17 year old kid shot dead by Neighborhood Watch "Captain"

[hornadylnl]

They still should be permanently retired for their lack of ethical conduct.

But don't the voters want those conviction rates? Some view congresses that don't pass laws aren't doing their jobs. Some view prosecuters who don't get a lot of convictions aren't doing their jobs. Almost every campaign ad I've seen for prosecuters says how tough they will be on crime.

 

[IndyDave1776]

But don't the voters want those conviction rates? Some view congresses that don't pass laws aren't doing their jobs. Some view prosecuters who don't get a lot of convictions aren't doing their jobs. Almost every campaign ad I've seen for prosecuters says how tough they will be on crime.

I see your point, but have noticed that justice is rarely a consideration in the process, and most voters don't realize how precariously close to the edge of our increasingly arbitrary laws, malicious investigations and accusations (especially concerning CPS cases) and prison they truly are. They are still living under the fiction that only 'bad people' are at risk of getting crosswise of 'the law'.

 

[hornadylnl]

I see your point, but have noticed that justice is rarely a consideration in the process, and most voters don't realize how precariously close to the edge of our increasingly arbitrary laws, malicious investigations and accusations (especially concerning CPS cases) and prison they truly are. They are still living under the fiction that only 'bad people' are at risk of getting crosswise of 'the law'.

I fully agree. We regularly see the "if you aren't doing anything thing wrong or don't have anything to hide, you have nothing to worry about" mindset here. I believe in the "it's better 10 guilty men go free than 1 man being wrongfully convicted" mindset.

 

[CarmelHP]

Everybody here knew about the dxm months ago, didn't they? The initial reports said there wasn't anything in his system. Once the thc news came out, they said there wasn't enough in his system to affect him. There still isn't any evidence that backs up Zimmerman's subjective impression.

It doesn't have to, that's why it's subjective. He could only go on what he saw. All that matters is why he believed that M was suspicious, and who escalated this into a physical assault.

 

[hornadylnl]

It doesn't have to, that's why it's subjective. He could only go on what he saw. All that matters is why he believed that M was suspicious, and who escalated this into a physical assault.

If I'm going to get involved in something, there's going to be ample physical evidence to make my case.

 

[CarmelHP]

She does say justice for Trayvon. And I having a hard time understanding how that is out of line.

Of course you don't, you understand little at all.

Rules of Professional Conduct:

Rule 3.6. Trial Publicity
(a) A lawyer who is participating or has participated in the investigation or litigation of a matter shall not make an extrajudicial statement that the lawyer knows or reasonably should know will be disseminated by means of public communication and will have a substantial likelihood of materially prejudicing an adjudicative proceeding in the matter.
.....
(d) A statement referred to in paragraph (a) will be rebuttably presumed to have a substantial likelihood of materially prejudicing an adjudicative proceeding when it refers to that proceeding and the statement is related to:


(4) any opinion as to the guilt or innocence of a defendant or suspect in a criminal case or proceeding that could result in incarceration;

Rule 3.8. Special Responsibilities of a Prosecutor
The prosecutor in a criminal case shall:
(a) refrain from prosecuting a charge that the prosecutor knows is not supported by probable cause;
.....
(d) make timely disclosure to the defense of all evidence or information known to the prosecutor that tends to negate the guilt of the accused or mitigates the offense, and, in connection with sentencing, disclose to the defense and to the tribunal all unprivileged mitigating information known to the prosecutor, except when the prosecutor is relieved of this responsibility by a protective order of the tribunal;
....
(f) except for statements that are necessary to inform the public of the nature and extent of the prosecutor's action and that serve a legitimate law enforcement purpose, refrain from making extrajudicial comments that have a substantial likelihood of heightening public condemnation of the accused and exercise reasonable care to prevent investigators, law enforcement personnel, employees or other persons assisting or associated with the prosecutor in a criminal case from making an extrajudicial statement that the prosecutor would be prohibited from making under Rule 3.6 or this Rule.

 

[CarmelHP]

If I'm going to get involved in something, there's going to be ample physical evidence to make my case.

I doubt that Z could ask M to pee in a bottle and wait on the corner until he could run a test to see if there was any physical evidence to support that M was acting suspiciously. How do you intend to make sure there's "ample physical evidence?"

