The Official Redbrush/WSSC IDPA Thread

[DustyDawg48]

Brian is a freak...and I mean that in a good way My 625s will do much better than 3 at 20 but my 9 and 45 semis get that level of accuracy with the loads I've tried through them. Of course, all of this is freehand and that plays a part. I could probably tighten things up with different loads but have never tried it.

I think another factor here is the games you're playing. The toughest shot I've had in IDPA was a small pepper popper at 30 yards. Nailed it on the first shot and was greatly relieved. So relieved that I missed a large popper at 12 yards on my first shot in the next target array As the book even says "occasional" shots out to 30 yards or so is alright. But, by the book, most of the game must be played under 15 yards (as mentioned). In USPSA you probably need to tweak the maximum accuracy you can as those types of shot are more commonplace, at least in the clubs I've been around. I've come across some pretty gamey shots in USPSA.

Without degenerating into the "Indian versus Arrow" debate, how much really IS the round you shoot versus how well you can shoot the gun? In a very odd twist, I tend to stink it up when I go practice most of the time where I seem to be faster and more accurate during the match. I'd lay money that if I shot a COF by myself and then the same at a match, my match score would probably be better in terms of accuracy and speed than if I were there on my own.

 

[sbcman]

Without degenerating into the "Indian versus Arrow" debate, how much really IS the round you shoot versus how well you can shoot the gun? In a very odd twist, I tend to stink it up when I go practice most of the time where I seem to be faster and more accurate during the match. I'd lay money that if I shot a COF by myself and then the same at a match, my match score would probably be better in terms of accuracy and speed than if I were there on my own.

Of course your match score would be better. Too much conscious thinking going on during practice---it's back to that Enos thing. If you want to see your practice equal your match, run your practices flat out.

Upon further reflection of this entire topic, I guess I should offer that I never bag rounds for accuracy testing (for games, hunting is a different story). I always shoot them freehand. So, I guess I really don't know scientifically what my rounds are doing, but so far it's worked I can call a bad shot during accuracy testing as well as a good one, but that's as objective as it gets.

 

[DustyDawg48]

Of course your match score would be better. Too much conscious thinking going on during practice---it's back to that Enos thing. If you want to see your practice equal your match, run your practices flat out.

Upon further reflection of this entire topic, I guess I should offer that I never bag rounds for accuracy testing (for games, hunting is a different story). I always shoot them freehand. So, I guess I really don't know scientifically what my rounds are doing, but so far it's worked I can call a bad shot during accuracy testing as well as a good one, but that's as objective as it gets.

That is the way I am. I think I've bagged a few pistol shots just to make sure the sights actually line up sort of where I want it to. A bit does go into the gun. The 1911 just shoots so well and I love the gun but it isn't one of my favorites to shoot despite having started in IDPA with a 1911. I enjoy shooting my plastic fantastics much more.

 

[Grelber]

Without degenerating into the "Indian versus Arrow" debate, how much really IS the round you shoot versus how well you can shoot the gun?

I think the big boys look at it (accuracy) as just one of those parts that makes the whole. If your stuff is + - 2" and the other guy's is + - 1" then you are effectively shooting at a significantly smaller target than he is and you should require longer to aim and get the shot away. At a low skill level (me for instance) the errors might be on the lucky side almost as much as the other way, at higher skill levels I think it hurts though, particularly when steels /no shoots/ etc exacerbate the penalty for misses.

The Indian is the arrow, there is no spoon, there are FOUR lights.

 

[sbcman]

I think the big boys look at it (accuracy) as just one of those parts that makes the whole. If your stuff is + - 2" and the other guy's is + - 1" then you are effectively shooting at a significantly smaller target than he is and you should require longer to aim and get the shot away. At a low skill level (me for instance) the errors might be on the lucky side almost as much as the other way, at higher skill levels I think it hurts though, particularly when steels /no shoots/ etc exacerbate the penalty for misses.

The Indian is the arrow, there is no spoon, there are FOUR lights.

You'll want to check this out:
Old Spock battles New Spock in the greatest car commercial ever

 

[sbcman]

I think I've I ever have a course that requires 6 or so shots and I miss five I'll cry out: THERE....ARE.....FOUR...MIKES

And promptly grab may bag as I make my way to the truck

 

[Grelber]

I think I've I ever have a course that requires 6 or so shots and I miss five I'll cry out: THERE....ARE.....FOUR...MIKES

And promptly grab may bag as I make my way to the truck

 

[Kisada]

I would just like to be able to place 80% of my shots within a couple inches of where I "think" I'm aiming at. I'm still struggling with either hitting dead on the mark or completely missing the intended POI.

Not real sure where to go next, as far as improvement goes.
I feel I shoot a bit better during matches at RB than just casually standing there with a target 5-10 yds. in front of me (But then again, I've put far more trigger time in at IDPA than I have just practicing/plinking, under no pressure, timers, etc.

And with reloading and now casting, I feel I've might have too many factors going on to have any idea if my ammo is bad, load recipes are garbage or just me needing a lot more work in general.

 

[Grelber]

I would just like to be able to place 80% of my shots within a couple inches of where I "think" I'm aiming at. I'm still struggling with either hitting dead on the mark or completely missing the intended POI.

Not real sure where to go next, as far as improvement goes.
I feel I shoot a bit better during matches at RB than just casually standing there with a target 5-10 yds. in front of me (But then again, I've put far more trigger time in at IDPA than I have just practicing/plinking, under no pressure, timers, etc.

