Texas to take up bill requiring Ten Commandments in every public school

[DadSmith]

Look, I'm not disagreeing with you about this, I am disagreeing with Texas making the display of the Ten Commandments mandatory.

I believe state and federal government have no say, and it should be left to the people of each community where each school corporation is to decide. So in a way I agree.
Some think government sticking their nose into local business is less government. I see it as intrusive government. Let the local people decide what they want.

 

[Route 45]

I expect Ten Commandments posters to work just about as well as Gun Free Zone signs.

 

[DadSmith]

I expect Ten Commandments posters to work just about as well as Gun Free Zone signs.

I'm in agreement there. It takes more than that to change the moral guidance of children or adults. They have to be taught it.

 

[Gabriel]

Unfortunately, that's never going to pass.

Hopefully not.

 

[jamil]

You asked


I was going by what the founders, and forefathers had to say on the subject.
If you want to know if they thought it was a bad idea, and not a Christian founder or forefather you'll be hard pressed to find one that didn't believe in Jehovah or Christ.
So unless you can find a woke, transgender, secular humanist founder, or forefather we won't have any other input. We'll have to go with what the evil white founders, and forefathers believed, and wrote.

That’s obviously a false dichotomy. The alternative to Christians is not woke, transgender, secular humanists. But at the time there were no secular humanists, no transgenders, and woke only meant the past tense of wake. It's not even a realistic ask. But, if you want alternative opinions from the period, they were not all Christians. Most were.

Read Age of Reason by Thomas Paine to get an idea of the alternate thinking of the period. He wasn't the only one. Look also at what presidents did. Some were religious. Some were not.

 

[jamil]

I'm in agreement there. It takes more than that to change the moral guidance of children or adults. They have to be taught it.

You think a public school is going to do that? Or do you think that by posting the 10 commandments on walls, God will look favorably on you and smite the heathens? But what if they teach post-trib?

 

[jamil]

No it isn't established its stating what that community wants. If the community doesn't want anything so be it.
It should be left up to the community not the government.
How is putting up a poster with good moral guidance an establishment of religion?

If you're not allowing other religions to post theirs, it's an establishment of a favored religion by a government entity. I'm not sure how that's not obvious to you. How can the community that makes such edicts not be government? Who will declare these things? Who will enforce it? By what authority?

 

[jamil]

I'm still waiting on someone to explain how putting up a poster with good moral guidance is establishing a religion.

Isn't that a change of goal posts? Isn't it a lot more than that which you are advocating. I've already said I have no problem with Christians putting up a poster with their moral guidance. I suspect though, that you're not in favor of allowing all religions to post theirs. So am I wrong about that? Do you want Christians to be able to exclusively post their religious beliefs in schools? Or can everyone?

 

[jamil]

I believe state and federal government have no say, and it should be left to the people of each community where each school corporation is to decide. So in a way I agree.
Some think government sticking their nose into local business is less government. I see it as intrusive government. Let the local people decide what they want.

Who enforces what they want? How does that get codified? How does that get enforced? By a school board? THAT's government! Those are elected offices.

 

[K_W]

Texas to take up bill requiring Ten Commandments in every public school classroom

The Texas state Senate Education Committee this week will take up a bill requiring the Ten Commandments to be installed in every public school classroom, and another that would allow schools to hire pastors or chaplains instead of counselors."A public elementary or secondary school shall display...

www.rawstory.com

Won't survive the courts. Been here, done this. They will have to allow all religions, and then school becomes a petty religious war zone instead of a place of reason, learning, and leftist political indoctrination.

 

[jamil]

Won't survive the courts. Been here, done this. They will have to allow all religions, and then school becomes a petty religious war zone instead of a place of reason, learning, and leftist political indoctrination.

I'd be quite happy to see SCOTUS consider hard political ideology as a religion. It behaves like one. So it's definitely protected free speech. But governments can't establish a defacto religion or hard ideology. Indoctrination in public schools should be unconstitutional.

 

[DadSmith]

Isn't that a change of goal posts? Isn't it a lot more than that which you are advocating. I've already said I have no problem with Christians putting up a poster with their moral guidance. I suspect though, that you're not in favor of allowing all religions to post theirs. So am I wrong about that? Do you want Christians to be able to exclusively post their religious beliefs in schools? Or can everyone?

You do know that on the South both black, and white schools taught conservative Evangelical Protestant teaching of the Bible through the end of World War II.

The North did so through the Civil War.

So how is it that for around 150 years public schools around the country taught biblical principles, and now it's unconstitutional?

 

[jamil]

You do know that on the South both black, and white schools taught conservative Evangelical Protestant teaching of the Bible through the end of World War II.

The North did so through the Civil War.

So how is it that for around 150 years public schools around the country taught biblical principles, and now it's unconstitutional?