 

[hornadylnl]

I doubt that Z could ask M to pee in a bottle and wait on the corner until he could run a test to see if there was any physical evidence to support that M was acting suspiciously. He do you intend to make sure there's "ample physical evidence?"

I'm going to stay in the ****ing truck. I'm going to be a good witness and report to 911 what is going on. If life is in danger, I will then intervene. If he's beating on my truck or trying to get to me, I'll drive off. If he produces a gun, I'll shoot.

 

[HARVEYtheDAMNED]

I fully agree. We regularly see the "if you aren't doing anything thing wrong or don't have anything to hide, you have nothing to worry about" mindset here. I believe in the "it's better 10 guilty men go free than 1 man being wrongfully convicted" mindset.

I agree! Most of the people in prison are guilty, but right now there are thousands of innocent in our prison system.

Don't even get me started on arbitrary laws. There's a reason the US imprisons more people per 100,000 than any other country.

 

[griffin]

If the evidence shows him guilty of I law that I feel is unjust or unconstitutional, I will still vote to acquit. Is that not the role of a juror?

Jury nullification. It's a wonderful thing. The judge and prosecutor might feel differently, but tough.

How many here just new Martin went for Zimmerman's gun because the spent shell case never ejected? Evidence has since come out proving that to be false. There's no evidence he went for the gun but that didn't stop anyone from from believing he did it.

Whether Trayvon's hand was on the gun or not doesn't change the basic issue of self defense. It would just show they were very close, and Zimmerman didn't shoot Trayvon from a distance of seven yards or something. We now know they were very close because of the gunpowder evidence left on Trayvon.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Of course you don't, you understand little at all.

Rules of Professional Conduct:

Rule 3.6. Trial Publicity
(a) A lawyer who is participating or has participated in the investigation or litigation of a matter shall not make an extrajudicial statement that the lawyer knows or reasonably should know will be disseminated by means of public communication and will have a substantial likelihood of materially prejudicing an adjudicative proceeding in the matter.
.....
(d) A statement referred to in paragraph (a) will be rebuttably presumed to have a substantial likelihood of materially prejudicing an adjudicative proceeding when it refers to that proceeding and the statement is related to:


(4) any opinion as to the guilt or innocence of a defendant or suspect in a criminal case or proceeding that could result in incarceration;

Rule 3.8. Special Responsibilities of a Prosecutor
The prosecutor in a criminal case shall:
(a) refrain from prosecuting a charge that the prosecutor knows is not supported by probable cause;
.....
(d) make timely disclosure to the defense of all evidence or information known to the prosecutor that tends to negate the guilt of the accused or mitigates the offense, and, in connection with sentencing, disclose to the defense and to the tribunal all unprivileged mitigating information known to the prosecutor, except when the prosecutor is relieved of this responsibility by a protective order of the tribunal;
....
(f) except for statements that are necessary to inform the public of the nature and extent of the prosecutor's action and that serve a legitimate law enforcement purpose, refrain from making extrajudicial comments that have a substantial likelihood of heightening public condemnation of the accused and exercise reasonable care to prevent investigators, law enforcement personnel, employees or other persons assisting or associated with the prosecutor in a criminal case from making an extrajudicial statement that the prosecutor would be prohibited from making under Rule 3.6 or this Rule.

Well then, I guess with all the media rounds Zimmerman's lawyers have made, they should be in trouble too?

And how bout a link for all that stuff. We all know you like to take literary license every now and then with other peoples posts/facts. I'm not trusting anything you put up without a link.

 

[hornadylnl]

Jury nullification. It's a wonderful thing. The judge and prosecutor might feel differently, but tough. Whether Trayvon's hand was on the gun or not doesn't change the basic issue of self defense. It would just show they were very close, and Zimmerman didn't shoot Trayvon from a distance of seven yards or something. We now know they were very close because of the gunpowder evidence left on Trayvon.

