Woman With Pot of Boiling Water Shot Dead by Police

[miguel]

Were the prowlers believed to be imaginary/hallucination?

I used to have a guy who would call in burglaries because he had mental health issues and believed people were trying to steal his unwritten book. He then believed the mailman was an undercover FBI agent trying to steal his book. He started answering the door with a pistol in his hand (going back to if I shot everyone I *could* have shot, I'd have shot a lot more people), etc. Or the woman who thought voodoo priests were stealing her hair. Or the woman dealing with a giant demon snake. Etc. etc.

So, believe it or not, from the beginning I realized there was no burglar/prowler and started working to try to get him into mental health treatment. That's also part of the public service provided by police and has been for longer than I've been a cop. If you can get them help and it works, better quality of life for them, less fake calls for you, less risk of escalating to violence due to a misperceived reality.

Point well taken. I can see (your events) as meriting further inquiry and wanting to help the person and those around them ultimately.

From the video it looked like she was just someone who reported a prowler. Don't know if that was her first call, 200th call or what.

p.s. Are you SURE the voodoo priests weren't after that woman's hair?

 

[miguel]

Last year in the ICU, I was so sick I was delirious and you wouldn't believe how deep the chinese communists have infiltrated our health care system. I tried to warn my son about it but I couldn't talk. I barely remember that little fantasy part of it but there were many days I don't remember at all. I'm glad they didn't shoot me.

Were the nurses dressed in Queen of Diamonds costumes?

 

[Michigan Slim]

In Marion County all you do is say you're sorry and you will never do it again...the judge and prosecutor give you a slap on the butt and and a stern finger shaking...and off you go back to the streets.

The drunk stripper that pulled a hit and run IN FRONT OF A COP AND ON VIDEO was charged with seven felonies. Got 16 months in a drug program and a clean record. Son has lifelong injuries from a traumatic brain injury. Major surgery and losing the sight in his left eye. She got clean and a new car. Yeah, I'm carrying a grudge.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

p.s. Are you SURE the voodoo priests weren't after that woman's hair?

Honestly...no. But pretty sure.

Side note, I always really felt for these people. They were often living in perpetual fear because of whatever brain chemistry/wiring issue underlies that sort of thing. She was afraid they were making snakes grow in family member's brains. Can you imagine how helpless you'd feel if that was a reality you believed in? Older lady who thought demon snakes lived under her couch, one who thought her neighbors pumped poison gas in her house through her electric outlets, etc. What a tough way to live, and through no fault of their own, just luck of the draw. Then to, as a stranger, attempt to convince them that their reality isn't and to get enough trust for them to consider that and maybe seek help? You lose way more than you win, but the wins are awesome.

So, yeah, I have no idea the context on this particular event but I totally get where an officer could be concerned someone needed help beyond "there's no intruder, toodles bye".

 

[DoggyDaddy]

Honestly...no. But pretty sure.

Side note, I always really felt for these people. They were often living in perpetual fear because of whatever brain chemistry/wiring issue underlies that sort of thing. She was afraid they were making snakes grow in family member's brains. Can you imagine how helpless you'd feel if that was a reality you believed in? Older lady who thought demon snakes lived under her couch, one who thought her neighbors pumped poison gas in her house through her electric outlets, etc. What a tough way to live, and through no fault of their own, just luck of the draw. Then to, as a stranger, attempt to convince them that their reality isn't and to get enough trust for them to consider that and maybe seek help? You lose way more than you win, but the wins are awesome.

So, yeah, I have no idea the context on this particular event but I totally get where an officer could be concerned someone needed help beyond "there's no intruder, toodles bye".

 

[STAGE 2]

I used my combat skills every single day as a cop. I was a medic in the army, it translates to an EMT on the civilian side. I was covered by a fire department for protocols and I carried nearly all the same equipment as an ambulance. I was dispatched to every EMS call in my area when on duty. Many days I responded to more EMS calls than LE calls. Local EMS could be anywhere between 5-30 minutes away in rural Indiana. Heck, for really bad calls, I drove the ambulance or helped in the back if needed.

