A bad thing happened in INDY!

[Suprtek]

That's what I was wondering about. Didn't know they were made so early. I'm not loaded so I'll never see one.
obviously SUPRTEK I know I could become a dealer but who wants thuglets coming to their home to shoot them for their guns? Not me

I have the same options as you. It's only a dream for me too.

 

[Hoosierdood]

Most importantly, are you continuing to store your weapon this way after already once having had such weapons stolen out of your unattended vehicle at night?

THIS^^^^^

Good grief, this is the SECOND TIME! I remember when I had my car broken in to back in college, I was devastated. I never left my car unlocked after that. I still lock my car all the time and it's been over 15 years.

Point is... When something bad happens, you learn from it and change in hopes of preventing it from happening again.

 

[irishfan]

As I said before the thieves are criminals and should be punished. However, the thought that anyone here is actually defending the leaving of several weapons regardless of NFA or not in an unprotected environment is ludicrous. Not only does it make all of the pro gun community look bad to those on the fence or already against us but think what will happen if one of these is used in a crime. It WILL make national media and we all will pay a price eventually as we have an administration that is only one step away from trying to strip our second amendment rights as it is. There is no defense for what Profire did in this case as much as some of you want to try to stand up for them. This was plain ignorant

 

[jblomenberg16]

As I said before the thieves are criminals and should be punished. However, the thought that anyone here is actually defending the leaving of several weapons regardless of NFA or not in an unprotected environment is ludicrous. Not only does it make all of the pro gun community look bad to those on the fence or already against us but think what will happen if one of these is used in a crime. It WILL make national media and we all will pay a price eventually as we have an administration that is only one step away from trying to strip our second amendment rights as it is. There is no defense for what Profire did in this case as much as some of you want to try to stand up for them. This was plain ignorant

Or maybe Profire was in cahoots with the BATFE and this was Fast and Furious 2...Indy 500?

 

[Indyvet]

These were MILITARY GRADE weapons, there are good reasons that us law abiding citizens cant have them and this situation is exactly why. I dont leave my pistol unattended any where, its part of being a RESPONSIBLE gun owner! Oh but its ok to leave a trailer full of MILITARY GRADE WEAPONS unattended, right? The owner made a dumba** mistake and now there are MILITARY GRADE WEAPONS on our streets. I believe that meets the criteria for Criminal Negligence.

I usually don't comment on stuff like this but this had me rolling with laughter. I love when a keyboard ninja comments on something that they are clueless about. Did this strike a nerve that you have been on here since April of 13 and have 11 posts and suddenly comment? Lurk much? I don't even have the words as I am still laughing. Is Chris Dun actually Bloomturd in waiting? If you are an actual gun owner and believe in the constitution then educate yourself and then comment. As for me I will continue to sell guns to the law abiding public. i will also support Profire. I do not for a second believe that Andrew or his staff did anything on purpose. Brain fart? Maybe? Stuff happens. We live and learn. I hope they recover the weapons(which they have recovered some already)
and at the end of the day it's a lesson learned and we all continue to support our constitutional right to bear arms and support local shops that provide the firearms we are able to own. In the mean time I will continue to laugh at this particular post.

 

[TheRude1]

This was a setup insurance job
Time will tell

 

[Trigger Time]

If memory serves, there are ATF regs for SOT3's on storage and security. I am skeptical that storing them unattended in a light trailer overnight complies with them, but who knows.

The locked truck to this an apples to oranges comparison. For one, does your truck have the logo of a firearms company posted on it? Do you load it with firearms in the view of the public? Do you drive it around to firearm events promoting your company with it? Do you unload firearms from it in the view of the public? Is a handgun comparable to a beltfed light machinegun?

Most importantly, are you continuing to store your weapon this way after already once having had such weapons stolen out of your unattended vehicle at night?

and he's posted on ingo before about the trailer being all loaded up the night before an event. So basically they laid out breadcrumbs for the thieves.