And I stated a long time ago that I wanted to see the forensics, especially if there was powder burns on Martin. That's real evidence that proves it was an up close encounter. The point I was making is that people were drawing conclusions about Martin grabbing his gun. Their conclusion was that Martin grabbed the gun because the spent shell never ejected. The crime scene evidence shows a shell was ejected. That still didn't mean his hand never touched the gun. It still doesn't mean that Martin tried to take his gun out of his holster or that he grabbed the gun to try to point the barrel away from himself. People were stating facts that didn't exist.

I believe in jury nullification. I believe a jury should be able to acquit from an unjust law. I don't believe a jury should be able to convict because they think a law should exist when it doesn't.

 

[griffin]

If based on a completed ore-trial investigation, she believes Zimmerman is guilty, then no problem with her statement.

Let's run with this for a while.

Corey has charged Zimmerman with Murder 2. Now it seems no one actually believes that charge is true or successfully prosecutable, yet she did it anyway.

So, what are our options here?

a) she really believes Murder 2 is appropriate and plans on a successful prosecution and conviction
b) she doesn't really believe in Murder 2, but she was pandering and bowing to public pressure to "get Zimmerman for murder"
c) she doesn't really believe in Murder 2, but she was over-charging in hopes Zimmerman would try to plead it down and she could avoid trial

Any other options? It seems two out of three of those are malicious prosecution. The only one that is honest is (a), but I can't find anyone in the legal community or otherwise knowledgeable who has spoken out on this matter that thinks that is even a remote possibility.

 

[hornadylnl]

Haven't prosecuters been overcharging for years? It seems that people are charged with every ticky tack thing they could find to shoot for a bigger sentence. I remember the JAG meeting in basic training. We were told that anything but the missionary is against the ucmj. We all couldn't believe it. The JAG officer told us people were only charged with that as an add on charge for another crime. IE, you slapped your wife around and made her have sex with you. Your primary charge is domestic violence but they're going to charge you for the type of sex to to get more on you and a stiffer sentence. To me, that's about the same concept of overcharging. Especially in the hopes that you'll plea to a lesser charge. Happens in court rooms every day.

 

[CarmelHP]

Well then, I guess with all the media rounds Zimmerman's lawyers have made, they should be in trouble too?

And how bout a link for all that stuff. We all know you like to take literary license every now and then with other peoples posts/facts. I'm not trusting anything you put up without a link.

Christ, do your own research at least. And for the record, when you write something that leads to one inescapable conclusion, you own it, don't get all butthurt that you got caught in your own words and don't lie about it afterwards, officer. I bet the prosecution cringes ever having to call you to the stand.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Let's run with this for a while.

Corey has charged Zimmerman with Murder 2. Now it seems no one actually believes that charge is true or successfully prosecutable, yet she did it anyway.

So, what are our options here?

a) she really believes Murder 2 is appropriate and plans on a successful prosecution and conviction
b) she doesn't really believe in Murder 2, but she was pandering and bowing to public pressure to "get Zimmerman for murder"
c) she doesn't really believe in Murder 2, but she was over-charging in hopes Zimmerman would try to plead it down and she could avoid trial

Any other options? It seems two out of three of those are malicious prosecution. The only one that is honest is (a), but I can't find anyone in the legal community or otherwise knowledgeable who has spoken out on this matter that thinks that is even a remote possibility.

If we had ALL of the evidence, then such a claim could be made. However since none of us (including those knowledgeable members of the legal community looking to keep their name in the news) it's impossible to say if she is being unethical or not until the trial.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Christ, do your own research at least.

So you expect, me of all people, to take you at your word? Yeah, been burned by that already. Post a link, and be done with it.

Edit: and please refrain from taking the Lord's name in vain.

 

[jbombelli]

Well then, I guess with all the media rounds Zimmerman's lawyers have made, they should be in trouble too?

And how bout a link for all that stuff. We all know you like to take literary license every now and then with other peoples posts/facts. I'm not trusting anything you put up without a link.

Will this do?

 

[CarmelHP]

So you expect, me of all people, to take you at your word? Yeah, been burned by that already. Post a link, and be done with it.

You got "burned" by your own words.

 

[Glock19]

So you expect, me of all people, to take you at your word? Yeah, been burned by that already. Post a link, and be done with it.

According to your own words, you cant even take yourself at your own word. Youve been caught to many times lately.