Vaccinations. Yes or no ?

[hooky]

You make the decision.......YOU and your children live with the consequences.

I think that's all anyone is really asking for at the end of the day.

 

[findingZzero]

I think either one would improve his posts drastically.

What's wrong with my posts other than they're not in color?

 

[rambone]

ALT-F4 worked for me.

 

[steveh_131]

Just a little friendly ribbing.

I suggest you leave the colors and font sizes alone. Focus on learning to use the 'quote' button underneath a person's post to respond to them.

 

[DadOfFour]

Fortunately (or unfortunately), parents are allowed to screw up their children almost any way they want. I personally don't give a flying f*** if you get your kid immunized or not. BUT........don't come crying to me or anyone else if they get polio, measles, mumps or any other preventable disease and expect me or the government to pay for their treatment or disabilities when they go blind or are crippled or any other result of a disease that could have been prevented and you CHOSE not to have immunizations. You make the decision.......YOU and your children live with the consequences.

I would never expect somebody else to pay for mine or my children's medical costs. All I'm asking is, stop calling me a bad parent, or threatening to "remove me from society" because I made a decision, after tons of research, to exercise my freedom to choose.

 

[findingZzero]

Just a little friendly ribbing.

I suggest you leave the colors and font sizes alone. Focus on learning to use the 'quote' button underneath a person's post to respond to them.

You mean like this?

That really a suggestion or is it a
demand...."damn u sarcasm" it just sneaks up on me sometimes (all-the-time)

 

[RockofStrength]

I have never understood the logic that says that anyone should be forced to immunize themselves. By the logic presented, drinkable alcohol should be a banned substance (you might abuse it and hurt people) along with cigarettes, I should be forced to take public transportation, (you might lose control of your vehicle/not pay attention/ be too tired to drive) be told who to vote for, what company to work at (you need to choose the job that you are most efficient at so that you benefit society the most), all my guns should be taken from me, and so on. Everything I do, from waking up to sleeping to eating, benefits someone and hurts someone else.


The job of the government is to protect my freedoms, not give me a healthy bubble of slavery so that everyone else can be safe from risks that can merely be reduced, not eliminated. Giving up my right to be free from vaccination is not implied by my living in any society, modern or otherwise. Vaccines are a convenience afforded by science that potentially permits me to live longer, nothing more.

 

[Fletch]

 

[Hogwylde]

I would never expect somebody else to pay for mine or my children's medical costs. All I'm asking is, stop calling me a bad parent, or threatening to "remove me from society" because I made a decision, after tons of research, to exercise my freedom to choose.

I would think, that if you "choose" to not get your children immunized, and they catch a disease that could have been prevented, and they DIE or go blind/deaf/are crippled, etc......... that you WOULD be a bad parent.

But, unfortunately, being a bad parent isn't against the law unless is crosses the line of child abuse. So quit whining about being called a "bad parent". As long as it's not illegal, you can be as bad as a parent as you want.

 

[DadOfFour]

I would think, that if you "choose" to not get your children immunized, and they catch a disease that could have been prevented, and they DIE or go blind/deaf/are crippled, etc......... that you WOULD be a bad parent.

But, unfortunately, being a bad parent isn't against the law unless is crosses the line of child abuse. So quit whining about being called a "bad parent". As long as it's not illegal, you can be as bad as a parent as you want.

By the same token, wouldn't giving your child a vaccine with known instances of horrible side effects (ie the HPV vaccine causing Guillain-Barré syndrome) make you a "bad parent"?

 

[Misplaced Yankee]

By the same token, wouldn't giving your child a vaccine with known instances of horrible side effects (ie the HPV vaccine causing Guillain-Barré syndrome) make you a "bad parent"?

I don't think it makes you a bad parent at all dad, just making emotional decisions. You're betting against a 1 in 100,000 chance in getting a disease that's highly curable, which is quite often caused by the disease it's trying to protect you against, for a 1 in 1,000 chance of your child dying of measles if they get it. 95% need to stay vaccinated, or it can punch holes in general safety. So if two kids in your class of 20 aren't vaccinated, it has the potential to screw it up for everyone.

Quick and cheap research to back me up
Guillain
Measles - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

For people who want to compare this to guns, cars, etc, we do everything we can to reduce chances of risk. Seatbelts, airbags, public opinion of people being stupid, drop safeties, training classes, and lastly, vaccinations. If you want to make your decision, go ahead. But keep it to yourself, and realize it's an emotional decision.

