Tactical Response at it again. Dangerous and Unprofessional ?

[Tactically Fat]

Speaking of Tactical... Hi.

 

[Expatriated]

Too much speculation to know anything for sure, but keep in mind that the ground may have irregularly shaped things on it like sticks and rocks which can exert force in just about any direction when stepped down on.

This is the only conclusion I can come to as well. But I am interested in this part. I've seen dozens of Glocks fall out of holsters or get dropped during training and not go off. Even in this situation, there's no claim that the gun went off when dropped, only when stomped on. So, I have to think that earth or whatever got in the trigger guard and the gun was moved forward during that point.

The guy did something stupid and got stupid results, I get that. But I would like to know the exact mechanics of what happened. It doesn't seem to jive with the story unless exactly what was described above happened.

 

[The Bubba Effect]

Sounds like somebody screwed up and did not keep his muzzle pointed in a safe direction.

I think I understand why they have you drop your pistols and I think it is a good idea. I suspect the stomping and grinding was improvisation and a bad idea. If you are upset by the notion of your carry pistol getting scratched or dinged, your feelings will be hurt if you take a class with Tactical Response.

For what it's worth, here is my AAR for the course (different time and place than the incident being discussed):AAR for Tactical Response Fighting Pistol

 

[Dead Duck]

Sounds like someone is having clutch problems again.


That's weird.........Now I'm craving Pancakes.

 

[Bfish]

Sounds like somebody screwed up and did not keep his muzzle pointed in a safe direction.

I think I understand why they have you drop your pistols and I think it is a good idea. I suspect the stomping and grinding was improvisation and a bad idea. If you are upset by the notion of your carry pistol getting scratched or dinged, your feelings will be hurt if you take a class with Tactical Response.

For what it's worth, here is my AAR for the course (different time and place than the incident being discussed):AAR for Tactical Response Fighting Pistol

I don't know where all you have trained, but most people I have talked with who have trained with at least 3 and as many 5 or 6+ well known instructors/schools such as Thunder Ranch, Travis Haley, Pat McNamara (tmacs), John McPhee, and others in addition to tactical response have all spoken very highly of the fighting pistol class to the point I still really want to attend, and still consider it on my list. They also never mentioned anything unsafe like what we are hearing about.

 

[Vigilant]

I don't know where all you have trained, but most people I have talked with who have trained with at least 3 and as many 5 or 6+ well known instructors/schools such as Thunder Ranch, Travis Haley, Pat McNamara (tmacs), John McPhee, and others in addition to tactical response have all spoken very highly of the fighting pistol class to the point I still really want to attend, and still consider it on my list. They also never mentioned anything unsafe like what we are hearing about.

I have taken Fighting Pistol, and none of what everyone is up in arms about went on? I recommend the class, but if they want me to **** can a loaded pistol and let someone stomp it, I will request a refund, and if not given, dispute my cc charge. I have no problem throwing my pistol to the deck, it is a tool, but it WILL be empty. I'm a Yeager fan, the guy is genuinely a good dude in person. Maybe he's like WWE/WWF, and his vids are "reality tv" to make a buck, I still say, even to Kirk McFuddman, even you can learn something from a TR class!

 

[Kirk Freeman]

I still say, even to Kirk McFuddman, even you can learn something from a TR class!

Have been. No one did anything reckless just to be "edgy".

It is not Fuddism to express concern for innocents being hurt from the stupidity of Beard Logic. "I can stomp on guns", "I can point guns at people because they are 'unloaded'", etc. are nothing more than stupidity and ignorance masquerading as "edgy" training or some "fresh, hot" take on an old problem. It is stupid. It is reckless. It must be stopped from within the gun culture.

This dangerous Beards McOperator crap has to stop or more people will get hurt. TR was darn lucky that it was only a car that got shot. People regulate themselves or they are regulated from outside.

If this Beard Logic continues they will take away firearms training faster than the State of Tennessee can take away a carry license.

They also never mentioned anything unsafe like what we are hearing about.

We can only hope that this is an apparition. However, this incident's motivation is the Beard Logic Culture (see above), which must be destroyed.

 

[churchmouse]

I have taken Fighting Pistol, and none of what everyone is up in arms about went on? I recommend the class, but if they want me to **** can a loaded pistol and let someone stomp it, I will request a refund, and if not given, dispute my cc charge. I have no problem throwing my pistol to the deck, it is a tool, but it WILL be empty. I'm a Yeager fan, the guy is genuinely a good dude in person. Maybe he's like WWE/WWF, and his vids are "reality tv" to make a buck, I still say, even to Kirk McFuddman, even you can learn something from a TR class!

Not throwing my gun on the ground to prove a point. Not stomping on it either.

