What COULD be done?

[AD Marc]

Que, By turning and running, you are giving up any initiative you may have had. It also adds another variable: where are we running to?

If you do run and the guy doesn't chase you, great. But I wouldn't rely on luck. If he does chase you, you have made your position significantly less defensible.

 

[GIJEW]

I posted earlier that running was the option I would most likely employ, and I still believe that. I once practiced with knives for a pretty decent period of time and came to the realization that unless one person is incompetent, even the "winner" is likely to bleed out before help arrives. So, even though I still say that an unarmed person (like the victim in the video) should run as their first option, if that option is unavailable to you then you are going to have to decide that you want to live, and nothing else matters.

As far as the video goes, I think it's unlikely you can score a solid hit on the incoming knife arm; it's almost as unlikely that you'll be able to grab it. Rotate the wrists out so the brachial artery isn't exposed, and get inside the strike so the blade hits the outside of the forearm, upper arm or shoulder. Try to clinch with a bear hug that traps his arms to his side above the elbows. Hit him with your incoming head if you can, they bury your teeth in his throat and tear until he stops moving. The carotid is buried about 1 1/2" deep. If you can work your way to it, it can stop the attack in about 8 seconds.

I've never been in a real knife fight, and I hope I never am. I don't know what would work, but if I can't run I'm going to do whatever it takes.

If you're too close to be able to draw your pistol (or knife) then you're too close to be able to run away either, and worse you present your back to him.

Pinning his arm while counter attacking sounds MUCH better. Using your teeth on his throat sounds like the right mind set too. btw If you crunch his larynx, that ought to be an awesome choke-hold!

 

[96firephoenix]

Que, By turning and running, you are giving up any initiative you may have had. It also adds another variable: where are we running to?

Who says you have to run to somewhere special? if my options are A) stay in a location where my fight is jacket vs. knife or B) anywhere else, I am going to get the hell out of Dodge.

In this instance, running from is a better option than staying put, regardless of where you run to.

 

[iChokePeople]

btw If you crunch his larynx, that ought to be an awesome choke-hold!

Eh, not really. It SUCKS, it HURTS, but it's not nearly as certain as shutting off his carotid arteries. For anyone interested, I'd be happy to demonstrate the difference (in a safe, friendly way.)

ETA: but this is a digression -- in most cases, I would NOT want to get into a grappling/choking match in this kind of situation, because he probably has friends.

 

[AD Marc]

Who says you have to run to somewhere special? if my options are A) stay in a location where my fight is jacket vs. knife or B) anywhere else, I am going to get the hell out of Dodge.

In this instance, running from is a better option than staying put, regardless of where you run to.

What if you're running towards his friends? What if he chases you while running nowhere in particular? Now you've accomplished nothing other than exhausting yourself before a fight. What if you have people with you that you are responsible for "sorry babe, guess you shouldn't have worn heels, peace"

Next, what is your indicator that it's time to run? Is it seeing the knife? Because you probably won't.

A trained response beats an untrained response every time. Running is an untrained response to danger. It is probably a good option for those who don't want to spend the time and effort training to respond effectively, but it is most certainly not the best way to respond to this sort of attack.

 

[96firephoenix]

What if you're running towards his friends? 1) The presented scenario was 1 on 1, no friends on either side. What if he chases you while running nowhere in particular? Now you've accomplished nothing other than exhausting yourself before a fight. 2) say he does. By running, I have put distance and time between us. Time that could be used to draw a gun, scream for help, pull out my phone and call 911(like that will help), etc... . Also, to answer your exhaustion charge: Adrenaline is a hell of a drug. Grannies pickup cars on adrenaline, paper boys tear doors off of pickups on adrenaline. Someone coming after me with a knife is sure as hell going to get my adrenaline going.What if you have people with you that you are responsible for "sorry babe, guess you shouldn't have worn heels, peace"3) see 1

Next, what is your indicator that it's time to run? Is it seeing the knife? Because you probably won't. 4) good point, I honestly hadn't thought that through.

A trained response beats an untrained response every time. Running is an untrained response to danger. It is probably a good option for those who don't want to spend the time and effort training to respond effectively, but it is most certainly not the best way to respond to this sort of attack.

Replies in Red.

I agree that a trained responce is always a better option, but running can give you time to employ a better trained responce, such as a firearm.

Odds are, if someone is choosing to stab you, he is doing so on a playing field of his choosing that you have unwittingly wandered into. Running off of his playing field does 2 things: First, it confuses him, because h is expecting you to stand there and get stabbed. Second, it takes the fight out of his arena.

Its not a perfect solution, but in the scenario presented in the video, it is a perfectly viable option.

 

[Que]

Que, By turning and running, you are giving up any initiative you may have had. It also adds another variable: where are we running to?

If you do run and the guy doesn't chase you, great. But I wouldn't rely on luck. If he does chase you, you have made your position significantly less defensible.

I definitely see what you mean and I understand we can't produce a scenario where all the variables are known and responses defined and definite.

I do know that most of the time I am in a location where the geography is known to me. I know where people/help should be located, etc. In a perfect world this would happen when I'm out with a group of INGO members.