Why not answer the question? Do you want schools to let Christians post their religious materials but not let other religions post theirs? Or am I mistaken about that. Because if you want posters of the 10 commandments allowed, and you're okay with other religion's putting up their posters, I don't think we're in disagreement.

 

[DadSmith]

Why not answer the question? Do you want schools to let Christians post their religious materials but not let other religions post theirs? Or am I mistaken about that. Because if you want posters of the 10 commandments allowed, and you're okay with other religion's putting up their posters, I don't think we're in disagreement.

I already answered that question above. When I stated it should be left to the local community to decide what they want. Local community isn't the government. It can tell the local school board what they want and it should be implemented without hesitation. Government should not be involved in what the local community decides they want.

I don't get this modern belief that the Bible isn't allowed in schools for teaching children when it has been in the past. More years than it hasn't been used. What Supreme Court ruling removed it from schools? Or was it secular humanist, and communists?

 

[jamil]

I already answered that question above. When I stated it should be left to the local community to decide what they want. Local community isn't the government. It can tell the local school board what they want and it should be implemented without hesitation. Government should not be involved in what the local community decides they want.

I don't get this modern belief that the Bible isn't allowed in schools for teaching children when it has been in the past. More years than it hasn't been used. What Supreme Court ruling removed it from schools? Or was it secular humanist, and communists?

So you are definitely saying that Christians, in that community, get to put up Christian stuff. But only Christians. Not any other religion. Right? A simple yes or no will do to confirm.

 

[DadSmith]

So you are definitely saying that Christians, in that community, get to put up Christian stuff. But only Christians. Not any other religion. Right? A simple yes or no will do to confirm.

Texas to take up bill requiring Ten Commandments in every public school

Wow. I don't think I knew that it housed a school back then. The campus and some of the buildings are kinda neat. They're old, dilapidated and still had flaking lead paint in some areas. But the woodwork and other details were fantastic, if viewed for the decadence. The school itself sucked. No...

www.indianagunowners.com

I believe I answered that already.

 

[jamil]

Texas to take up bill requiring Ten Commandments in every public school

Wow. I don't think I knew that it housed a school back then. The campus and some of the buildings are kinda neat. They're old, dilapidated and still had flaking lead paint in some areas. But the woodwork and other details were fantastic, if viewed for the decadence. The school itself sucked. No...

www.indianagunowners.com

I believe I answered that already.

Not exactly. I’d like you to acknowledge both parts. Because it involves both parts.

In your ideal community may Christians put up the 10 commandments but other religions are not put up their religious posters? It seems that when I put it that way, you don’t want to answer the question. Do you not want to say that you’d forbid other religions from putting their posters up? That you’d make this community standard strictly Christian?

 

[actaeon277]

 

[DadSmith]

Not exactly. I’d like you to acknowledge both parts. Because it involves both parts.

In your ideal community may Christians put up the 10 commandments but other religions are not put up their religious posters? It seems that when I put it that way, you don’t want to answer the question. Do you not want to say that you’d forbid other religions from putting their posters up? That you’d make this community standard strictly Christian?

Again if the community wants to put up something from their local religion than as stated the school board should comply.
If they are Hindu, Buddhist, Muslims, Christians, Jews etc.
If the community wants something from their religious beliefs in their local community schools it should be done.
I don't know how much simpler I can put this.
It should be left to the local community to tell the local school board what they want or don't want.
State, and federal government should keep their nose out of this since they have no right to stick their nose in it in the first place.

You do know there are cities in Michigan and Minnesota that have a majority of Muslims, and LA has many Koreans, Japanese, and Chinese Americans who probably follow Buddhist teaches.

Each community can and should have a say as to what their children are being taught.

 

[KLB]

Again if the community wants to put up something from their local religion than as stated the school board should comply.
If they are Hindu, Buddhist, Muslims, Christians, Jews etc.
If the community wants something from their religious beliefs in their local community schools it should be done.
I don't know how much simpler I can put this.
It should be left to the local community to tell the local school board what they want or don't want.
State, and federal government should keep their nose out of this since they have no right to stick their nose in it in the first place.

You do know there are cities in Michigan and Minnesota that have a majority of Muslims, and LA has many Koreans, Japanese, and Chinese Americans who probably follow Buddhist teaches.

Each community can and should have a say as to what their children are being taught.

What is "the community"? One family? A majority?

I don't get this modern belief that the Bible isn't allowed in schools for teaching children when it has been in the past. More years than it hasn't been used. What Supreme Court ruling removed it from schools? Or was it secular humanist, and communists?

It isn't that hard. There came a time when some people did not want their children taught the chosen religion in school. Being a public school, the school should be welcoming to children of all religious beliefs, including those with none.