Active shooter situation at school in Parkland, FL; reports of victims

[d.kaufman]

I asked because you really can't lock kids "in" a school. You can lock people out, but not in.

They do it all the time. Whenever theres a threat. Did it in portage the other day.

 

[jamil]

I don't have to think anything through. People are continually told by the authorities to see something, say something. That's exactly what has been done here.

The threat was common knowledge to everyone. Online, social media, in person to classmates, school officials, doctors/institutions, Fed and local LEO.

There was plenty of investigation and follow up to be done by all of the authorities involved, without rights violations. Nothing was done by any of them.

The authorities dropped the ball here on many obvious levels.
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Really? So no need to think it through at all? I dunno. Why not? What do you have to lose but a little time? The inputs you used in your heuristic approach seem to ignore some important questions that if thought through, might lead to a more accurate conclusion.

What investigative and followup balls were dropped?

Let's say they followed all the procedures and followups. What actions could authorities have legally taken that would have prevented the shooting?

Can they legally go in and take all his guns away with all the evidence available to them?

Could they have arrested him? On what charge?

If not that, could they have detained him? If so, under what law? And for how long?

If not that, could they have forced him to undergo a psychological evaluation? He already had at least one, and they let him go.

If not that, could they put him under 24/7 surveillance? If so, how many days or decades can they do that for everyone they have to investigate?

So. Without thinking any of that through, tell me all the legal things they should have done and didn't, which would have lead to the shooting not happening?

If you already know the answers to all those questions; the relevant laws, the policies, the procedures, and can readily identify the points of culpability, then maybe a heuristic approach can bypass thinking it through. And I'm not saying you're not right. I am saying that short of all that, a SWAG may get you a quicker answer, but it's not as reliable as thinking it through.

 

[Kutnupe14]

They do it all the time. Whenever theres a threat. Did it in portage the other day.

Let me get this straight, if there's a threat at a school, the school locks the kids "IN" the school, meaning that they don't have the ability to leave? Am I the only one who sees the folly in this?

 

[jamil]

Can’t remember where I heard it, maybe ABC. They were interviewing a Florida child about gun control and talking about how we need to listen to the children because, “Adults are controlled by money, and teens are controlled by feelings.” I totally made the Jackie Chan meme face.

Let’s interview kids while mom is getting an ultrasound and see if they think it’s Ok to have their sibling killed before he’s born.

I saw a CNN tweet (yes I follow the enemy's twitter) where they basically said that these 16 year old students protesting for gun control are showing enough adult maturity that they should be able to vote.

Of course it didn't take twitter long to counter with the implications of lowering the voting age to those who participated in the Tide-pod challenges.

 

[ghitch75]

I asked because you really can't lock kids "in" a school. You can lock people out, but not in.

there are a lot of schools with "lock door policies"

 

[jamil]

I agree, but there is a difference. The storming beaches to snowflakes ratio was quite a bit more skewed toward beaches. Now we say "I support the military" because of some vague fear we will appear to be as evil as our parents were during Vietnam. Then everyone supported the military because the military was your family.

Not being argumentative, or contradicting you. Just pointing out the differences.

It does seem that a lot of people feel obligated to thank servicemen for their service, almost more out of it being a social necessity than actually being thankful that the person served.

 

[Kutnupe14]

there are a lot of schools with "lock door policies"

That just seems like a disaster waiting to happen.

 

[ghitch75]

I saw a CNN tweet (yes I follow the enemy's twitter) where they basically said that these 16 year old students protesting for gun control are showing enough adult maturity that they should be able to vote.

Of course it didn't take twitter long to counter with the implications of lowering the voting age to those who participated in the Tide-pod challenges.

must be dems tweeting for more voters....

 

[jamil]

When people advocate mandatory military service they generally do so without understanding todays military. It is a technological service now, cannon fodder need not apply. They also do so without understanding that over 75% of America's 18-24yr olds are unfit for military service. Over 30% are medically unqualified, about a quarter are physically unqualified, 20% are educationally unfit and 10% have disqualifying criminal records. Some of those overlap but it's a significant number.

The military does not have the time or resources to be the nations fitness instructor/parents/psych wards or prison. Especially if at some point you want it to, you know, fight a war.