 

[rhino]

Eh, not really. It SUCKS, it HURTS, but it's not nearly as certain as shutting off his carotid arteries. For anyone interested, I'd be happy to demonstrate the difference (in a safe, friendly way.)

I keep asking you to do it to people I've just volunteered. I'll keep trying.

Re: running ... aside from the possible downsides for people who are fleet of foot, for some of us (not just me) it's not even a viable option. That leaves 1) move into the attacker and do something, and 2) do nothing and accept the consequences.

 

[iChokePeople]

I keep asking you to do it to people I've just volunteered. I'll keep trying.

I don't get why people seem so reluctant. It's not a big deal. It's not like we would draw a Dirty... Er... Pancho Villa 'stache on them while they're out.

 

[giovani]

All I can add is that in judo you use the attackers momentum against them,I doubt I could , but I know a Couple of fellows that could probably take a guy like that down, but they would no doubt get stabbed maybe several times in the process.

 

[rhino]

I don't get why people seem so reluctant. It's not a big deal. It's not like we would draw a Dirty... Er... Pancho Villa 'stache on them while they're out.

We may have to stop askin' and just start doin'. Not to me, of course, but to my carefully selected volunteers.

 

[lovemachine]

We may have to stop askin' and just start doin'. Not to me, of course, but to my carefully selected volunteers.

Just don't volunteer the Ginger!

 

[jdhaines]

I'm not at all convinced that this person has any knowledge about choking someone. In fact, I'd bet that he's never even choked a person.

 

[chizzle]

I found this thought provoking. I know there are some guys on INGO who train in martial arts with bladed instruments. What is recommended in this scenario?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ah_0gia4A0

Not standing next to the guy with the knife? Seriously, what else you gonna do? Have your gun aimed at his head?

 

[cedartop]

Threads like these can really reveal the need for Force on Force training. There are so many answers here that make me cringe. What is worse than doing nothing? Quite possibly doing the wrong thing!

Backing away? Good luck with that. It is shown time ofter time in FOF how this is a horible strategy against a aggressive driving attack. Creating distance is real easy to say, not so easy to do.

Running away? Well, maybe, if you know you are faster. Not only fast enough to get away, but fast enough to turn and get away. A knife in the back doesn't end up being a whole lot better than a knife in the front.

Speed Rock? haha, let me know how that goes for you.

He won't ever get that close to me! Sure, you never stand in a line? Your attention never wanders? Never distracted?

While my friend Chokey is a little doubtful of FOF because it is not the real thing, it is as close to the real thing as most people will get unless the thing they are training for really happens. For all of those who have answered with what they would do, have you tried it? Under resistance? Have you had a guy come at you like in the first video? Like Josh says, once you get the moves down you have to increase the intensity and violence until you get it approaching the real deal. It is amazing how much stuff falls apart then. Nothing may work perfectly under every situation, but you sure will be better able to stay in the fight if you have already seen what is happening to you and have some idea of what really works. Not just what you have visuallized you would do or what someone on the net would do.

 

[cedartop]

I'm not at all convinced that this person has any knowledge about choking someone. In fact, I'd bet that he's never even choked a person.

Josh, I think you guys need to meet up. I'll observe!

 

[cedartop]

Speaking of FOF, where has Shay been?

 

[Double T]

Threads like these can really reveal the need for Force on Force training. There are so many answers here that make me cringe. What is worse than doing nothing? Quite possibly doing the wrong thing!

Backing away? Good luck with that. It is shown time ofter time in FOF how this is a horible strategy against a aggressive driving attack. Creating distance is real easy to say, not so easy to do.

Running away? Well, maybe, if you know you are faster. Not only fast enough to get away, but fast enough to turn and get away. A knife in the back doesn't end up being a whole lot better than a knife in the front.

Speed Rock? haha, let me know how that goes for you.

He won't ever get that close to me! Sure, you never stand in a line? Your attention never wanders? Never distracted?

While my friend Chokey is a little doubtful of FOF because it is not the real thing, it is as close to the real thing as most people will get unless the thing they are training for really happens. For all of those who have answered with what they would do, have you tried it? Under resistance? Have you had a guy come at you like in the first video? Like Josh says, once you get the moves down you have to increase the intensity and violence until you get it approaching the real deal. It is amazing how much stuff falls apart then. Nothing may work perfectly under every situation, but you sure will be better able to stay in the fight if you have already seen what is happening to you and have some idea of what really works. Not just what you have visuallized you would do or what someone on the net would do.

Yes, I have tried it just like the video

 

[riverman67]

I have tried some of what I posted about. Not this exact scenario but close.
I didn't have a coat in my hand and we didn't start right on top of each other.The distance was about 10ft.The attacker had a small taser,that was how you knew if you got cut.
As others have posted at this distance you most likely wont know you have been cut until the fight is over.
It's scary ****

 

[Double T]

I have tried some of what I posted about. Not this exact scenario but close.
I didn't have a coat in my hand and we didn't start right on top of each other.The distance was about 10ft.The attacker had a small taser,that was how you knew if you got cut.
As others have posted at this distance you most likely wont know you have been cut until the fight is over.
It's scary ****

That is a great learning technique actually, it would make the hands clench. Good stuff.