We NEED Gun Control

[jbombelli]

I guess everyone is mis-understanding me. I did not say we need gun control as in taking away our right to bear arms, or taking away our guns. However, there needs to be a better way to keep guns out of the hands of idiots. In the instance of Sandy Hook. His mom had to have known that her son had mental problems. Keep the damn guns locked up out of reach. If people would just think a little bit, put precautions in use BEFORE groups of people get slaughtered, maybe this stuff would not happen AS MUCH. I know you cant stop all of it, but there has to be a way to stop this before the government actually starts passing some of this crap that they are trying to get passed. They eventually are going to get these bills passed if the slaughter doesn't stop. WHEN it happens, is too late to complain.

That is an impossible task. You cannot keep guns out of the hands of idiots who have not yet committed any real crimes without taking them away from everyone. Period. As long as those idiots are free to walk the streets with the rest of us they will be able to get whatever weapons any of us can get.

Truly the only way to stop them would be to either lock them away or execute them before they ever do something to deserve it. And that is not what this country is about.

 

[Johnny C]

Tobacco kills 5 million a year. Why don't we focus on that if we really want to save lives.

Because it isnt about saving lives

 

[Johnny C]

Do you really want psychiatrists determining who can own a gun? Have they ever been anything but flaming anti-gun, anti-morality liberal progressives? They are part of the problem!

The problem, at least in part, is we have raised a generation that does not believe right-wrong or good-evil paradigms are valid or apply to them. They have been taught that they are "special" all their lives and cannot accept denial of anything they want; or that racists have held them back from success; or that they have been oppressed; etc. They think they are entitled to something, so when they cannot get it they have to blame someone. Then, since there is no moral code at work, they strike back. Why not, they have never been held accountable for their actions (remember, the shrinks say it is bad to hold them accountable or punish them) so they expect to get away with this, too. It was not their fault, after all; it was all those others who were mean to them.

I suggest a return to core values. Definitive statements of right and wrong, no situational ethics. Discipline and training based on personal accountability. Children raised by a father, who shows the boys how to act like a real man, and a mother, who teaches the girls how to be ladies; where the family interactions teach mutual love, respect, honor, responsibility, concern for the neighbor, good/proper citizenship, a proper work ethic, delayed gratification and the preservation of the fruits of one's labor.

Call me old fashioned, but these values built a powerful nation. The abandonment of them have given us what we now have. If we continue to do what we are now doing, we will continue to get what we now have. I believe we have left the path of wisdom for folly, and are now reaping the harvest of what we have sown. Fascism will be the result, unless something intervenes and turns our culture towards wisdom once again.

AMEN BROTHER!

 

[netsecurity]

We can do a better job of treating mental health issues, besides doctors with revolving doors just prescribing Prozac. Anti-depressants are probably the single biggest failure known to medicine, but the drug companies get so rich off them that no one will admit the obvious. So IMO the SOMETHING that must be done is to have a safe place for people with mental illness to go where they won't be stigmatized, but will get the treatment they need. I see all these shootings as an extreme example of cries for help and deep hopelessness.

I also believe, as harsh as this may sound, that the seriously ill should be made sterile at the earliest age possible. We have too many crazy people in this country now, and they are not only a burden, but it has gotten to the point where many are ticking time bombs. The mass murders are most definitely a MAJOR mental health problem, not a gun problem. Our own mentally ill citizens are more of a threat to us than Al Quaeda, SOMETHING must be done about that I say.

 

[armedindy]

" a growing problem".......someone fact check me, but havent violent gun usage stats dropped like 40% in the last 20 years? how is that growth again?

 

[eldirector]

" a growing problem".......someone fact check me, but havent violent gun usage stats dropped like 40% in the last 20 years? how is that growth again?

You are correct.
Just a quick Google:

I had a bunch of these collected at one point, but I'd have to dig them up now. Just illustrates how perception can often be different than fact.

 

[Streak]

