Tactical Response at it again. Dangerous and Unprofessional ?

[Kirk Freeman]

Little did I know that the most tactical thing I ever did was that inelegant fall from the wall.

I think we can all agree that at least you were endangering yourself, if not others, by pointing your weapon at yourself and THAT is the most tactical thing.

As well, you also invented that flippy gun crap WAY before Magpul's Captain Tactical.

 

[17 squirrel]

It was a softer, more mysterious time for a young guy just trying to pay for college....less tactical, but filled with wonder.

The Coast Guard had M16's back then ????

 

[T.Lex]

The Coast Guard had M16's back then ????

It was 2004. They were "new."

 

[BogWalker]

Next step in tactical training: shooting yourself so you know how to deal with it in combat.

Works for tasers, right?

 

[HoughMade]

The Coast Guard had M16's back then ????

The more startling thing would be that the Coast Guard would issue bayonets and train with them....I suppose it would come in handy boarding Ye Olde pirate ships.

 

[Fordtough25]

With the caveat that you have to stand up and prove why in front of the class. Don't know if the guy did that or not, and also, since no one has done it before, is it subjective? Does James listen to your story and then say no, you didn't convince me, no refund for you?

I've been to more than one class that we ditched our weapon, that being said, it was CLEARED, and no stomping! I think it has a small training advantage, in that I've also been to classes that some didn't want to shoot Urban Prone, for fear of scratching their rifle or pistol in the gravel. Also been to classes where, since it was a little muddy, people didn't want to go prone, so they didn't dirty their car/truck on the way home!?!

Very true I do not fully understand the context or rules of the refund. I think if you are serious about training wear and tear on you/firearms/clothes etc should be par for the course. But the showbiz theatrics of many courses today promote fancyness. Imo of course and not the correct way to approach the subject.

Gunny Highway approved:

[video=youtube;oIv_RrgCfWs]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oIv_RrgCfWs[/video]

Excellent point and movie!! Clint for the win!

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Next step in tactical training: shooting yourself so you know how to deal with it in combat.

By chance, did you grow a beard recently?

 

[17 squirrel]

The more startling thing would be that the Coast Guard would issue bayonets and train with them....I suppose it would come in handy boarding Ye Olde pirate ships.

I was told that's why they speek pirateeze.... It's tough to have good pronunciation with a bayonet in your mouth.. ARGGGG MATEYYYY...

 

[17 squirrel]

By chance, did you grow a beard recently?

I want a Mcbeard really really bad, but each time I start growing one, the hairs in my beard keep getting caught on my jackets zipper. And it hurts really bad when I turn my head and they get pulled out..

I'm never going to make the cut.. Sad face...... Sad face....

 

[JettaKnight]

This thread did not disappoint. I've give the Inshallah INGOers this, they are firm in their beliefs... Crazy, but firm.

 

[JollyMon]

I have a beard because I hate to shave and I like firearms..... Kirk automatically assumes my name is Tommy.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

I was told that's why they speek pirateeze.... It's tough to have good pronunciation with a bayonet in your mouth.. ARGGGG MATEYYYY...

That Cornish! How dare you attack my people! This calls for an immediate Cornish response . . . drinking homemade beer while fishing for eels.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iMJYzyty2Z8

 

[Kirk Freeman]

This thread did not disappoint. I've give the Inshallah INGOers this, they are firm in their beliefs... Crazy, but firm.

There is no stupidity too far to defend as Beard Logic is on the line.

I have a beard because I hate to shave and I like firearms..... Kirk automatically assumes my name is Tommy.

Or Timmy.

 

[bobzilla]

I can never be tactical. Apparently my lineage stopped humping chimpanzees earlier than everyone else because I physically can't grow a beard. I guess I can't take the "shoot myself class" now. I was really hoping it would be coming to Indy soon. Guess I'll just have to go to Chicago now to get it done.

 

[Rookie]

Has anyone seen a response from the ditch ***** or is he hiding?

 

[BehindBlueI's]

I didn't want to let you down, Kirk. I know it's weird for you to watch people with guns out of their holsters but sometimes it happens.


I'd reckon most of those SWAT snipers and LEOs get training on company time and on our dime. I'd also reckon the average non-leo citizen does not. So, when they're seeking out training on how to do those sort of things, doesn't it make sense for them to spend $500 on a training class since there's really no other way for them to get that type of training? Or...spend the $500 on a class that teaches the same proven techniques in the same proven ways that LEOs, etc. learn. Who's paying for it is irrelevant. There are places right here in Indiana that will let you use FATS, Simunitions, etc. for significantly less cash. There are multiple ways to acclimate to shooting with no shoot targets around. You want a cheap one? Tack $20 bills to two no shoot targets next to your intended target. If you hit a no shoot, set the $20 on fire and replace it. Real world financial pain is a great motivator.

Shooting with a person downrange achieves the goal of the course. Is it riskier than using simunitions that are actually shot at people? In your opinion it may be. Obviously the course directors disagree with your assessment and continue to make money by taking that risk.

Of course it's more dangerous. You're right they make money, though, and that's the goal. Social media marketing, like I said. It'll draw LARPers and neckbeards like flies to garbage. The resulting "its sold out so its got to be awesome" will draw in the people who don't know what they don't know and think this sort of thing is the right way to do things.

I know my dissent on this topic implies I condone this sort of training. In no way shape or form am I saying I'd personally do it. All I'm saying is it's nowhere near as dangerous as everyone's making it out to be and it seems to be highly effective since TR keeps selling out classes.
It's highly effective at marketing, I've said that from the get go. If it's effective and turning out safe and effective shooters, meh, let's see your metric on that. Tom Givens and I agree on probably 90%+ on civilian self defense shooting topics, he's got a long track record of students winning gun fights, and he doesn't put folks downrange. So, the fact Givens exists shows that civilians can learn to do what needs to be done without putting people at undue risk and have excellent results in the real world, and that such training is accessible to them.

blue

 

[Expatriated]

Here's a question I haven't seen anyone address yet. I'm assuming since it was TR instructor, the pistol was a Glock.

What exactly happened during the stomping process to make the weapon fire? Assuming it was a properly functioning weapon, the striker was forward, the weapon was horizontal on it's side, so I'm assuming the stomping was a downward pressure (meaning lateral to the pistol and trigger in this case), how did it fire? I'm thinking something like a rock or some other debris got into the trigger guard and pressed the trigger to the rear while he was stomping on it, correct?

Or do y'all think the shock of stomping on it laterally made it go off? I can't see how that would happen with a Glock.

 

[HoughMade]

Too much speculation to know anything for sure, but keep in mind that the ground may have irregularly shaped things on it like sticks and rocks which can exert force in just about any direction when stepped down on.

 

[Mr Evilwrench]

Yeah, I can't grow a full beard either, I come out looking like Shaggy on Scooby Doo so I can't use that as an excuse for my dementia, but I do have glorious hair on my scalp.

My dad was CG in WWII; they had to train on the equipment of the day, in case those sneaky Canadians came after the coal & iron ore coming out of Minnesota.

 

[T.Lex]

Well, since it went off when Beardsley McTactical didn't want it to, it was either a malfunction or a design issues.

Unless maybe he WANTED it to go off to show how a tactical STOMP! can effectively take out a tango while firing an AK with his thumb and a Sig with his off hand. The tactical 3rd dimension.