pushed him to fast, actually to the point I've never asked him to do so. He sees us do it, and wanted to as well. Last year he couldn't go all day but he did his best. This year he has the self control, which is something all men want to see develop in their children.

I do want to tack on to something I said in the last post. Even a failed fast can teach you something, and even "gaming" can teach you something if you let it. We are all fallible, I know I've got my own hypocrisies and failures (and I'm sure plenty more I'm not even self aware enough to realize in addition to the those).

As the saying goes, we judge ourselves by our intentions, our friends by their actions, and are enemies by their failures. I hope everyone realizes that to judge any religion, or even lack thereof, by the failures and hypocrisies that you'll inevitably find in its adherents will make any group look foolish at best, evil at worst. Religion, at least for me, is an ideal and one I can never obtain. I can only fail in new, and hopefully better, ways. That's the struggle. Not to "win", not to be what you can never be, but to try.

 

[ATM]

Is there any evidence that this is what you're doing?

Yes. When I ask if there is a reasonable way of rectifying what seem to be some serious conflicts and blatant history revision in these writings of Mohammed, it would be reasonable for a person who got past these serious conflicts and adopted those claims themselves as somehow believable to describe how they accomplished such a feat.

If it still doesn't make reasonable sense to them, how and why did they adopt them? Why do they believe such conflicted nonsense? How?

Why even state your beliefs if you can't or won't answer how and why they became your beliefs? That just makes me wonder if they really even qualify as beliefs.

 

[IndyDave1776]

There are people who game the system as far as fasting, or who fast for secular reasons. It's a bit of a stretch to make it seem like that's the goal, but the narrative gets clicks, so it'll continue. If you cheat the fast, you only cheat yourself.

I ate an omelette, yogurt, and toast before sunrise. I did sleep until 1pm, but that's because I worked a double shift yesterday and got off at 5:30 am. My wife made wings and smoothies for last night. I think she's doing stir fry tonight. "Feasting" would be a stretch, just our normal meals but with more water, less tea. In Jordan, I'd probably have more sweets...but that's anytime I'm in Jordan.

There certainly is a temptation to gorge, particularly in the morning. If you learn the lesson of self control or unthinkingly follow the ritual without pondering the meaning and intent is up to the individual.

If you keep up the stories about the sweets, you are going to have me ready to emigrate to Jordan!

 

[printcraft]

Just came across this thread.

It's really not all that exciting.

 

[ATM]

It's really not all that exciting.

It might be more so if we got more Muslims in here that actually believe what they cite.

 

[Route 45]

It's really not all that exciting.

Stop thinking about Nancy Pelosi. Might help.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

It's really not all that exciting.

We could talk about kunafeh....at least IndyDave would be interested.

 

[IndyDave1776]

We could talk about kunafeh....at least IndyDave would be interested.

Proselytizing through sweets! Pretty clever!

I could tell the story of the birth of an addiction as told to me by my grandmother...

At a tender age (not speaking yet) Grandma and Grandpa took me with them when they went out to dinner one evening and they decided that for desert chocolate ice cream should be good for me. Grandma ordered cheesecake with cherry topping. Before it was all said and done, Grandma ended up eating chocolate ice cream and an addiction from which I still suffer was born.