Political Correctness and Stupid Policies Yielded Up The Navy Yard MassacreBy Doug Giles / 22 September 2013 / 97 comments Screen Shot 2013-09-22 at 8.19.24 AMIs anyone else ticked that we’ve all been forced to know the now-dead-and-in-hell piece of shiitake named Aaron Alexis? However livid we may be, I’m sure it can’t compare to the rage the family members and friends of the ones he mowed down must feel.For those who only watch MTV and have no clue who Aaron Alexis is, well, he’s the dude that shot and killed twelve innocent people at the Navy Yard military base in D.C. last Monday. That would be as in Washington, D.C. It’s the same D.C. that has uberstrict, leftist guns laws in place that, once again, appear to appeal to mass murderers. Duh.Not only does the District of Columbia have ridiculous and unconstitutional gun laws, but also, thanks to former president Bill Clinton, our military bases are verboten to protect themselves on bases nationwide. Yep, one of Bill’s first acts upon taking office in ’93 was to disarm soldiers while they were on base.Here’s a pop quiz for you: Guess how many shootings have occurred on our U.S. military bases prior to this gun ban? If you guessed zero then you’re an astute cookie. Now guess the number of shootings that have gone down since Clinton enacted his idiotic gun ban? If you guessed sixteen you’d be right on. What’s up with Bill and “Benghazi Hillary” not wanting to protect our soldiers? Weird, eh?Anyway, as stated, last Monday Alexis, high on stupidity and self pity and in obedience to the “voices”, weaseled his way onto one of our multitudinous, unarmed military bases and wreaked havoc with the dastardly AR-15.Oh, wait. He didn’t use an AR-15. But OMG, that didn’t stop Piers Morgan from wanting him to have used one, so much so that, facts be damned, Piers ran with that intentional lie on his unwatched cable show. And, man oh man, he was really selling that swill until the facts smacked him in the face that, contrary to his agenda, it was a Remington 870 shotgun that Alexis wielded.What’s next, Piers? Are you going to try to ban the 870? Good luck with that one, you snaggle-toothed Brit. This cherished scattergun is ensconced as an esteemed piece of slide-gun American history. It’s right up there with the lever-gun Winchester 94. But you probably have no idea what the heck I’m talking about, do you?Along with Clinton’s goofy, gun-free-zone, military base mandate, there were many other breakdowns in agencies and communities that allowed this demonic seed to take root and produce mass murderous fruit.To be positive, here’s what I recommend that we do, going forward, to greatly reduce the likelihood of this ever occurring again:1. Dear NSA: Since you guys like to snoop, why don’t you peel away from hacking blue-haired, Presbyterian, Tea Party grannies’ email accounts for awhile and, I don’t know, maybe poke around a bit into the in-box of the criminally insane? Alexis had a military disciplinary record that included disorderly conduct, defiance, unexcused absences and hearing voices.His dull friends and relatives have also pointed out that he had a preoccupation with the 9/11 attacks, felt “screwed over” as a veteran, had money problems, and hated the U.S.His police record records that this idiot had rage blackouts, shot his neighbors tires out and popped a cap in his neighbor’s apartment because she was too loud for his tastes. Oh, and right before he went full moron he created a web-page named “Mohammed Salem” But somehow, some way, you missed this cat that was waving more red flags than a Chinese parade. It’s kind of similar to how you missed the Boston Bombers and Nadil Malik Hassan. No offense, of course.2. Dear friends and family members: If you knew all that crap about Aaron, then why didn’t you tase that SOB, duct tape him and then transport Woody Woodpecker to an exorcist or to that insane asylum that they put Hannibal Lecter in? Geez, people. Really? Look, I know you want to be positive and an encourager to those going through a rough patch, but this cat clearly had derailed and you did squat about it. Good luck sleeping at night, jackasses.3. Dear Therapeutic community: Can we get back to scraping frontal lobes and administering electroshock to those who’re violent and talk to Labradoodles? I know it’s brutal, but it’s not as cruel as having to bury twelve innocent people because you released this high-octane zombie with high-octane dope back into the public arena.4. And lastly, Dear President Obama: How about allowing our military on our military bases to carry their military weapons? Sure Alexis might have gotten off a shot, but it would have been, probably, just one round before our elite forces would have made Swiss cheese out of that foul weed.If my advice were heeded, I’m betting that we wouldn’t be forced to know many more like Aaron Alexis.What do you think America?Sorry, but that is the way it posted from my attempt to copy and paste.

******* that's a wall of text. Instead of copy/pasting, can you just summarize it?

 

[Streak]

You are correct.
Just a quick Google:

I had a bunch of these collected at one point, but I'd have to dig them up now. Just illustrates how perception can often be different than fact.

To be fair, population is growing. So if the amount of crime remains the same or the incidences decrease, but are more severe you'd expect to see a graph like above.

 

[armedindy]

To be fair, population is growing. So if the amount of crime remains the same or the incidences decrease, but are more severe you'd expect to see a graph like above.

to be fair, population growth is an important variable in the situation..you cant just discount the graph because the pop. has incresed....the graph is saying that YOU are LESS likely to be impacted by violent gun use NOW than you were twenty years ago.......i guess what im saying is "whats your point?"

 

[eldirector]

Actually, that graph accounts for changes in population. It is normalized to "per 1000".

So, you are less likely to be a victim of a violent crime in say, 2009 than in 1994. Somewhere around 3X less likely.

 

[VERT]

Actually, that graph accounts for changes in population. It is normalized to "per 1000".

So, you are less likely to be a victim of a violent crime in say, 2009 than in 1994. Somewhere around 3X less likely.

That graph only goes until 2009. I do believe that "violent crime" is again on the rise. Keep in mind that "violent crime" is not the same as murders using firearms. There is a lot of crime that does not involve the use of guns.

