Active shooter at Mandalay Bay in Las Vegas...

[Hawkeye]

Yes, Brokaw. He said he has a closet full in Montana, "but "citizens" shouldn't have these kind of weapons, blah, blah, blah".

Any links to TB saying he has "a closet full in Montana"?

 

[jagee]

Usually, terrorism includes a political component. The terrorist wants to achieve some political aim and uses violence to achieve it.

Without the political component, it is basically just a crime. A really big, really bad crime.

I'm not Merriam or Webster, but to me, jagee, this is terrorism. Political agenda aside. Something was done to cause terror in the people. Terrorism.

Maybe I'm just too simple minded for the term.

 

[jamil]

CNN just reported suspect as a "64 year old white man".......does the color of his skin really matter? Oh that's right....they have an agenda.

When the shooter was black, they gave his race. It's part of the description as much as his age is. People want to know, so they report it. Sure, some people will infer some things about race and make a big deal of it.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

I'll urge caution about taking any early accounts as gospel. In the rush to be first, it's easy to run with rumors and then, when the rumors are proven false, claim that there is a cover-up.

This is how we end up with semi-intelligent people listening to claims that Sandy Hook never happened.

As for the "machine gun" vs. "semi auto" thing....there's common parlance, then there are legal definitions. When we're talking about some sort of "assist" that allows near full-auto rates of fire, I'll forgive a non-enthusiast for calling it "machine gun" fire.

 

[KittySlayer]

Was there an announcement to flee over speakers?

Does someone have to tell people what to do ALL the time instead of expecting them to make decisions for themselves?

• Put your phone down and start thinking and being situationally aware, especially if you hear gunfire.
• If you hear gunshots start making some decisions to protect your life and those you love.
  • Run
  • Hide
  • Fight
  • Wait for an announcement
• Know the difference between concealment and cover.
• Don't wear flip flops when attending events with large crowds.
• Strip off your shirt and apply pressure to bleeding wounds (some concert goers took action and did that).

 

[DoggyDaddy]

Any links to TB saying he has "a closet full in Montana"?

No link, but I heard him say it this morning as a part of the "breaking news" coverage on what would normally be the Today Show.

 

[Sylvain]

It is terrorism. It may not be radical Islamic/White Supremacist/ATIFA/Etc., but it IS terrorism. Violence was used to cause mass chaos and terror. Any motive beyond that doesn't really matter at this point. It will be investigated to hopefully prevent future incidents, but I'd still call this terrorism.

From what I understand if there's no political motive it's not terrorism.
Similar shootings are often just considered "mass shootings" and not terrorism, just like the 2012 Aurora shooting.

The result is the same for the victims though.

 

[jsharmon7]

The one thing that this event keeps driving home for me is that I REALLY need to get some medical training, specifically training dealing with penetrating wounds (e.g. gunshots, stabbings, etc). Carrying a small medical kit on me at all times would be super useful.

I've considered this, but seriously doubt I'd carry even a small medical kit to a concert. I think a better solution is to get some tactical trauma training and start thinking of ways to improvise the tools you'd need in such a situation. Even if you carried a tourniquet you're only going to treat one wound on yourself or another. I think software is key in these situations.

 

[Hawkeye]

No link, but I heard him say it this morning as a part of the "breaking news" coverage on what would normally be the Today Show.

OK. Ill look for one then. Maybe you can too.

 

[jamil]

I'm not Merriam or Webster, but to me, jagee, this is terrorism. Political agenda aside. Something was done to cause terror in the people. Terrorism.

Maybe I'm just too simple minded for the term.

I don't think we know enough about the motives to say what it is yet.

 

[Bigtanker]

I'm reading chatter the the shooter was a felon. Any official word on his past yet?

 

[GIJEW]

I'm sorry, man, but I'm not tracking you. Even though I want to.

