CIVIL RELIGIOUS DISCUSSION: All things Christianity

[GodFearinGunTotin]

I was listening to an apologetics podcast today when I heard this bit:

A question often asked: If God is so good, why doesn't he stop all the evil in the world?
A possible answer: If He did, He might start with me or you.

I've never thought of it like that before...Maybe it's a good thing He doesn't or none of us would have a chance to repent and receive the free gift of grace.

 

[JettaKnight]

I was listening to an apologetics podcast today when I heard this bit:

A question often asked: If God is so good, why doesn't he stop all the evil in the world?
A possible answer: If He did, He might start with me or you.

I've never thought of it like that before...Maybe it's a good thing He doesn't or none of us would have a chance to repent and receive the free gift of grace.

That's one of the most simple, yet brilliant answers I've ever heard.

 

[T.Lex]

That's one of the most simple, yet brilliant answers I've ever heard.

Yeah, but it isn't in haiku. Not sure we can use it.

Sorry.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

Yeah, but it isn't in haiku. Not sure we can use it.

Sorry.

But...I can't speak Japanese so....

 

[foszoe]

God Is Great some say
so why does evil exist?
So Good can shine forth

 

[ATM]

God Is Great some say
so why does evil exist?
So Good can shine forth

God is light some say.
So why do shadows exist?
Something's in the way.

 

[DragonGunner]

[h=1]Psalms 91:1[/h]

“He that dwelleth in the secret place of the most High shall abide under the shadow of the Almighty.”
​

 

[Jludo]

I was listening to an apologetics podcast today when I heard this bit:

A question often asked: If God is so good, why doesn't he stop all the evil in the world?
A possible answer: If He did, He might start with me or you.

I've never thought of it like that before...Maybe it's a good thing He doesn't or none of us would have a chance to repent and receive the free gift of grace.

Is the answer implying it would be a bad thing if he stopped us from being evil?
If he did there would be nothing to repent for, we wouldn't need a gift of grace.

 

[Lelliott8]

But God is all that is good, and therefore gives us the freedom to choose. Wouldn't a god that negated free-will be less than the greatest good? It glorifies Him when we CHOOSE to turn away from evil.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

Is the answer implying it would be a bad thing if he stopped us from being evil?
If he did there would be nothing to repent for, we wouldn't need a gift of grace.

He is going to stop us from being evil. Until then, you see, He gives us freedom. But since the fall, since we chose knowledge outside of Him, He gave us what we asked for -- the ability to act on our carnal desires. He doesn't force us to repent. He won't force us to accept the free offer of grace that created the means to be with Him. He loves you too much to force you to do something you don't want to. God really is the first libertarian.

 

[ATM]

... God really is the first libertarian.

And the last.

Choices.

Consequences.

 

[Jludo]

He is going to stop us from being evil. Until then, you see, He gives us freedom. But since the fall, since we chose knowledge outside of Him, He gave us what we asked for -- the ability to act on our carnal desires. He doesn't force us to repent. He won't force us to accept the free offer of grace that created the means to be with Him. He loves you too much to force you to do something you don't want to. God really is the first libertarian.

We asked for that? Did we knowingly choose evil over good before we knew such a distinction exists? Eve simply disobeyed without knowledge, she didn't chose 'carnal desires'
It's odd to me that as humans we are selectively responsible for the sins of our fathers.

 

[ATM]

We asked for that? Did we knowingly choose evil over good before we knew such a distinction exists? Eve simply disobeyed without knowledge, she didn't chose 'carnal desires'
It's odd to me that as humans we are selectively responsible for the sins of our fathers.

Adam and Eve were duped into making a poor choice. That choice had consequences.

Nothing odd about it.

 

[foszoe]

Is the answer implying it would be a bad thing if he stopped us from being evil?
If he did there would be nothing to repent for, we wouldn't need a gift of grace.

Doing or Being
A difference there is in these
Human being good!

 

[indiucky]

Is the answer implying it would be a bad thing if he stopped us from being evil?
If he did there would be nothing to repent for, we wouldn't need a gift of grace.

You are really opening your mind up to this jludo...You are asking good and thoughtful questions....It's been a joy to watch your evolution and to see you putting your curious nature to the idea of something bigger than ourselves...

I wish you well in your endeavor and search for the Truth.....

[video=youtube;IJffBsSg1kU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IJffBsSg1kU[/video]

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

We asked for that? Did we knowingly choose evil over good before we knew such a distinction exists? Eve simply disobeyed without knowledge, she didn't chose 'carnal desires'
It's odd to me that as humans we are selectively responsible for the sins of our fathers.

You have the choice now. Would you rather do what you think is OK and follow your own moral code or would you surrender it all to follow Jesus? That would require you to deny yourself, deny your desires for worldly things and desire what God has to offer. You can escape the sins of your fathers, if you made the decision. But God won't make you. He loves you too much to force you.

 

[DragonGunner]

We asked for that? Did we knowingly choose evil over good before we knew such a distinction exists? Eve simply disobeyed without knowledge, she didn't chose 'carnal desires'
It's odd to me that as humans we are selectively responsible for the sins of our fathers.

How do you know she didn't choose it….? And she did have the knowledge just like Adam…God had told them not to eat of that tree, that if they did they would die, so they both had that knowledge. And the Bible says God no longer hold the sins of the fathers against us. Take that away and try your life in its full length and don't sin once…my guess you will fail as well as myself and everyone….Jesus said something that only if a man could live his entire life without sin could he be justified…thankfully I'll fall upon grace.