 

[dusty88]

Whether you are Chris the troll or a much more thoughtful person, please be careful how you use words like "reasonable", "should", "ridiculous", etc in terms of potential security for this inventory. Those are the words that lead to some person smarter than the rest of us (politician, bureaucrat) turning the subjective (reasonable) into a regulation.

I'd treat that level of inventory differently than this example. However, there was a time and place where leaving my front door unlocked was "reasonable".

Some of you say you "never" leave your firearm. How about when I carry my firearm, including to my place of business, and then have to pick my kids up (have to go inside the school to sign them out in some cases). Then I either leave the firearm in the car, or I risk being a felon. Either way I risk being "stupid" it's just a question of whether I risk a felony conviction or a lawyer holding me accountable for what a criminal does if he manages to steal my gun.

Life is about risk and rewards. For me, a >$200K inventory would have a different level of protection than what is implied here. But there is no clear perfect line. When you start asking for them, you get written government regulations that often end up being WEAKER and MORE EXPENSIVE than what you would do if you had your own choices.

Remember, plenty of people think you are "stupid" and especially "paranoid" to carry a firearm. And honestly, at most places in this country, your chances of actually needing that firearm are pretty small. If you start to decide what is "reasonable" you might find your own position weakened. We choose to be armed because WE feel it's worth the effort, not because it makes sense to everybody.

I don't know why the decision was made to keep equipment in the trailer, but I also don't know how many hours it takes to get it ready or how much help they had. I also don't know if the crooks were fully prepared to break in the store.

 

[nra4ever]

My vote is for the side of "Chris the troll" sorry for the name Chris. It comes down to profire F uped for the second time. They have put at risk the safety of our law enforcement officers the citizens of Indianapolis and my second AM rights in jeopardy. That FFL needs to be pulled end of story. Since profire was unable to learn from their mistakes maybe others will by the example made of them.

 

[dusty88]

I don't want to contradict those here more experienced with criminals (esp the LEOs), but I don't feel overwhelming concern about these weapons getting in the hands of thugs. There is a reason most gun crimes are committed with handguns, not rifles. And machine guns? the legality isn't the only reason they aren't used in crimes. I'll admit I'm not experienced with them but I can sure see how you use up ammo before you get much done. I've also heard they are quite heavy, especially if you want to bring more ammo. If automatic weapons were so useful in crimes, they'd be converting AKs or smuggling in more automatics.

I'm not saying it's not a big deal... but I don't see the thugs pulling off more death and destruction than they do with their other methods.

In any case, I do hope these guns haven't yet been distributed on the street.

 

[Trigger Time]

One things for sure. These thieves are SCREWED!! They won't ever see the light of a free day again after they get sentenced. They stole the wrong merchandise this time.

 

[Indyvet]

This was a setup insurance job
Time will tell

Really???? and your evidence is……………… Speculation?

 

[Dirtebiker]

Really???? and your evidence is……………… Speculation?

Maybe he's a psychic (sp?)!?

 

[Robjps]

I don't want to contradict those here more experienced with criminals (esp the LEOs), but I don't feel overwhelming concern about these weapons getting in the hands of thugs. There is a reason most gun crimes are committed with handguns, not rifles. And machine guns? the legality isn't the only reason they aren't used in crimes. I'll admit I'm not experienced with them but I can sure see how you use up ammo before you get much done. I've also heard they are quite heavy, especially if you want to bring more ammo. If automatic weapons were so useful in crimes, they'd be converting AKs or smuggling in more automatics.

I'm not saying it's not a big deal... but I don't see the thugs pulling off more death and destruction than they do with their other methods.

In any case, I do hope these guns haven't yet been distributed on the street.

That's because most criminals want money not to kill people.

People are going ape**** over something that really has no impact.

Firearms are stored and shipped in this manner all over the country. They are even advertised by police cars. If you see a police car odds are there is a long gun inside it. I know for a fact class 3 weapons have been stolen from the police right here in IN. But for some reason no one will respond to that when trying to send Andrew to prison and lose his FFL.

