What to expect when Ohio votes on abortion and marijuana

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AP Election Brief | What to expect when Ohio votes on abortion and marijuana

For the second time in three months, the national debate over reproductive rights focuses on Ohio. Voters will decide Tuesday whether to amend the Ohio Constitution to protect access to abortion services.

apnews.com

Ohio Democrats are leading vote-by-mail ballots in election on abortion, marijuana • Ohio Capital Journal

Democratic and nonpartisan voters in Ohio are winning the vote-by-mail fight in the November election on abortion and marijuana, an OCJ/WEWS analysis found.

ohiocapitaljournal.com

 

[Flash-hider]

It's not too hard to figure out. Just look to the north in Michigan and see what we are dealing with now.

 

[bwframe]

We've always had the libs to our left, but never been surrounded by them. The threat is here now.

Abortion and pot could push us over the edge. We REALLY REALLY need to work on our message and the narrative.

 

[oze]

AP Election Brief | What to expect when Ohio votes on abortion and marijuana

For the second time in three months, the national debate over reproductive rights focuses on Ohio. Voters will decide Tuesday whether to amend the Ohio Constitution to protect access to abortion services.

apnews.com

Ohio Democrats are leading vote-by-mail ballots in election on abortion, marijuana • Ohio Capital Journal

Democratic and nonpartisan voters in Ohio are winning the vote-by-mail fight in the November election on abortion and marijuana, an OCJ/WEWS analysis found.

ohiocapitaljournal.com

When an article leads with the terms "abortion rights" and "reproductive rights", I know that, if I just want facts without a lefty spin, I should just move on.

How about "murder rights" and "infanticide rights"? Think you'd get an unbiased story there?

 

[wagyu52]

Illinois route 1 just south of I 74 is what I can best describe as a compound. Consisting of a grow facility, dispensary and now a restaurant, yes a restaurant for pot. All surrounded by a black chain link fence with 3 strands of barb wire.

Big money

 

[bwframe]

When an article leads with the terms "abortion rights" and "reproductive rights", I know that, if I just want facts without a lefty spin, I should just move on.

How about "murder rights" and "infanticide rights"? Think you'd get an unbiased story there?

We know that, but most women, nearly all people under 25, and every single democrat believe that baloney. And they vote...

Perfect example is the "vast" anti-semitic crowds that are growing and growing, marching in our streets. BLM was (and is) the same. Those folks are buying the liberal . It's all they know, because it's on their news and social media.

We can put our heads in the sand and keep losing, until there is never a numerical chance to win again. Or we can concentrate on fixing our narrative?

 

[Twangbanger]

If Ohio #1 passes, ideally, the GOP would realize that when a state that Trump (GOP 4.0) won by double digits goes left on a social issue, letting the God Squad write your platform is reverting back to GOP 3.0.

In actuality, Pro Life Future will sprint to the mic, and the spin control will either be "It was a stilted electorate, Issue #2 brought all the liberal potheads out," or the "ballot was confusing" (even though they got it changed).

Honestly, the GOP has been populated by country club pro-corporate shills for so long, with so little connection the average person, their narrative is now almost PR-proof. The Pro Life community is one of their few their Astroturf connections to average people, and such examples are so few, they feel critically dependent on them.

RvW is overturned, and Trump's appointees did it. If Trump is the nominee, that narrative will stick and he just has to live with it. He outsourced vetting of his SC nominees to the Federalist Society, that result is baked-in, and we'll just have to take the good with the bad.

 

[Kdf101]

I honestly don’t care about the weed thing. I think we would be better off just quitting the war on drugs and moving on. We have probably made it worse by fighting it, for sure made the cartels super rich. The abortion thing is another matter. I just can’t even budge on what I believe is killing a baby. Not even a little bit. There may be valid reasons, may be, but those would need the same level of justification in my mind as killing any other person. any state that has a lot of big cities, and Ohio has several largish ones, seems to eventually fall left.

 

[Ark]

Well people like getting high and people like aborting their children, so.

 

[bwframe]

I honestly don’t care about the weed thing. I think we would be better off just quitting the war on drugs and moving on. We have probably made it worse by fighting it, for sure made the cartels super rich. The abortion thing is another matter. I just can’t even budge on what I believe is killing a baby. Not even a little bit. There may be valid reasons, may be, but those would need the same level of justification in my mind as killing any other person. any state that has a lot of big cities, and Ohio has several largish ones, seems to eventually fall left.

Agree with your opinion or not, the best solution is to NOT be reactionary. No new laws. Let things play out, kick the can down the road, whatever you want to call it.

We would benefit greatly by not making emotional voting decisions. Emotions are high on abortion after last years SCOTUS decision. We should take the SCOTUS win and leave it alone for the next few years. Don't mess with "women's health" as sold by 50 years of and generations of girls be taught that lie. Let this thing calm down, so we don't have to lose multiple elections on it. Who knows what else might be lost along with this emotional issue.