 

[in625shooter]

Sounds like somebody screwed up and did not keep his muzzle pointed in a safe direction.

I think I understand why they have you drop your pistols and I think it is a good idea. I suspect the stomping and grinding was improvisation and a bad idea. If you are upset by the notion of your carry pistol getting scratched or dinged, your feelings will be hurt if you take a class with Tactical Response.

For what it's worth, here is my AAR for the course (different time and place than the incident being discussed):AAR for Tactical Response Fighting Pistol

I respectfully disagree. I have been an Agency trainer for over 2 decades and am certified by FLETC so I have seen a couple things. This whole current trend of a few courses requiring the throwing of guns on the ground is stupid. With the extent of tourture testing over the years (in controlled and uncontrolled enviorments) There is no doubt that the firearms (Glocks, M&P's SIG's etc) have proven they can take most of it and still function. But any idiot can cause one to go off by mis-use. I have no problem putting my own wear on my firearms in due time. Go through any Real tactical schools and they get dropped and etc but jumping up and down and throwing them. I mean I get it if it is a real Operator but real Operators would be more inclined to take courses from Vickers, McNamara, Howe, Pannone, Hackthorn and similar vested instructors.

Its a handgun or rifle class not a tryout for BUDS.

 

[OkieGirl]

...This whole current trend of a few courses requiring the throwing of guns on the ground is stupid. With the extent of tourture testing over the years (in controlled and uncontrolled enviorments) There is no doubt that the firearms (Glocks, M&P's SIG's etc) have proven they can take most of it and still function. But any idiot can cause one to go off by mis-use. I have no problem putting my own wear on my firearms in due time. Go through any Real tactical schools and they get dropped and etc but jumping up and down and throwing them...
Its a handgun or rifle class not a tryout for BUDS.

QFT. I've watched the manufacturers testing of their product; pick it up from a bucket of water or sand or whatever they chose to throw at it. Most responsible gun owners treat a loaded weapon with some level of regard for the danger that can be caused from misuse. It seems counterproductive to teach any level of gun safety and as part of the course, then throw that loaded weapon on the ground and jump on it.

Like any tool, its purpose is to do a job. I have firearms that are too pretty to abuse so I don't carry them. The are fun for the range but not something I'm going to put in a holster. I have an EDC that is going to get scratched up because that's what happens when you use a tool. When training on moving drills, the mags will get dropped when spent and they get dirt on them [gasp] but that's why you choose something to carry that you are ok with using like the tool it was intended to be.

 

[printcraft]

Anybody smacked their thumb with a hammer or cut themselves with a utility knife?
Didn't mean to at the time but my tools bit me out of my own negligence.
I wasn't even trying to prove a point by harassing my tools.

 

[OkieGirl]

Printcraft, you should rub some dirt on it.


I'm accident prone enough without intentionally adding to the risk level. By the age of two I was the only kid anyone knew who had third degree burns. The parents dressed me up as Lazarus for Halloween that year.

I was doing some work with a reciprocating saw a few years ago, taking spindles off of a deck. My neighbor came out to supervise (phone in hand) just in case I needed medical attention later.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Anybody smacked their thumb with a hammer or cut themselves with a utility knife?
Didn't mean to at the time but my tools bit me out of my own negligence.
I wasn't even trying to prove a point by harassing my tools.

How do you expect to sell out your next Tactical Hammer & Utility Knife class if you do not do dangerous, stupid stuff with your tools?

 

[printcraft]

How do you expect to sell out your next Tactical Hammer & Utility Knife class if you do not do dangerous, stupid stuff with your tools?

Rhino is teaching the utility knife / trauma class... it will sell out.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Rhino is teaching the utility knife / trauma class... it will sell out.

Never thought I'd see the day when endangering yourself or innocent others was a highly sought out tactical skill . . . no, wait, I did.

 

[cbhausen]

Rhino is teaching the utility knife / trauma class... it will sell out.

DAMN... Best me to it!

NEVER try to get the drop on Printcraft, you'll lose every time. Rep sent for the lolz.

Edit: I'm out of rep, somebody get him for me!

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Alright, but only because you told me to.

 

[Dead Duck]

Rhino is teaching the utility knife / trauma class... it will [STRIKE]sell out[/STRIKE] BLEED OUT.

FIFY

 

[MTC]

If this Beard Logic continues they will take away firearms training faster than the State of Tennessee can take away a carry license.

Was du dort getan hast, ich sehe es.

People regulate themselves or they are regulated from outside.

Axiom.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Was du dort getan hast, ich sehe es.

I'm a slick one. Sometimes I'll use hyperbole, metaphor, satire; it's just a blizzard of education against the Captain Tacticals.