 

[Lex Concord]

I don't think it makes you a bad parent at all dad, just making emotional decisions. You're betting against a 1 in 100,000 chance in getting a disease that's highly curable, which is quite often caused by the disease it's trying to protect you against, for a 1 in 1,000 chance of your child dying of measles if they get it. 95% need to stay vaccinated, or it can punch holes in general safety. So if two kids in your class of 20 aren't vaccinated, it has the potential to screw it up for everyone.

Quick and cheap research to back me up
Guillain
Measles - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

For people who want to compare this to guns, cars, etc, we do everything we can to reduce chances of risk. Seatbelts, airbags, public opinion of people being stupid, drop safeties, training classes, and lastly, vaccinations. If you want to make your decision, go ahead. But keep it to yourself, and realize it's an emotional decision.

Boy, I miss the days when I knew everything.

With any luck, someday, you will too.

 

[Blackhawk2001]

I don't think it makes you a bad parent at all dad, just making emotional decisions. You're betting against a 1 in 100,000 chance in getting a disease that's highly curable, which is quite often caused by the disease it's trying to protect you against, for a 1 in 1,000 chance of your child dying of measles if they get it. 95% need to stay vaccinated, or it can punch holes in general safety. So if two kids in your class of 20 aren't vaccinated, it has the potential to screw it up for everyone.

Quick and cheap research to back me up
Guillain
Measles - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

For people who want to compare this to guns, cars, etc, we do everything we can to reduce chances of risk. Seatbelts, airbags, public opinion of people being stupid, drop safeties, training classes, and lastly, vaccinations. If you want to make your decision, go ahead. But keep it to yourself, and realize it's an emotional decision.

I'm so glad you're on top of this. My brother was 52 when he developed Gullain-Barr and it wasn't from the measles. I can attest through personal knowledge that we both had the measles at the same time when I was 8 and he was 5. He DID have his mandatory flu shot ( he works for the Air Force) about a week before he started developing symptoms. He was told that 20 years prior to 2006, if he'd come down with it, he'd probably have died, so while it may be "highly curable" nowadays, it hasn't always been so.

And face it, most of us "oldsters" had the measles when we were young and very few died from it - about the 1 - 100,000 figure you're quoting. Why subject our children to the unknowns of vaccination side effects when the "knowns" of common childhood diseases are inconvenient but survivable. That's not "emotion", that's acting on observable data.

 

[Misplaced Yankee]

I'm so glad you're on top of this. My brother was 52 when he developed Gullain-Barr and it wasn't from the measles. I can attest through personal knowledge that we both had the measles at the same time when I was 8 and he was 5. He DID have his mandatory flu shot ( he works for the Air Force) about a week before he started developing symptoms. He was told that 20 years prior to 2006, if he'd come down with it, he'd probably have died, so while it may be "highly curable" nowadays, it hasn't always been so.

And face it, most of us "oldsters" had the measles when we were young and very few died from it - about the 1 - 100,000 figure you're quoting. Why subject our children to the unknowns of vaccination side effects when the "knowns" of common childhood diseases are inconvenient but survivable. That's not "emotion", that's acting on observable data.

It's 1 in a 1,000 for measles. 1 in 100,000 is for the curable Gullain-Barr. Very few do die, it's a slim chance in civilized countries. As for the "young and know everything" crack, I'm young enough to do stupid things, but old enough to pay for it the next day. Most of my friends my age have kids, some as old as 7-8. I've seen this argument before, and made my own opinion. I will state this, everyone I know has eventually immunized their children. Every single one of them. So far there has been no side effects. No autism, no paralyzed children, no anything. So my sample size, while small, 20-30, has been clean.

We also couple this with the fact that I'm married to a kindergarten teacher. Her sample size, of 25-30 children a year over 7 years, has shown no children with a negative reaction to vaccinations. She has had only one child without immunizations. So out of 250 or so sample size, there has been no side affects. No problems. While she has had autistic children, and children with other learning disabilities, not one has had the correlation of shots=disease. The symptoms were visible before, or well after their first rounds of shots.

My area/generation got their shots. We all did. I come from an spot in the US where you didn't have a choice. We didn't see any of these diseases. I'm still getting calls of "how the hell did measles break out at the super bowl?" "how backward is it to not get something that keeps you from getting sick" and "why would people voluntarily put their kids at risk? Are they poor? Can we donate or something to get their kids shots?" so I guess I see this differently. But hey, to each their own. I'm fine with you doing what feels right. I just don't understand how you can get defensive after people who make decisions for the greater good don't want your children with theirs. Same as if I wouldn't want someone who drove down the middle of the road on the same streets as me. Your call, but there's going to be consequences.