I read that the couple that took the shooter in when his mom died said that he had no idea how to function as an adult. They had to teach him everything, and helped him get a job. It seemed to them that he was making progress in putting his life together. They said he talked about joining the Army and had talked with recruiters. Jeez. I dunno. Maybe the military could have straightened him out, but this kid didn't know anything about how to do basic things for himself. I just kinda doubt he'd have made it.

 

[Woobie]

It does seem that a lot of people feel obligated to thank servicemen for their service, almost more out of it being a social necessity than actually being thankful that the person served.

There's a really funny bit on Curb Your Enthusiasm about this. Larry David is at a party and one of the guests is a young veteran. Larry doesn't thank him for his service, which everyone else has gone out of their way to do, and everyone is appalled. The veteran gets butt hurt and leaves, and it's a huge mess. It's a pretty good piece of satire. I'm glad the pendulum has swung this way as opposed to the Vietnam era, but it has gotten out of hand a little bit.

 

[Woobie]

I read that the couple that took the shooter in when his mom died said that he had no idea how to function as an adult. They had to teach him everything, and helped him get a job. It seemed to them that he was making progress in putting his life together. They said he talked about joining the Army and had talked with recruiters. Jeez. I dunno. Maybe the military could have straightened him out, but this kid didn't know anything about how to do basic things for himself. I just kinda doubt he'd have made it.

He probably wouldn't have passed the psych stuff at MEPS. Although it is possible. But the Army isn't a halfway house. Taxpayers don't need to be paying for crappy soldiers, and good soldiers don't need to be getting killed or seeing the mission suffer over getting stuck with someone like that.

 

[jamil]

These kids are being led around and orchestrated by anti-gun liberals. That needs to be exposed vs letting them get away with the "wholesome" appearance they are seeking to achieve from these mature speaking youths with no pimples.

I think it's partly that, but it's not all that. I think once people get themselves indoctrinated they just run the same ideological subroutines.

 

[bwframe]

Who is paying for these buses?

Who is paying for these buses?

These kids are being led around and orchestrated by anti-gun liberals. That needs to be exposed vs letting them get away with the "wholesome" appearance they are seeking to achieve from these mature speaking youths with no pimples.

This guy's one of those leading these gullible kids around. He won't shut up...:

 

[jamil]

must be dems tweeting for more voters....

That was my first thought: Age gerrymandering. Great way to turn some red states purple and purple states blue.

 

[ChristianPatriot]

I saw a CNN tweet (yes I follow the enemy's twitter) where they basically said that these 16 year old students protesting for gun control are showing enough adult maturity that they should be able to vote.

Of course it didn't take twitter long to counter with the implications of lowering the voting age to those who participated in the Tide-pod challenges.

Makes sense. Country seems to be run by children anyway.

 

[HoughMade]

That just seems like a disaster waiting to happen.

Joe Clark got in trouble for it in “Lean on Me”

 

[Hookeye]

Jackson Local Schools on lockdown after seventh grader shoots self on campus, reports say | cleveland.com

Cleveland 7th grader, proly 21 and bought the handgun himself.

 

[ghitch75]

Cleveland 7th grader, proly 21 and bought the handgun himself.

i about blew water out my nose....

 

[MCgrease08]

there are a lot of schools with "lock door policies"

That just seems like a disaster waiting to happen.

Joe Clark got in trouble for it in “Lean on Me”

A school lockdown is designed to keep people from coming in and usually involves keeping students in classrooms for a specified time.

It does not mean locking exit doors from the inside preventing students from getting out. That would be a safety hazard. Think what would happen if there were a fire and hundreds or even thousands of students had no way to exit the building.

That's why exit doors meant for egress come equipt with these.

This Von Duprin model is made right here in Indianapolis.

 

[BigBoxaJunk]

This Von Duprin model is made right here in Indianapolis.

So..........Von Duprin........door hardware maker.......NOT a German Techno-Pop group.


But a kindof interesting note about Von Duprin, the first complany to manufacture the familiar "panic bar" instant egress door latches that are so ubiquitous in public buildings: The idea was conceived by Carl Prinzler, after the Iroquois Theater Fire, in Chicago (a show that Prinzler planned to attend, but wasn't able to). He enlisted the help of an engineer, Henry H. Dupont, and when the product was developed, it was marketed by Vonnegut Hardware (owned by Kurt Vonnegut's great uncle).

Von Duprin is a combination of the three names, Vonnegut, Dupont, Prinzler.