And with reloading and now casting, I feel I've might have too many factors going on to have any idea if my ammo is bad, load recipes are garbage or just me needing a lot more work in general.

A cheap 22 pistol is a good thing. They can shoot wild if you let them lead up real bad, and for some reason my 22 revolver leads up worse than anything else I've ever had, otherwise the ones I've shot are all good enough to let you know how well you are doing.

 

[Kisada]

A cheap 22 pistol is a good thing. They can shoot wild if you let them lead up real bad, and for some reason my 22 revolver leads up worse than anything else I've ever had, otherwise the ones I've shot are all good enough to let you know how well you are doing.

I've considered getting the 22 upper kit for my CZ but price and availability have made me put it off. Maybe I should get the wife one of those ruger mk3's she always stares at over at Whittakers, even though she doesn't really care that much for shooting.

 

[DustyDawg48]

I think most of my issues could be chalked up to grip. I don't think I have enough support hand grip on the gun when practicing and my shots tend to go wide by relaxing it. In a match, I probably have the desired death grip on the thing and will usually end up running a course not perfectly but with a level of accuracy I consider acceptable when coupled with the speed I try to run at.

Like TJ said, there is only you and the target in a match. During your range time practice your mind is filled with far too many distractions and you might not get a 'pure' sense of just how accurately you shoot your given weapon.

 

[Grelber]

I've considered getting the 22 upper kit for my CZ but price and availability have made me put it off. Maybe I should get the wife one of those ruger mk3's she always stares at over at Whittakers, even though she doesn't really care that much for shooting.

Smart !!!!

I put a dirt cheap BSA optic on my sister's Ruger and she really has fun with it.

Like TJ said, there is only you and the target in a match. During your range time practice your mind is filled with far too many distractions and you might not get a 'pure' sense of just how accurately you shoot your given weapon.

Sooner or later TJ will stop being stubborn and get a timer and then retract all of this sort of nonsense.

Shot a couple 2:09 down zero's yesterday practicing stage 1 of the classifier (2 body 1 head, 7yd). Wouldn't try that in a match but maybe it tells me my bogey should be something better than it has been in real life. Point being, with a timer and goals you can put match like pressure on yourself and learn stuff that is neat to know. If you are not focused the timer will tell you so and then you will focus.

 

[DustyDawg48]

Shot a couple 2:09 down zero's yesterday practicing stage 1 of the classifier (2 body 1 head, 7yd). Wouldn't try that in a match but maybe it tells me my bogey should be something better than it has been in real life. Point being, with a timer and goals you can put match like pressure on yourself and learn stuff that is neat to know. If you are not focused the timer will tell you so and then you will focus.

NICE! Why don't you think you'd try it in a match though?

I am honestly looking forward to the next classifier. I have yet to run a really good one; the one in Feb had the wheels coming off for me early on and I couldn't ever make it up fast enough. I'd like to get an honest classification in both SSP and CDP and be able to have a bit of a choice in what I'd like to shoot if I get the chance to go to the match in October at Sellersberg.

 

[Grelber]

NICE! Why don't you think you'd try it in a match though?

Someone has got a DVD of mine by Matt Burket, "How to shoot faster", or something like that.

Anyway, his thing is that practice is for shooting at and past your limits and it is ok and even necessary to miss a good bit while you are at it. For matches you back off to where the accuracy is acceptable.

I only mentioned the down zero's, there were many others

 

[sbcman]

Sooner or later TJ will stop being stubborn and get a timer and then retract all of this sort of nonsense.

There might just be something to that (the timer-training-pressure part, me being cheap and stubborn is a given). Never had thought of it that way. My plan was to obtain a timer for father's day, but 20k worth of primers and enough powder to shoot into retirement lead the wife to say otherwise

Just a thought here on practice. It really needs to be broke down into 2 parts- that which you are consciously training for and then shooting with the sub-conscious mind at work. You train your skills consciously and through repitition to the point that it becomes a sub-conscious activity. Also, it's a good practice to have a few drills that you run as fast as you can, just to get the feeling of it (borrowed that from Anderson).

To the 22 business, it's a good way to go. Burkett or Stoeger or someone talks about extensive 22 use. For the past several months it's just been easier and cheaper to load, but I'm seeing a lot of 22 come back around. Note though that when using 22 for practice, it's best to use only 22 and not mix it with your standard ammo platform. After a few hundred rounds of 22 even a 9mm will feel like it had a double charge

 

[sbcman]

Shot a couple 2:09 down zero's yesterday practicing stage 1 of the classifier (2 body 1 head, 7yd).

That's pretty good. My fastest string one time is 2.08 but my average on those three strings is 2.42. I'd like to get them all at 2.08 because those hundreds add up. But, they don't add up as quickly as -2.5

 

[DustyDawg48]

I think I managed a sub 2 second string...but missed a headshot so yeah, those Down 5's kinda sting

 

[sbcman]

Got this in the mail today, thought it was a pretty cool plaque









Picked this one up at the IL match, not sure if I posted it or not- cool plaque



Then there's this one, that I think you have seen (sorry, Jeff, if this brings up any repressed memories)



And, of course, my last SS plaque. Nice way to go out



What does all of this mean? It means this is the year for cool IDPA plaques

 

[DustyDawg48]

Very nice!

 

[Grelber]

Then there's this one, that I think you have seen (sorry, Jeff, if this brings up any repressed memories)

I did beat one guy in my division.

(Would have gotten a plaque if I was shooting a wheel gun).