And anyone who compares this to firearms is comparing apples to oranges. Less kids get hurt by firearms then bikes. You're twice as likely to kill yourself with a gun then to be shot by someone else. The numbers state it's just not happening. If guns had a 1 in 1,000 lethal rate, I could understand why people wouldn't live around people who had them. But they don't. People who want guns banned/locked away are making the exact same type of emotional decision. They feel it's bad, so the numbers that agree with their feelings are truth. Everything else is wrong.

 

[starbreather]

Vaccinations worked wonderfully to stomp out polio, but with all the up rise against I am sure polio will make a come back.

 

[findingZzero]

""Boy, I miss the days when I knew everything.

With any luck, someday, you will too.""

Ahh, it's come to this.

Take that, statistics!

You can lead a horse to water, but before you push him in remember what a wet horse smells like.

 

[Lex Concord]

It's 1 in a 1,000 for measles. 1 in 100,000 is for the curable Gullain-Barr. Very few do die, it's a slim chance in civilized countries. As for the "young and know everything" crack, I'm young enough to do stupid things, but old enough to pay for it the next day. Most of my friends my age have kids, some as old as 7-8. I've seen this argument before, and made my own opinion. I will state this, everyone I know has eventually immunized their children. Every single one of them. So far there has been no side effects. No autism, no paralyzed children, no anything. So my sample size, while small, 20-30, has been clean.

We also couple this with the fact that I'm married to a kindergarten teacher. Her sample size, of 25-30 children a year over 7 years, has shown no children with a negative reaction to vaccinations. She has had only one child without immunizations. So out of 250 or so sample size, there has been no side affects. No problems. While she has had autistic children, and children with other learning disabilities, not one has had the correlation of shots=disease. The symptoms were visible before, or well after their first rounds of shots.

My area/generation got their shots. We all did. I come from an spot in the US where you didn't have a choice. We didn't see any of these diseases. I'm still getting calls of "how the hell did measles break out at the super bowl?" "how backward is it to not get something that keeps you from getting sick" and "why would people voluntarily put their kids at risk? Are they poor? Can we donate or something to get their kids shots?" so I guess I see this differently. But hey, to each their own. I'm fine with you doing what feels right. I just don't understand how you can get defensive after people who make decisions for the greater good don't want your children with theirs. Same as if I wouldn't want someone who drove down the middle of the road on the same streets as me. Your call, but there's going to be consequences.

And anyone who compares this to firearms is comparing apples to oranges. Less kids get hurt by firearms then bikes. You're twice as likely to kill yourself with a gun then to be shot by someone else. The numbers state it's just not happening. If guns had a 1 in 1,000 lethal rate, I could understand why people wouldn't live around people who had them. But they don't. People who want guns banned/locked away are making the exact same type of emotional decision. They feel it's bad, so the numbers that agree with their feelings are truth. Everything else is wrong.

I was also a much better parent before I had kids.

Your sample size is irrelevant to me. Mine, while much smaller, is very relevant.

Avoiding vax may not be the best route for all...I'm not advocating that it is, not even for ourselves.

Have kids, experience a negative reaction, and get back with us on whether you still think you should be removed from society if you change your mind based on that experience.

My reference to firearms was a sarcastic dig at your apparent desire to remove risk from the world, but I think you know that.

There are consequences to every decision in life. To assume that someone who reaches a different conclusion than you where risk is involved does so based on emotion belies your relative youth and inexperience.

 

[Lex Concord]

""Boy, I miss the days when I knew everything.

With any luck, someday, you will too.""

Ahh, it's come to this.

Take that, statistics!

Had nothing to do with the statistics...I don't' think he got that either.

 

[findingZzero]

""Boy, I miss the days when I knew everything.

With any luck, someday, you will too.""

I like the quote though. Can I steal it?

 

[Lex Concord]

""Boy, I miss the days when I knew everything.

With any luck, someday, you will too.""

I like the quote though. Can I steal it?

It's not copyrighted. Feel free.

Sadly the linked material below might be, so I can't copy/paste, but it is food for thought:

A User-Friendly Vaccination Schedule by Donald W. Miller, Jr., MD

The author is an MD (appeal to authority, for those who care), not just some anti-vax nutjob.