Similarly, wait for the building statistics of what "legalized marijuana" is doing to the locals where it has been adopted. The longer these "legal" places go, the more negative reports come out on the effects of the spread of this problem. We could talk about this problem to eternity, but the truth is there is no denying the opioid crisis in America. Promotion of the casual use of "legal" intoxicants should be a consideration?

If we fool around and let emotions dictate votes in critical states, it could make huge differences deeper that is apparent. Maybe some issues that can't be reeled back in? We know what the libs would do to election integrity, given the chance, right?

Another consideration is that if we in Indiana end up surrounded by liberal mentality states, how will it be before we are sucked in also? How many tomes in recent years have we heard, "our surrounding states have all..."

 

[DeadeyeChrista'sdad]

Agree with your opinion or not, the best solution is to NOT be reactionary. No new laws. Let things play out, kick the can down the road, whatever you want to call it.

We would benefit greatly by not making emotional voting decisions. Emotions are high on abortion after last years SCOTUS decision. We should take the SCOTUS win and leave it alone for the next few years. Don't mess with "women's health" as sold by 50 years of and generations of girls be taught that lie. Let this thing calm down, so we don't have to lose multiple elections on it. Who knows what else might be lost along with this emotional issue.

Similarly, wait for the building statistics of what "legalized marijuana" is doing to the locals where it has been adopted. The longer these "legal" places go, the more negative reports come out on the effects of the spread of this problem. We could talk about this problem to eternity, but the truth is there is no denying the opioid crisis in America. Promotion of the casual use of "legal" intoxicants should be a consideration?

If we fool around and let emotions dictate votes in critical states, it could make huge differences deeper that is apparent. Maybe some issues that can't be reeled back in? We know what the libs would do to election integrity, given the chance, right?

Another consideration is that if we in Indiana end up surrounded by liberal mentality states, how will it be before we are sucked in also? How many tomes in recent years have we heard, "our surrounding states have all..."

Trust me. Anyone in this state who wants to smoke pot, does smoke pot.

Abortion, I agree, is a whole different can of worms. I'm not for banning it completely, but I am for restricting the living poop out of it. Killing a living person should not be taken so casually.

 

[oze]

If Ohio #1 passes, ideally, the GOP would realize that when a state that Trump (GOP 4.0) won by double digits goes left on a social issue, letting the God Squad write your platform is reverting back to GOP 3.0.

In actuality, Pro Life Future will sprint to the mic, and the spin control will either be "It was a stilted electorate, Issue #2 brought all the liberal potheads out," or the "ballot was confusing" (even though they got it changed).

Honestly, the GOP has been populated by country club pro-corporate shills for so long, with so little connection the average person, their narrative is now almost PR-proof. The Pro Life community is one of their few their Astroturf connections to average people, and such examples are so few, they feel critically dependent on them.

RvW is overturned, and Trump's appointees did it. If Trump is the nominee, that narrative will stick and he just has to live with it. He outsourced vetting of his SC nominees to the Federalist Society, that result is baked-in, and we'll just have to take the good with the bad.

Sounds like you're pro-abortion. OK, just establishing baselines. And while we're doing that, here's mine. Not all pro life people belong your "God Squad". To many of us, it's not a religious issue, it's a moral one.

And on a smaller issue, what do you recommend the Repubs do if/when 2A support becomes a losing issue with the majority of voters, including surrounding states? Are you willing to cede that high ground?

 

[04FXSTS]

Illinois route 1 just south of I 74 is what I can best describe as a compound. Consisting of a grow facility, dispensary and now a restaurant, yes a restaurant for pot. All surrounded by a black chain link fence with 3 strands of barb wire.

Big money

That is called "Molly's Joint" and I believe they are having bands and other live entertainment along with the restaurant. I have not been there and will never be there so I could be wrong, just what I have heard.
With the restaurant deal I don't know if it works as a dispensary or not but will not be finding out. What I understand is to enter a dispensary you must show I.D. and it is scanned into their records. You have now declared yourself as an Illegal (federal law not Illinois) drug user. Now what happens when you go to an FFL to buy a firearm and fill out the 4473? Jim.

 

[LeftyGunner]

We know that, but most women, nearly all people under 25, and every single democrat believe that baloney. And they vote...

Perfect example is the "vast" anti-semitic crowds that are growing and growing, marching in our streets. BLM was (and is) the same. Those folks are buying the liberal . It's all they know, because it's on their news and social media.

We can put our heads in the sand and keep losing, until there is never a numerical chance to win again. Or we can concentrate on fixing our narrative?

How do you intend to fix the narrative? What changes do you suggest? Voters already know that republicans want more restrictions on abortion, less taxes for the rich, and more Donald Trump.

Republicans don’t have a messaging problem, they have a platform problem.

 

[AndreusMaximus]

How do you intend to fix the narrative? What changes do you suggest? Voters already know that republicans want more restrictions on abortion, less taxes for the rich, and more Donald Trump.

Republicans don’t have a messaging problem, they have a platform problem.

This kind of proves the point, though: it's 100% about the messaging.

"more restrictions on abortion, less taxes for the rich, and more Donald Trump" is the way leftist media portrays it.

If it were messaged as "less killing babies, less big government spending our children's future away, and less career politicians getting rich off a lifetime of corruption" who would want to be seen as against that?