People going on about how this is going to kill so many people and ISIS (lol serious?) could be behind it. You people watch too much TV if you had half a brain you would realize that if their goal was to kill people their is far easier ways to do it. *lets not go into what they are please no reason to* I honestly don't know how you people sleep at night or leave your house you are so afraid of everything while ignorant to how petty what you are worried about is.

 

[Ricnzak]

Incredibly self-righteously indignant statement, IMO... Would you be saying the same thing about other stolen objects potentially used as weapons? Say, a knife (Maybe), baseball bat, (Nope. Not so much), non-NFA firearm? (Big Yes) Maybe even an automobile left outside overnight? Is there blood on my hands if I leave my locked car curbside overnight and someone hot-wires it and kills a family in a head-on crash? (Geez! That one would be for you to decide. Why did you leave the car there in the first place? Were you drinking and left your Benz in the ghetto? Come-on how can you even make that kind of comparison?)

So when cops LOSE fully automatic weapons that were not even stolen, is there blood on their hands too?

YES. Double Yes Even! Holy cow. If a LEO is issued a weapon, it's safe keeping is his/her responsibility and that LEO should face discipline if it is not kept secure. As to what level of discipline... who knows. That could vary from the state officer who left his weapon in the john a year or two ago too the officer who had his trunk broken into and may or may have not been following department procedure.

If a LEO is in the position of inventory control for a department and that person is incompetent in their duties, Yes they should have something happen to them if they are loosing weapons. Duh! Or that person engages in theft of weapons from the department. They would have committed a crime and would be charged once discovered.

In most of the above situations whoever had the control or (custody) of the weapons would indeed have blood on their hands should they be used to injure anyone. How could they not?

Get over yourself.

This site draws trolls and keyboard commandos like iron filings to a magnet.

10ring[/B];Self righteous troll. Back to something other than INGO again

What on earth is with you three? Have you grown up in a world that everyone gets a trophy no matter how bad they screw up? This is serious kids. I chose in life to work as a contractor. I do mainly tenant finish or remodels. Retail & Commercial. If a wall is a inch off or a shade of paint is wrong people don't die. A street thug does not feel emboldened by my paint brush left in the john. I also generally don't have to worry that when I get out of my truck to meet a customer that they are going to jump out with a gun and shoot me.

A LEO has made the conscious decision to take a career that holds them to a level of accountability way above and beyond what most of us face in our life. They have worked hard to be chosen above other candidates to Serve and Protect the public. A FFL has in most cases has worked hard to turn a interest into a business. Then to build that business into a livelihood that supports them. They have asked and paid money for the right to distribute or work-on firearms. Both of these people know that they have chosen a career of rules and regulations that hold them to a higher standard. But unlike my wrong shade of paint their mistakes can get themselves or others killed. They need to held accountable. Does the label "Nice Guy" remove them from accountability?

; First of all, he has broken no laws so the ATF pulling his FFL I ask you really???? Second my point was not that there was no lack of judgment. I am simply stating maybe our brother needs our support not our scrutiny. Do you think Andrew is not running thru whatever errors in judgment where made over and over again in his own head. He has to live with the outcome of this theft for better or worse. My point is he is a fellow member of this community, and I will not sit here and armchair quarterback what happened. I am not without fault I have left my side arm in the center console of the a locked truck, I see that as about the same offense. I did not realize so many here walk on water.

I am not to sure about the ATF laws governing firearm storage. And while I am not trying to hammer on Andrew I am a very matter of fact person. The fact is that this is a major deal. One persons mistake may get someone else killed. God forbid that someone does end up being hurt or killed from this. But if a weapon was stolen from my truck or your console and that weapon was used in the commission of a crime it will be scrutinized that our neglect got a another person injured. The sister of the person hurt would think we are idiots at best in leaving a gun in a car unsecured. The family may try to sue us for neglect or something else crazy if we are not charged in a court of law. They don't care that I'm a nice guy. I made a mistake. That is all that they see. But, I asked for this extra scrutiny when I decided to exercise my 2A Rights. I'm sure you agree that decisions we make have consequences. And sometimes they really suck. The ATF is not going to care about how nice the person was who made decisions that lead to this. They will go through everything about that business with a fine tooth comb. And I wouldn't be surprised if they try to shut him down. That's all I'm trying to say. Nothing I said is not meant to be mean towards any one person.