 

[foszoe]

After we finish up our current church sermon series on the Reformation, we'll be starting on Romans.

It will probably take about 18 months or more. I think Foszoe would go crazy - no special holidays, no scheduled feasts, no liturgical readings, no "this time of year, we read ...". Nope, every week it's Romans.

Nah I wouldn't go crazy.

We consider all services to be worship services not places for Bible study though. Orthodox have Bible Studies outside the worship service. They usually take quite a while. One that I listen to just started the Gospel According To Luke. He is a parish priest and started Matthew in 2007 and finished up in 2012. He then started Mark and finished up in November of 2016. He is starting Luke this month. There are others I listen to or watch that take less, but you think I can be long winded?

Heh.

Anyway, what made me come back to this post was listening to his first podcast on Luke. While listening to a whole hour of an Orthodox bible study might drive several here nuts, I did find his first 13-15 minutes or so to be very informative for my Catholic and Protestant friends for it shows how Orthodox approach interpreting the Bible and I thought you may find listening to that first segment interesting,

Transforming Our Lives in Christ - AFR Popup Player

 

[historian]

A good listen for people:

Classic - Key Differences Between Protestantism and Roman Catholicism - Michael J. Svigel, Darrell L. Bock, and J. Scott Horrell

 

[foszoe]

A good listen for people:

Classic - Key Differences Between Protestantism and Roman Catholicism - Michael J. Svigel, Darrell L. Bock, and J. Scott Horrell

I listened to this podcast today and thought I would make a couple of comments. Perhaps T Lex or another resident Catholic can correct comment on mine J



The first commentary I ever bought was the Bible Knowledge commentary, mostly because it was the cheapest and I was a teenager working at McDonalds at the time. It is a Dallas Theological Seminary publication.



Saints as overflowing with grace as the reason for a treasury of merits is a correct Catholic concept as I understand it, but it was worded oddly, like it quantified grace. If so I would say this is an error that arises from viewing grace as a created thing and divides grace into different kinds. I believe Protestants also fall into the latter error. While they do not have a treasury of merits, they too, tend to view grace as a created thing and as such can be subject to taxonomy. In Orthodoxy Grace is considered uncreated and is the energy of God in the essence and energy distinction that Orthodoxy makes but the West mostly denies.



The Point about Baptism and Confirmation as checkboxes that mean you are okay mostly for the rest of your life although you may go to purgatory were overgeneralizations I believe, but as an Orthodox i see that and the Predestination doctrine of eternal security as really two sides of the same coin. The Protestant will say that the difference is on has to have a personal saving faith, but that’s why Catholics have confirmation at an “age of assent”. Besides your sins can be forgiven by the faith of others according to the bible so the Catholic Parents faith could be salvific.



The Septuagint vs the Hebrew Bible left out some detail. Mostly that the Septuagint was the Bible used by the Jews in the Synagogue or the place of worship by the Hellenistic Jews which were more wide spread than the Hebrew speaking Jews. It was accepted by rabbinical teachers and is the most quoted in the Greek NT. Orthodox do not determine canonicity by the language, but we do have as a main criteria was the Bible used in Worship? The answer to that question is yes and continued to be so for 5 centuries of Christendom. In adopting the Masoretic Text, the Protestants followed in the footsteps of the Jews not the Christians.



They make a point that Catholics added and continue to add to doctrine, a concept that is called doctrinal development. Again as an outsider looking in, I would say the Protestants subtracted from the faith during the Reformation and then began to add things themselves to the point that they fragmented so much they now need to say things like In essentials, unity but in all else liberty. I find that statement sorely lacking and I a very difficult time understanding that in light of 1 Corinthians Chapters 12 and 13 along with Peter, Jude, and Johns epistles. Orthodox could say the same statement but it would be understood very differently. When they say certain texts support Purgatory IF one presumes it then goes looking, I would say Protestants follow the same path with the “Invisible Church” doctrine.



Finally as to source of authority. For the Catholic, it is the Pope. For the Protestant it’s the Bible but what that really means is it’s the individual Protestant’s interpretation of the Bible. There is no other way to explain cohesively why the Protestant church continues to fragment to this day.







In the Same vein, I offer up these 4 podcasts, pick and choose or listen to them all. I don’t usually expect anyone to take the time to listen, but if you do, I hope you also take the time to comment.



The first two deal with the 5 Solas, together they are the same length as the podcast you posted.



Sola Scripture



http://www.ancientfaith.com/podcasts/podup/orthodoxyheterodoxy/the_magisterial_reformation_1a 26 min long



Sola Fide, Solus Christus, Sola Gratia, and Soli Deo Gloria



http://www.ancientfaith.com/podcasts/podup/orthodoxyheterodoxy/the_magisterial_reformation_part_1b 20 min long



These next 2 deal with specific groups from the magisterial reformation



Lutheranism and Calvinism



http://www.ancientfaith.com/podcasts/podup/orthodoxyheterodoxy/the_magisterial_reformation_part_2a 25 min long



Zwinglianism, Presbyterianism, Anglicanism, Methodism:



http://www.ancientfaith.com/podcasts/podup/orthodoxyheterodoxy/the_magisterial_reformation_part_2b 25 min long