Being a cop was one of the most rewarding jobs I will have ever had. I was privileged to be the first to help people at their worst times. I served with many other veterans who were like minded. Not sure where you get this image that cops who served in combat are all high strung killers who use drugs. Most of the guys I served in combat with are just average guys. The gunner in my truck went on to medical school at Harvard...I will get you his name if you want, you can make sure you don't get him. He might have a tattoo I don't know.

I've never abused drugs and I don't like tattoos.

Ignorant takes like yours are what pushed me to retire, and are pushing all the guys who have options to leave too.

Pretty sure I didn’t say half of what you posted. And I would agree that being a medic or corpsman would be ideal work experience for an EMT. Same reason many military aviators go on to be civilian pilots and military mechanics can find similar jobs once they get out. The skills carry over because they are largely the same. That’s why I said being an MP would be beneficial.

However there isn’t anything about a combat MOS that carries over to policing. They are two drastically different jobs with two drastically different goals in two drastically different environments.

This is coming from someone from a family full of both law enforcement and military.

 

[oze]

The drunk stripper that pulled a hit and run IN FRONT OF A COP AND ON VIDEO was charged with seven felonies. Got 16 months in a drug program and a clean record. Son has lifelong injuries from a traumatic brain injury. Major surgery and losing the sight in his left eye. She got clean and a new car. Yeah, I'm carrying a grudge.

Are you ******** me?
I'm so sorry to hear this, Slim.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

However there isn’t anything about a combat MOS that carries over to policing. They are two drastically different jobs with two drastically different goals in two drastically different environments.

Weird. Here I thought my ability to make decisions under stress, rapidly sort through changing stimuli to make a correct assessment of the situation and adapt to it, ability to function independently when needed and as a team when needed, to think independently but also trust my team, to pay attention to detail in the midst of overwhelming stimuli, etc. had helped me be a better cop. Guess I didn't realize I was supposed to be so ****ing stupid I couldn't understand the different requirements of different environments.

I guess based on your vast experience of neither, though, I should probably resign tomorrow before I try to call in a fire mission on a fleeing vehicle.

 

[nonobaddog]

call in a fire mission on a fleeing vehicle.

OK, that would be so cool.

a few 50 cal and maybe just one missile - the little one.

 

[miguel]

Honestly...no. But pretty sure.

Side note, I always really felt for these people. They were often living in perpetual fear because of whatever brain chemistry/wiring issue underlies that sort of thing. She was afraid they were making snakes grow in family member's brains. Can you imagine how helpless you'd feel if that was a reality you believed in? Older lady who thought demon snakes lived under her couch, one who thought her neighbors pumped poison gas in her house through her electric outlets, etc. What a tough way to live, and through no fault of their own, just luck of the draw. Then to, as a stranger, attempt to convince them that their reality isn't and to get enough trust for them to consider that and maybe seek help? You lose way more than you win, but the wins are awesome.

So, yeah, I have no idea the context on this particular event but I totally get where an officer could be concerned someone needed help beyond "there's no intruder, toodles bye".

Thanks for sharing this. I can't imagine what that first moment after the crazy opens the door and you have to remain civil/cool would be like.

 

[STAGE 2]

Weird. Here I thought my ability to make decisions under stress, rapidly sort through changing stimuli to make a correct assessment of the situation and adapt to it, ability to function independently when needed and as a team when needed, to think independently but also trust my team, to pay attention to detail in the midst of overwhelming stimuli, etc. had helped me be a better cop. Guess I didn't realize I was supposed to be so ****ing stupid I couldn't understand the different requirements of different environments.

I guess based on your vast experience of neither, though, I should probably resign tomorrow before I try to call in a fire mission on a fleeing vehicle.