Kudos for intelligibly expressing a argument. We may not agree but we can be civil to one another.

 

[cbhausen]

...What on earth is with you three? Have you grown up in a world that everyone gets a trophy no matter how bad they screw up?...

Is this how you "intelligibly express an argument"?

You obviously don't know me...

All you people who are making such a fuss over this theft because there are NFA items involved are playing right into the antis hands. When I see you all start going ape**** over other thefts with as potential or potentially deadlier consequences I'll listen to your rantings. One could kill way more people using a stolen car to plow into a crowd than with a full-auto rifle. Cars are "regulated". We need training, licensing, and must show proof of registration and insurance on demand.

Of course, we can all look back with 20/20 hindsight and say "this would not have happened to me". Saying Andrew would have blood on his hands is asinine sensationalism. If I want to hear that kind of bull**** I'll load Moms Demand's web page.

 

[richardraw316]

I read this entire thread, and the one thing that keeps coming up is "secured" how the weapons were kept secured. Where they locked up properly? Well I have to ask, what is properly to you? What makes a weapon secured? I have always believed a lock is there to keep an honest person honest. A criminal does not care about locks. If they want something bad enough they will get it. I don't leave my pistol in my vehicle unless I have to but it's in my vehicle that is secured in my mind. No one has the right to steal from me whether you or anyone feels it was secured properly or not. The criminal is the bad guy here. Not the victim. There is no blood on his hands. He locked his weapons up to keep honest people honest. I guess in this case a criminal wanted it bad enough.

 

[Harleyrider_50]

I read this entire thread, and the one thing that keeps coming up is "secured" how the weapons were kept secured. Where they locked up properly? Well I have to ask, what is properly to you? What makes a weapon secured? I have always believed a lock is there to keep an honest person honest. A criminal does not care about locks. If they want something bad enough they will get it. I don't leave my pistol in my vehicle unless I have to but it's in my vehicle that is secured in my mind. No one has the right to steal from me whether you or anyone feels it was secured properly or not. The criminal is the bad guy here. Not the victim. There is no blood on his hands. He locked his weapons up to keep honest people honest. I guess in this case a criminal wanted it bad enough.

Hi-lited points.....I'll agree.......with 'AT said......in the world o' new'st, late'st an' great'st cordless powertools.....sawzalls, especially...can cut rite thru the side the damn thing...I'da either UN-load'd the trailer......or pull' d the whole damn rig in a secured building........

hell.....I can be in yer house.....if ya ain't home.....an' don't care if it 'brick'd', neither.....with jus' whut tools I own.....rite thru the wall,cut a stud or 2 out'a the way......an' I'm IN......

 

[Robjps]

YES. Double Yes Even! Holy cow. If a LEO is issued a weapon, it's safe keeping is his/her responsibility and that LEO should face discipline if it is not kept secure. As to what level of discipline... who knows. That could vary from the state officer who left his weapon in the john a year or two ago too the officer who had his trunk broken into and may or may have not been following department procedure.

Why would he face discipline for storing his firearms as he's told to and the same way every police officer does in every department lol?

 

[Robjps]

Hi-lited points.....I'll agree.......with 'AT said......in the world o' new'st, late'st an' great'st cordless powertools.....sawzalls, especially...can cut rite thru the side the damn thing...I'da either UN-load'd the trailer......or pull' d the whole damn rig in a secured building........

hell.....I can be in yer house.....if ya ain't home.....an' don't care if it 'brick'd', neither.....with jus' whut tools I own.....rite thru the wall,cut a stud or 2 out'a the way......an' I'm IN......

Yea people don't get the fact that if this was indoors it wouldn't have changed anything. Someone argued with me about the fact they park their trailer with valuables in the garage and he should have. I can open a garage door with my foot. So not sure how that makes it anymore "secure".