White House cancels Obama meeting with Philippines leader

[Kutnupe14]

Although I agree with you on the due process, you basically have to live in the Philippines to understand why it has taken this route in solving a long standing problem.

It's the same thing how we tell other people from other countries, who make comments about our gun problems here when it is not, but they don't understand because they don't live here. Hell, even people who live here don't understand it.

The current problems the Philippines are dealing with is beyond solvable through civil means, many Presidents have failed and the people are tired of the crimes and the corruption.

Duterte's ways were proven effective being a mayor in a city so he implemented it nationwide.

He's got a huge burden on his shoulder right now because that's a huge amount of **** that needs to be removed in that country. Now he's also dealing with muslim extremist in Mindanao, whom are also a long time problem.

Also, their prison system is so overcrowded that you can call it a can of sardines.

I've lived there for 23 years and grew up in the slum area and I see it while growing up. I go back from time to time and seen improvement over the years. A couple of friends just recently went back and already seeing progress as he took office, especially on the curbside sanitation.

I can honestly say that this guy is actually doing some real work. And he's got 6 years of hardship ahead of him in tackling a mold that has gripped that country for decades.

While I certainly respect your point of view, it's incredibly difficult, regardless of the benefits (in my mind), to justify summary executions of not only drug dealers, but users and addicts. It smacks in the fact of ones natural rights.

 

[churchmouse]

While I certainly respect your point of view, it's incredibly difficult, regardless of the benefits (in my mind), to justify summary executions of not only drug dealers, but users and addicts. It smacks in the fact of ones natural rights.

I am not disagreeing with this Kut but I would ask you, in the face of an overwhelming issue of this magnitude.....................what else can be done.
If all the social and civil means have been tried and failed whats next. A cancer has to be addressed straight on. This problem sounds like a social cancer. We as a nation are sliding down that very same slope. Needle programs and the like make it OK in the minds of the weak to stay in the drug subculture. Accepting the lifestyle as OK socially puts no stigma on that choice.
I know it is far deeper and more complicated than this but I see the actions being taken as a last ditch effort to cure a horrible social disease.

Do I agree with it....Mixed emotions.
Will it work, like cancer you can cut it out and attack it but it will always be hanging around. The drug culture has been with us since about the time they discovered dirt.

 

[Kutnupe14]

I am not disagreeing with this Kut but I would ask you, in the face of an overwhelming issue of this magnitude.....................what else can be done.
If all the social and civil means have been tried and failed whats next. A cancer has to be addressed straight on. This problem sounds like a social cancer. We as a nation are sliding down that very same slope. Needle programs and the like make it OK in the minds of the weak to stay in the drug subculture. Accepting the lifestyle as OK socially puts no stigma on that choice.
I know it is far deeper and more complicated than this but I see the actions being taken as a last ditch effort to cure a horrible social disease.

Do I agree with it....Mixed emotions.
Will it work, like cancer you can cut it out and attack it but it will always be hanging around. The drug culture has been with us since about the time they discovered dirt.

You can't be wishy washy with rights Church. It's an all or nothing proposal. And people accused of crimes, should have the right to have the allegations against them proven. If you're not clear, Duterte isn't charging people with crimes, proving their guilt, and then executing then. He is allowing what can only be described as death squads, to roam the streets and execute people on the roadside for crimes they haven't even proven. To any liberty loving person, that should be viewed as a travesty. I would completely support any administration that sought to break ties with the Philippines due to this draconian policy.

Philippines executions | Graphic images

Edit: I'm just starting to bone up on this guy. And it seems that he a loon. After the rape and murder of an Australian national, he said that he was "upset," with the rape, but that "she was so beautiful," he should've been "first." He said this in public to a crowd. I predict worse times for the Filippino people.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...e-presidential-contender-duterte-widens-lead/

 

[cobber]

While I certainly respect your point of view, it's incredibly difficult, regardless of the benefits (in my mind), to justify summary executions of not only drug dealers, but users and addicts. It smacks in the fact of ones natural rights.

If only he were using RPV's...

 

[DoggyDaddy]

You can't be wishy washy with rights Church. It's an all or nothing proposal. And people accused of crimes, should have the right to have the allegations against them proven. If you're not clear, Duterte isn't charging people with crimes, proving their guilt, and then executing then. He is allowing what can only be described as death squads, to roam the streets and execute people on the roadside for crimes they haven't even proven. To any liberty loving person, that should be viewed as a travesty. I would completely support any administration that sought to break ties with the Philippines due to this draconian policy.

Philippines executions | Graphic images

Edit: I'm just starting to bone up on this guy. And it seems that he a loon. After the rape and murder of an Australian national, he said that he was "upset," with the rape, but that "she was so beautiful," he should've been "first." He said this in public to a crowd. I predict worse times for the Filippino people.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...e-presidential-contender-duterte-widens-lead/

What if (and that's a big IF - I don't know enough about the situation to know one way or another) the Filipino people supported his policy regarding drug dealers/addicts? The reason I ask is, no matter what one thinks of it, it does seem to have been somewhat successful in reducing the problem. If the Filipino people approve then is it still okay to cut ties? Obviously from a human rights standpoint, it may seem distasteful to us, but if they've tried other methods without success? I don't know.

