The executive prerogative to not enforce laws

[T.Lex]

Are the qualifications for permanent residence status defined by statute , as with citizenship qualifications, or are those subject to change at the whim of the sitting POTUS and governed by EOs? Serious question.

I generally do not do "real" immigration (I've done some work permit stuff for clients and an interesting coram nobis case), but this is my understanding: the qualifications for PR status is statutory and cannot be altered. Some time a few years ago, they made it so that if you are here illegally, but married to a US citizen, you had to leave the country while they processed your PR application. There was a "hardship" exception, but under GWB, it was a high hurdle. It took more than just having family here.

So, some people stayed here as illegals because they didn't think they could get the hardship status. Oh, and I think if you didn't leave, not only could you not come back, if you did come back and got caught, you had to leave for 10 years. I may have that wrong, though.

Anyway, it SOUNDS like (this is speculation), Obama is saying that just having legal family here is enough to get "hardship" status, or that his DOJ won't fight a petition for hardship status under certain criteria. This will let people stay who otherwise would have had to leave.

(For some reason, I don't think the "make them leave" thing was labeled "deportation." I can't remember the phrase used - something like "voluntary removal" that wasn't particularly voluntary.)

Anyway, that's my understanding. The qualifications don't change, but the interpretation of the exceptions/defenses can.

 

[chipbennett]

Yes, I figured that was your goal. You really don't like where I'm headed with that follow-up question, do you? Is that why you won't answer it?

I'm quite willing to answer it, but I also want to stay on topic, and within the defined bounds of discussion at INGO.

 

[steveh_131]

I'm quite willing to answer it, but I also want to stay on topic, and within the defined bounds of discussion at INGO.

Morality is not a banned topic.

Let's hear it, chip.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

Yes.

How's that for an efficient answer?

Hardly lawyerly like. I mean it's not unusual to hear them ask for yes or no answers but to actually get one....I should go buy a lottery ticket.

 

[mrjarrell]

The Volokh Conspiracy pretty much puts to bed the whole unConstitutional or illegal thing.
Obama, immigration, and the rule of law [updated with additional material on precedents for Obama's action] - The Washington Post

 

[chipbennett]

Morality is not a banned topic.

Let's hear it, chip.

Ask your question.

 

[Expat]

So we approve of one person imposing his morality on the American public when it goes against the will of the American people, the will of Congress, flouts a properly enacted law...
It is really fascinating when you think about it... I guess that cult of personality thing is strong in INGO.

 

[mrjarrell]

So we approve of one person imposing his morality on the American public when it goes against the will of the American people, the will of Congress, flouts a properly enacted law...
It is really fascinating when you think about it... I guess that cult of personality thing is strong in INGO.

He is actually bending to the will of the American public. "The will of the American people" is FOR immigration reform, as poll after poll has consistently shown. The American people want immigration reform and the do nothing congress has consistently failed to do anything in that area. If the congress wants Obama's EO's on this matter to go away then all they have to do is get off their lazy asses and give the American people what they've been asking for for years.

Immigration Reform Proposals Garner Broad Support in U.S.
Immigration

 

[steveh_131]

Ask your question.

Should a member of the executive branch shirk all morality and do whatever is asked of him, if the correct process is used to ask it?

So we approve of one person imposing his morality on the American public when it goes against the will of the American people, the will of Congress, flouts a properly enacted law...
It is really fascinating when you think about it... I guess that cult of personality thing is strong in INGO.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I don't approve of his morality or his actions. My argument is only in favor of the system.

 

[cobber]

The Volokh Conspiracy pretty much puts to bed the whole unConstitutional or illegal thing.
Obama, immigration, and the rule of law [updated with additional material on precedents for Obama's action] - The Washington Post

Oh, that settles it then.


Yeah, I like how he argues poverty as a defense for law-breaking. That would go over well in a burglary trial, I'm sure... I was poor, I saw my neighbor had good stuff, so I decided to go help myself. After all, I'm poor!

Let me know if you hear of a prosecutor who no files based on that defense...

 

[HoughMade]

Government by poll rather than representative republic.....Oh joy.

 

[cobber]

And here's another little presidential billet-doux:

DHS Announces Temporary Protected Status Designations for Liberia, Guinea, and Sierra Leone | USCIS

 

[Phil502]

He is actually bending to the will of the American public. "The will of the American people" is FOR immigration reform, as poll after poll has consistently shown. The American people want immigration reform and the do nothing congress has consistently failed to do anything in that area. If the congress wants Obama's EO's on this matter to go away then all they have to do is get off their lazy asses and give the American people what they've been asking for for years.

Immigration Reform Proposals Garner Broad Support in U.S.
Immigration

Poll after poll does not show legalization/amnesty, it shows tougher security.

 

[mrjarrell]

Poll after poll does not show legalization/amnesty, it shows tougher security.

And, as is often the case that is just not so.

 

[mrjarrell]

The only ones yelling for the Berlin Wall and murdering people who try to cross the border are the INGOpublicans and the TEA Party fringe. The people of the US want a secure border, but they don't want wholesale deportations, which is just what Obama gave them.

 

[chipbennett]

He is actually bending to the will of the American public. "The will of the American people" is FOR immigration reform, as poll after poll has consistently shown. The American people want immigration reform and the do nothing congress has consistently failed to do anything in that area. If the congress wants Obama's EO's on this matter to go away then all they have to do is get off their lazy asses and give the American people what they've been asking for for years.

Immigration Reform Proposals Garner Broad Support in U.S.
Immigration

Damn the Constitution, Full speed ahead!

I'm pretty sure that, were the founding fathers still around and a President said, "because the Congress is failing to act, I'm going to act in their place" (and then did so), and "If the Congress doesn't like my Executive legislation, they can send me legislation that I'll sign", that President would have been summarily shot for treason.

"The will of the American people" is not relevant or applicable to the day-to-day operation of our form of government. We are not a democracy, and we do not act based on polls. The "will of the American people" is expressed in elections - the last of which quite thoroughly rejected the current president and his policies.

 

[HoughMade]

What makes you think a Gallup poll, or any other poll, represents the "will of the people"?

 

[chipbennett]

f Should a member of the executive branch shirk all morality and do whatever is asked of him, if the correct process is used to ask it?

That question is over-broad. The obvious answer is "no", but neither the question nor its answer adds anything to the discussion. Care to narrow it down reasonably?

 

[mrjarrell]

Damn the Constitution? He didn't do anything unConstitutional or even illegal. You really don't have a leg to stand on here.

 

[chipbennett]

What makes you think a Gallup poll, or any other poll, represents the "will of the people"?

Who cares about laws, we have polls!