 

[longbarrel]

Ok, who has read or seen Obamas new speech on the new shootings? I don't want to start a war, but something really does need to be done. We or someone, has to find a way to get guns out of the hands of these idiots that are not only screwing up our right to bear arms, but that are KILLING people. That is a REAL problem. A growing problem. A problem that needs to be stopped. Background checks is not the answer. So, what is the answer. What if one of our family members was one of the people killed? What would we suggest to be done? THIS REALLY HAS TO STOP! SOMETHING HAS TO BE DONE. But what?????

I think that we as citizens have to work together, in an open and honest way, to show that firearms are not bad. And we need to help inform all of the "**** for brains" the same things. To start a post on one of the biggest firearms sites in the Mid-West, with "We NEED Gun Control" might be showing lack of tact? It might also mean that you fall into the latter category, previously mentioned? Either way, probably should re-consider post title. None of my business, but just trying to save you a lot of problems.(if you really want to be a part of this site) Just a side note, the President does not write his own speeches. He has a team of lackeys do it for him. They know who to "fluff" who to "**** off" and who to flat out "ignore"

 

[indydrew1]

To be fair, population is growing. So if the amount of crime remains the same or the incidences decrease, but are more severe you'd expect to see a graph like above.

The graph is per 1000, 12 and older. So your point is invalided. It's also invalid because more people=more crime, more everything. Yet that is not the case.


The fact is violent crime in the US is and has been going down for a long time. Both sides (every side, including our side, NRA) and the media don't like to point that out. Fear=sales=money. Fear sells, sex sells. Facts rarely do.

The big difference between now and then is;
Fox News
CNN
MSNBC
HLN
50 others.

Less crime is reported more often, by more sources for a longer period of time.

Fear=money. Never forget that

 

[indydrew1]

That graph only goes until 2009. I do believe that "violent crime" is again on the rise. Keep in mind that "violent crime" is not the same as murders using firearms. There is a lot of crime that does not involve the use of guns.

http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/uc...-in-the-u.s.-2011/violent-crime/violent-crime

From the FBI.

Fear=Money

 

[VERT]

IndyDrew you are correct the overall trend for violent crime has been decreasing. Violent crime increased 0.7 percent in 2012 compared to 2011. I would not consider that a decrease so much as a leveling off or a blip. Interestingly enough I have seen similar data presented in different ways. Apparently this data shows violent crime as sort of a hierarchy where the most serious offense is counted. Firearms were used in 69% of murders and 22% of aggravated assaults. So even without guns there would be plenty of violent crime.

 

[45 LongColt]

I think that we as citizens have to work together, in an open and honest way, to show that firearms are not bad. And we need to help inform all of the "**** for brains" the same things. To start a post on one of the biggest firearms sites in the Mid-West, with "We NEED Gun Control" might be showing lack of tact? It might also mean that you fall into the latter category, previously mentioned? Either way, probably should re-consider post title. None of my business, but just trying to save you a lot of problems.(if you really want to be a part of this site) Just a side note, the President does not write his own speeches. He has a team of lackeys do it for him. They know who to "fluff" who to "**** off" and who to flat out "ignore"

Yeah, I chose a wrong title. But, the content remains the same. Something needs to change, before the government REALLY screws us up.

 

[VERT]

Yeah, I chose a wrong title. But, the content remains the same. Something needs to change, before the government REALLY screws us up.

I think we need to pass a law that says we can't pass any new laws until they remove an old law.

 

[yepthatsme]

I think we need to pass a law that says we can't pass any new laws until they remove an old law.

I would love to see congress limited to passing a law on it's own merit, without being able to attach amendments. Of course, that will never happen.

 

[wildhair]

I think you need to look at where almost all violent crimes occur. It's not wide spread, it mostly only happens in certain neighborhoods and is committed by certain groups. These people grow up in dis-functional families with no morals or values and they pass in to their offspring. This stuff is normal where they live, but the mass media will only focus on the sensational stories that give the politicians reason to say... See, look at this, we need more laws, something has to be done, are we going to bow to the NRA again. The politicians aren't stupid they know who the target is, it's not the crime, it's our guns. The people that commit these crimes don't belong the NRA, they don't have to pay for a permit or register their guns. Only the law abiding citizens have to that crap.

 

[the1kidd03]

There is a lot of crime that does not involve the use of guns.

Firearms are used in around 8% of all violent crimes. It ranges between 7-9% in recent years. Regardless, that's pretty insignificant in my book.

To further make matters worse for this "we must do something" crowd, the BOJ also reports that more than 70% of THOSE guns used in crimes were obtained illegally (straw purchases, theft, etc.) Actually 72% is the most recent one I heard touted in the senate debate earlier in the year (if you wish to believe what they have to say.) Prior to that their most recent figure I could find was over 80% (82 or 86% if I remember correctly.)

The evidence simply does NOT support gun control of any type. They merely pick anecdotal examples which support their agenda as supposed "evidence" to appeal to people's emotions.