 

[Salty]

My wife doesn't live there any more but she does still have family there. She has no problem with this. Government corruption there has always been a problem. Big reason our 2A rights are so important. BTW, our constitution is not the same as theirs. What we think are rights may not apply there.

 

[Expat]

So God gave more rights to us and fewer to Fillipinos?

 

[hoosierdoc]

As much as I hate Obama I'm glad he cancelled the meeting. One less foreign leader to bow to

 

[Tanfodude]

I do understand everyone's look on this, I'm in the same boat. But remember, its the people who put him in office. Filipinos here in US supported him. I didn't, couldn't care less. I'm done with the country a long time ago, even as a kid.

Yes, it's brutal, yes, rights are ignored. The people there are tired of it. I have no words to described the mold that needs to be removed, you have to live there to understand it.

 

[Kurr]

He promised to pay huge bounties in exchange for every person killed who had connections to the drug trade. The higher the target’s rank, the bigger the reward.
The pay scale looks something like this: Three million pesos (around $A85,000) for every “drug lord”, two million pesos ($A56,000) for those in charge of distribution, one million pesos ($A28,000) for “syndicate members” and 50,000 pesos ($A1400) for every “ordinary” drug peddler killed.

Maybe that ain't the best thing in an impoverished nation. Just sayin.

Edited to add: Oh Look!! It's The Purge with cash prizes!

 

[pudly]

Maybe that ain't the best thing in an impoverished nation. Just sayin.

Edited to add: Oh Look!! It's The Purge with cash prizes!

Please describe the moral difference between this and the multimillion dollar rewards that America has been offering in impoverished nations for Iraqi/Al-Queda/ISIS enemies for the last decade plus.

 

[Kurr]

Ya know, I was considering mentioning that's that as how I thought we got an overbooking for Abu Ghraib early on!

 

[bwframe]

Obama has earned zero foreign respect.

 

[churchmouse]

You can't be wishy washy with rights Church. It's an all or nothing proposal. And people accused of crimes, should have the right to have the allegations against them proven. If you're not clear, Duterte isn't charging people with crimes, proving their guilt, and then executing then. He is allowing what can only be described as death squads, to roam the streets and execute people on the roadside for crimes they haven't even proven. To any liberty loving person, that should be viewed as a travesty. I would completely support any administration that sought to break ties with the Philippines due to this draconian policy.

Philippines executions | Graphic images

Edit: I'm just starting to bone up on this guy. And it seems that he a loon. After the rape and murder of an Australian national, he said that he was "upset," with the rape, but that "she was so beautiful," he should've been "first." He said this in public to a crowd. I predict worse times for the Filippino people.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...e-presidential-contender-duterte-widens-lead/

No, we can not and yes, you are correct in this statement.
Again, I am responding with only a small amount of info.

But what has observing rights done for our streets. Not much really. The bad are let loose far to quickly.

No, I am not supporting the hunt/kill for money thug removal program.

 

[spencer rifle]

since about the time they discovered dirt.

I thought that was you, not "they."

 

[HoughMade]

Wonder how much he'd be swearing if the we pulled most of our soldiers out of there???

U.S. military installations in the Philippines are for the benefit of the U.S. and our interests primarily and only incidentally benefit the Philippines.

Obama has earned zero foreign respect.

...and this is the real problem.

 

[Tanfodude]

I can enumerate the problems they have but then I have to recall all those unnecessary memories and I just don't want to ruin my day today.

The people there are aware of his actions. As a collective, their mindset now is gambling with his approach. They have had so many presidents that tried to solve it but unable because of either the lack of backbone or just surrounded with corrupt officials whos roots have dug so deep in the system that it's going to cost lives in cleaning it up. He's up against some powerful politicians that are involved in this ring. He knows he's risking his life when he took office. But he doesn't care.

I can relate this to a similar situation in Mexico where they actually armed a town to fight the cartels. It hasn't gotten to that point yet.

The muslim extremists sensing that he's no BS, they have now started bombing places there. Philippines blast: 3 sought over deadly bombing, Islamists suspected - CNN.com

Any crime committed there is as good as unsolved. You can disappear if someone wants you dead. It'll only get attention if it's a big case and gets national attention. Other than that, you're basically on your own. People there are tired of that. I was. Their justice system there are hopeless before he took office. There's some light to it now.

Like Church said, what do you do when all else fails. I'm lucky I'm in one of the greatest countries on earth now. The system isn't perfect but it works because of the people behind it. If our justice system doesn't do what its supposed to do, you've already seen glimpses of it. But we're not close to that, yet.

I want to feel bad for those involved and got killed but I don't. I've met those type of people face to face. Draconian it may be but in my opinion, it's a much needed approach. And I'm saying that with a gamble, hoping it works.

Again, I understand where everyone is coming from, but then again, you're living a life here where ideals can become a reality.

 

[churchmouse]

I thought that was you, not "they."

 

[mcapo]

Not a Trump fan (much less a Hillary fan...) but I can't imagine the Pilipino President calling Trump's mother a derogatory term...

 

[indiucky]

Would we be that petty?

We would be this Petty...

[video=youtube;s5BJXwNeKsQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s5BJXwNeKsQ[/video]