Yes, the media often gets wrong the difference between semi-auto and full-auto. In this incident, I haven't heard them say conclusively semi-auto or full-auto, at least not in print/internet articles. For instance, the BBC is using the phrase "appeared to be prolonged automatic gunfire." I agree with that. It does appear from the videos to be that. It may not be (bumpfire, gat-clack doohickey, really fast trigger finger). But, the reporting appears on point.

If the goal is to crucify they media for past mistakes, that's cool. But this - right now- does not appear to be incorrect reporting.

I was responding to a post by 'dogdaddy' (#88) about tom blow-chow going on a rant about civilians not needing military grade weapons. I wasn't speaking to reporting on this case in general. Having said that, the reason I said the media doesn't deserve a break for equating semi-auto and full-auto, is because it's not just sloppy journalism. The media and the rest of the anti gun lobby, have been working that lie for over 25 years. Deliberate disinformation is propaganda, not a mistake.

 

[KLB]

I'm reading chatter the the shooter was a felon. Any official word on his past yet?

Report I heard this morning on the radio said he had no previous contact with law enforcement.

 

[ArcadiaGP]

Report I heard this morning on the radio said he had no previous contact with law enforcement.

"Known to law enforcement" is the last I saw.

Edit: ISIS now trying to claim responsibility. Please treat this as probable nonsense.

****ers would claim hurricanes if they could.

 

[Sylvain]

I'm not Merriam or Webster, but to me, jagee, this is terrorism. Political agenda aside. Something was done to cause terror in the people. Terrorism.

Maybe I'm just too simple minded for the term.

Without a political reason it's just a large scale murder.The number of victims is irrelevant to have it classified as terrorism.
Same way a terrorist attack can have no victim at all.

Murders can still terrorize people especially when you have lots of victims or when it happens really close to where you live.

 

[Beowulf]

Prayers to all involved
The only way to counter fire like that is suppressive fire. ID source of fire lay suppressive fire then have Designated Marksman or Sniper if you have one available engage or engage with guns M2,M240.

From sound clips I think it sounds like an RPK to me I have the unfortunate experience of being on the receiving end of them several times RPK's have a slow rate of fire. It would explain the casualties by using "grazing fire" the cone of fire would just about perfect from that angle. Most bullets would have impacted at 2 meters height or less.

I didn't intend this to sound cold.

Great job by LEO how they I'd the room so quick is amazing.

It definitely doesn't sound like an M16 (I have enough trigger time on one that I'm pretty sure about this). The rate of fire is too slow, so even if it was a homemade conversion on an AR-15, I don't think it would sound like that. The slower rater of fire sounds a lot more like an eastern block weapon or some of slower firing belt fed .30 cal guns out there (like an M60 or an MG08 maybe... which I would be immensely astounded to find this shooter was using).

So, I agree with you. I'm betting on an AK variant of some sort with a bump fire system.

 

[patience0830]

BBC reporting that there were an estimated 22,000 in attendance at the festival.

Wonder what kind of security Lollapalooza will have next year.

Hey Phylodog! What's it cost to position 8 trained snipers at every crowd event in the country? Assuming we can find that many.

 

[snorko]

Just confirmed my business partner who was in LV flew out Sunday afternoon. Thank God.

 

[HoughMade]

...Edit: ISIS now trying to claim responsibility. Please treat this as probable nonsense...

No, Seriously, JoAnna Cameron may​ be involved. Unconfirmed:

 

[Denny347]

Angry, white, gun toting, Bible thumper........who was most likely a Trump supporter.

"NOT BLM? check!; NOT the pakastani/ISIS couple from the SanBernadino massacre? check!...64y.o. white man...yeah that sounds like some NRA guy! make sure that gets on the air"

Now I haven't heard any of that being reported by the media unless I missed it. So far I have not seen a push to lean one way or another. I see that the media reporting he is a 64yr old W/M is a trigger for some to apply their own biases to it. Would you have me believe that if such an awful tragedy like Las Vegas was perpetrated by a hispanic, black, Asian, Male that the news would have left that out? No way. The public will clamor for every detail available about the shooter...race/sex being the most obvious.