First, the criteria you list in your first paragraph isn’t exclusive to policing. A professional athlete has to have that same criteria and I can hope that we could all agree that a large majority of them of them have no business in law enforcement.

A surgeon or roughneck (or any other high stress job quite frankly) would also have to have the same qualities and again none of those jobs would guarantee that someone would be a successful cop.
In that same vein being a combat vet doesn’t provide someone with experience unique to law enforcement and I would argue has characteristics that are at odds of those with a patrol cop.

That’s why, having an in depth individual assessment is and should be the largest determinative factor in whether someone should be hired as an officer because it’s the best way to judge intelligence and temperament which I would argue are the
two most important factors for law enforcement. Can a combat vet have the “right stuff” to be a cop? Absolutely. But dollars to doughnuts that person had those qualities to begin with.

Secondly, I seem to have touched a nerve, which I find odd since my only premise was that military service doesn’t prepare someone for law enforcement, and can actually be a hindrance. What I do know is that you have no idea what my experience is. What I can tell you that over the course of my career I’ve interviewed hundreds of officers and seen nothing that would lead me to believe that my conclusion is incorrect.

 

[Denny347]

First, the criteria you list in your first paragraph isn’t exclusive to policing. A professional athlete has to have that same criteria and I can hope that we could all agree that a large majority of them of them have no business in law enforcement.

A surgeon or roughneck (or any other high stress job quite frankly) would also have to have the same qualities and again none of those jobs would guarantee that someone would be a successful cop.

Nothing guarantees a successful LEO. Some of my best officers were combat vets and others were not. Some of our worst recruits were military, others not. I would say that of my 50+ officers on my shift, maybe 15 or so are active military and maybe another 15 were former military. All are good Coppers in one of the busiest Districts in the State.

 

[nonobaddog]

Nothing guarantees a successful LEO. Some of my best officers were combat vets and others were not. Some of our worst recruits were military, others not. I would say that of my 50+ officers on my shift, maybe 15 or so are active military and maybe another 15 were former military. All are good Coppers in one of the busiest Districts in the State.

Please explain how they can be active military and mixed in with former and non-military.

 

[STAGE 2]

Nothing guarantees a successful LEO. Some of my best officers were combat vets and others were not. Some of our worst recruits were military, others not. I would say that of my 50+ officers on my shift, maybe 15 or so are active military and maybe another 15 were former military. All are good Coppers in one of the busiest Districts in the State.

It looks like we agree then. Hiring should be based on the individual and their individual merits and temperament.

The problem we have then is that a majority of agencies, IMPD for example, give hiring preference to veterans despite the fact that it’s not determinative of their ability to do the job.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Please explain how they can be active military and mixed in with former and non-military.

I suspect I am going to Denny Denny here, but I think he's probably meaning reservists/guardsmen and not actually meaning active military.

 

[Denny347]

I suspect I am going to Denny Denny here, but I think he's probably meaning reservists/guardsmen and not actually meaning active military.

Yeah, I could have misused the term. I'm not from a military background so I could have misspoke. Thank you for understanding what I was getting at.

 

[nonobaddog]

I suspect I am going to Denny Denny here, but I think he's probably meaning reservists/guardsmen and not actually meaning active military.

That makes sense.
I was just going by what was said and the fact that there could be some weird organization type that I don't know about.

Something like the old Manhattan Project where they had a mixture of military and non-military personnel so they would need both types of LE. Or even Area 51.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Yeah, I could have misused the term. I'm not from a military background so I could have misspoke. Thank you for understanding what I was getting at.

Without getting too sidetracked, in broad strokes: Active military is the equivalent of full time. Reserves are (generally) the equivalent of part-time.

 

[Denny347]

Without getting too sidetracked, in broad strokes: Active military is the equivalent of full time. Reserves are (generally) the equivalent of part-time.

Yeah, makes sense. I was thinking "still active in the military"...thanks.

 

[Hatin Since 87]

How is it every time there is an officer involved shooting we see people post that we havent seen in years?