Tell Me Again How Awful HOA’s Are?

[printcraft]

To me (and seemingly most of INGO), a house being in a HOA lowers the value more than the neighbors house being pink.

Correct. They'll never see my money.

 

[churchmouse]

You're correct, to a point. However, with the example given, there is no real, honest way to justify another person or group of people having more freedom to pick the color of a neighbor's house than that neighbor does. IMO, freedom ends at the property line. Seeking to control a property that doesn't actually belong to you is hardly different than trespassing in my opinion. Forming a group of similar minded individuals and wrapping it in the trappings of an officialdom with an HOA doesn't lessen the trespass either. Also, while garish paint schemes, maintenance, etc. may be the reasons given for the formation of an HOA, it never ends there. There is always mission expansion as some members discover that they enjoy the control. "The issue is never the issue, the issue is always control."

Well said and yes, I agree for the most part.

 

[Ingomike]

To me (and seemingly most of INGO), a house being in a HOA lowers the value more than the neighbors house being pink.

To most of the country, and too lenders, it increases the value…

 

[Ingomike]

You're correct, to a point. However, with the example given, there is no real, honest way to justify another person or group of people having more freedom to pick the color of a neighbor's house than that neighbor does. IMO, freedom ends at the property line. Seeking to control a property that doesn't actually belong to you is hardly different than trespassing in my opinion. Forming a group of similar minded individuals and wrapping it in the trappings of an officialdom with an HOA doesn't lessen the trespass either. Also, while garish paint schemes, maintenance, etc. may be the reasons given for the formation of an HOA, it never ends there. There is always mission expansion as some members discover that they enjoy the control. "The issue is never the issue, the issue is always control."

If a group of people agree that there will be no paint colors other than what the group agree the paint colors are, do they not have the freedom to make that agreement?

An HOA is voluntary, no one is ever forced to join one, shouldn’t people have the freedom to join one? Just as most here relish the freedom not to join one?

 

[Ingomike]

BTW, my personal preference right now would be a well prepped cabin in the woods on the 200 acres I owned three miles from my nearest neighbors, and for sure no HOA.

But as long as I have to live in a subdivision I want some way to keep the outliers under control…

 

[DoggyDaddy]

If a group of people agree that there will be no paint colors other than what the group agree the paint colors are, do they not have the freedom to make that agreement?

An HOA is voluntary, no one is ever forced to join one, shouldn’t people have the freedom to join one? Just as most here relish the freedom not to join one?

You're saying that someone can move into a neighborhood with an HOA, they could opt not to join, and thus not be subject to the rules and associated fees? That doesn't sound right.

 

[two70]

If a group of people agree that there will be no paint colors other than what the group agree the paint colors are, do they not have the freedom to make that agreement?

An HOA is voluntary, no one is ever forced to join one, shouldn’t people have the freedom to join one? Just as most here relish the freedom not to join one?

Sure, they can make the agreement... trying to enforce that agreement on those that did not agree is the problem.

No one has yet or is likely to say that anyone cannot join a HOA if they want to. Because most here do value their freedom, they've stated their desire to not live under an HOA and naturally, pushed back against the idea that they should live under one. Now that you mention it though, perhaps we should come together and agree that HOA threads are not allowed on INGO. HOA promotion could lower the value of the place after all.

 

[actaeon277]

Well. Also. If you can own nuclear weapons safely, why not?

Ummm, doesn't everybody have a nuke?

 

[actaeon277]

You're saying that someone can move into a neighborhood with an HOA, they could opt not to join, and thus not be subject to the rules and associated fees? That doesn't sound right.

He will state that you can just not sign the mortgage.

Of course, if EVERY area has a HOA....

 

[Jaybird1980]

BTW, my personal preference right now would be a well prepped cabin in the woods on the 200 acres I owned three miles from my nearest neighbors, and for sure no HOA.

But as long as I have to live in a subdivision I want some way to keep the outliers under control…

That right there say everything.

 

[Ingomike]

That right there say everything.

It does, therefore I volunteer to join in a group that has agreed to live according to the covenants and if someone violates their agreement we have recourse. Not a thing wrong with that. Freedom to choose.

 

[Ingomike]

You're saying that someone can move into a neighborhood with an HOA, they could opt not to join, and thus not be subject to the rules and associated fees? That doesn't sound right.

I am saying people are free to chose to move into a neighborhood that does not have an HOA

 

[Ingomike]

Sure, they can make the agreement... trying to enforce that agreement on those that did not agree is the problem.

If one lives in the neighborhood and signed a deed they agreed to the covenants and HOA..

 

[Jaybird1980]

It does, therefore I volunteer to join in a group that has agreed to live according to the covenants and if someone violates their agreement we have recourse. Not a thing wrong with that. Freedom to choose.

Haha, The Freedom to control what others do on their property.

That's the definition of the American Dream.

No thanks.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

If a group of people agree that there will be no paint colors other than what the group agree the paint colors are, do they not have the freedom to make that agreement?

An HOA is voluntary, no one is ever forced to join one, shouldn’t people have the freedom to join one? Just as most here relish the freedom not to join one?

And what if the Board of that group of people vote and decide hot pink is the only acceptable color and any new construction/remodeling/repair must be in that color? Then along comes a hailstorm and damages just a couple pieces of siding, you now have the option of redoing the house hot pink or having a couple of patches of hot pink.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

As bug said, INGO doesn’t like to be told they can’t do something. LOL. I guess I don’t either but I try to temper that with the trade offs of the agreement as to how we will live.

No, it appears you like to tell your neighbors what they can/can't do.

To most of the country, and too lenders, it increases the value…

Perhaps lenders, I'll need a cite for most of the country.

 

[Ingomike]

Haha, The Freedom to control what others do on their property.

That's the definition of the American Dream.

No thanks.

The freedom to enter into agreements is also a freedom…

 

[two70]

If one lives in the neighborhood and signed a deed they agreed to the covenants and HOA..

That they foolishly agreed to the covenants at the time of purchase does not mean that they will also agree with covenants enacted later by the HOA. A lot of things that sound like a good idea when you have control become a lot less so when others that disagree gain control. Or when the amount of control, or the things being controlled inevitably increase. Some have to learn this the hard way.

 

[Ingomike]

And what if the Board of that group of people vote and decide hot pink is the only acceptable color and any new construction/remodeling/repair must be in that color? Then along comes a hailstorm and damages just a couple pieces of siding, you now have the option of redoing the house hot pink or having a couple of patches of hot pink.

If it is in the covenants when one buys or is legally changed then that is what was agreed…

 

[Ingomike]

That they foolishly agreed to the covenants at the time of purchase does not mean that they will also agree with covenants enacted later by the HOA. A lot of things that sound like a good idea when you have control become a lot less so when others that disagree gain control. Or when the amount of control, or the things being controlled inevitably increase. Some have to learn this the hard way.

So people are duped into buying property with an HOA? My experience has shown the opposite of what you described. Most neighborhoods HOA get more lax over the years…