 

[Twangbanger]

Sounds like you're pro-abortion. OK, just establishing baselines. And while we're doing that, here's mine. Not all pro life people belong your "God Squad". To many of us, it's not a religious issue, it's a moral one.

And on a smaller issue, what do you recommend the Repubs do if/when 2A support becomes a losing issue with the majority of voters, including surrounding states? Are you willing to cede that high ground?

Just to be clear, I did not suggest Pro Life groups cede their beliefs. The gist of my comment was that Pro Life is not the Republican Party, and there could (and I think should) be a debate on how much the GOP should allow those beliefs to dictate their platform.

We already know if the 2A fell below the waterline of public opinion, the GOP would pragmatically drop it like a flaming sack of turds. Indiana's own "Life At Conception" GOP Senator Dan Coats voted for the Brady Bill and 1994 Assault Weapon Ban along with other Republicans, both of which actually became Federal law, and Hoosiers forgave and forgot and sent him back to D.C. - with glowing endorsement fron Pro Life Groups.

Now that the stated goal of reversing RvW has been achieved - on an issue where public opinion has moved the opposite direction in the last half-century - I think it's time to spread some of that "pragmatism" around. Pro Life does not speak for all Republican voters. If they feel further Federal action on abortion is warranted, and the GOP does not accurately represent their beliefs, they are perfectly free to start a party of their own.

 

[bwframe]

We all know if the 2A fell below the waterline of public opinion, the GOP would pragmatically drop it like a flaming sack of turds. Indiana's own "Life At Conception" GOP Senator Dan Coats voted for the Brady Bill and 1994 Assault Weapon Ban, and Hoosiers forgave and forgot and sent him back to D.C. - with glowing endorsement fron Pro Life Groups.

Now that the stated goal of reversing RvW has been achieved - on an issue where the public moved the opposite direction in the last half-century - I think the GOP can spread some of that pragmatism around.

What's the plan to fix all of this?

Just keep bitching about it?

 

[LeftyGunner]

This kind of proves the point, though: it's 100% about the messaging.

"more restrictions on abortion, less taxes for the rich, and more Donald Trump" is the way leftist media portrays it.

If it were messaged as "less killing babies, less big government spending our children's future away, and less career politicians getting rich off a lifetime of corruption" who would want to be seen as against that?

I have to disagree, the Republican Party is not one of small government, individual liberty, or ethical governance…and that’s their problem, not their press team.

Changing the messaging only works if people actually want what is being sold with that message, so…what is the GOP actually selling?

Factually: More restrictions on abortion, more tax cuts for the wealthy, and more Trump.

The small-government answer to abortion is liberty…if you want an abortion and can convince a doctor the need is legitimate you get your abortion. The Republican answer is criminalization.

The small-government answer to marijuana is liberty…if you want to buy pot and you can find someone willing to sell it you get your drugs. The Republican answer is criminalization.

The answer for corruption is accountability for the corrupt, which the Republicans have shown no desire to sincerely pursue.

Inelegant Republican messaging is not what is turning off the voters...It’s the underlying policies doing that.

 

[Twangbanger]

What's the plan to fix all of this?

Just keep bitching about it?

You posted a thread, I answered.

GOP: "In the wake of RvW's reversal, the GOP will pursue no further abortion policy proposals at the Federal level. Those unsatisfied with the current situation are advised to consult with your State Party Chair and associated elected officials."

>>> Mic drop.

Don't tell me they can't do it. We have an Indianapolis GOP Mayoral candidate leading off his campaign with an AWB and repealing con-carry, for chrissakes. The GOP apparently has more than enough flexibility to do whatso-f'in-ever they feel is needed to win elections at the state and local level, regardless whether it sacrifices "Republican values," with little to no interference from Ronna McRomney. If the GOP Platform Straightjacket doesn't necessarily protect 2A at the local or state level, then I think we've seen the effective limits of a Platform, anyway.

Now, your turn: what should be the GOP message on marijuana?

 

[Twangbanger]

I have to disagree, the Republican Party is not one of small government, individual liberty, or ethical governance…and that’s their problem, not their press team.

Changing the messaging only works if people actually want what is being sold with that message, so…what is the GOP actually selling?

Factually: More restrictions on abortion, more tax cuts for the wealthy, and more Trump.

The small-government answer to abortion is liberty…if you want an abortion and can convince a doctor the need is legitimate you get your abortion. The Republican answer is criminalization.

The small-government answer to marijuana is liberty…if you want to buy pot and you can find someone willing to sell it you get your drugs. The Republican answer is criminalization.

The answer for corruption is accountability for the corrupt, which the Republicans have shown no desire to sincerely pursue.

Inelegant Republican messaging is not what is turning off the voters...It’s the underlying policies doing that.

And although we disagree on much, you are correct: Republicans are in this mess because of DECADES of pursuing unpopular policies, bacon-wrapped with "messaging" to get the dog to swallow the dog food.

That's why Trump owns the party now. Republican voters finally saw through the bull, and were ready to put the party on chemotherapy.