Stop leaving guns in vehicles!

[Tomc1947]

If you bring your gun to Illinois, their new gun law requires you to lock it in your car.

 

[richardraw316]

I agree with hiding it in the car. When i said a car is secure enough i did not mean just throw your gun on the dash and leave. I do believe in keeping it out of sight but everyone saying it needs to be locked in a safe or special gun box seems like the kind of attitude that will get some sort of new law forced down throught about securing guns in vehicles. We have enough laws. Criminals dont follow them. They broke the law when they broke my window. They broke the law when they stole my gun. Cops find out i did not have a small abrams tank to protect my pistol in my vehicle and now im a criminal cause i broke the law. Doesnt make sense, but silly laws are exactly what the government is known for.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

I agree with hiding it in the car. When i said a car is secure enough i did not mean just throw your gun on the dash and leave. I do believe in keeping it out of sight but everyone saying it needs to be locked in a safe or special gun box seems like the kind of attitude that will get some sort of new law forced down throught about securing guns in vehicles. We have enough laws. Criminals dont follow them. They broke the law when they broke my window. They broke the law when they stole my gun. Cops find out i did not have a small abrams tank to protect my pistol in my vehicle and now im a criminal cause i broke the law. Doesnt make sense, but silly laws are exactly what the government is known for.

Ah, so we can't take precautions because if we take sensible precautions someone may force us to take sensible precautions. Of course there's no way a law could be passed because criminals continue to gain access to firearms from vehicle break ins, right?

I seriously don't get this idea, ESPECIALLY from people who've elected to carry a firearm to protect themselves, that your own actions cannot impact your likelihood of being the victim of a crime or that you should not take responsibility to reduce your own risk.

After all, why carry a gun? The criminal who robbed you was breaking the law. The stalker who shot you was breaking the law. Shouldn't that be enough protection? Carry a gun and soon everyone will have to carry one.

 

[Beemer]

I agree with hiding it in the car. When i said a car is secure enough i did not mean just throw your gun on the dash and leave. I do believe in keeping it out of sight but everyone saying it needs to be locked in a safe or special gun box seems like the kind of attitude that will get some sort of new law forced down throught about securing guns in vehicles. We have enough laws. Criminals dont follow them. They broke the law when they broke my window. They broke the law when they stole my gun. Cops find out i did not have a small abrams tank to protect my pistol in my vehicle and now im a criminal cause i broke the law. Doesnt make sense, but silly laws are exactly what the government is known for.

I am not suggesting more laws. I just feel more comfortable knowing that I have an extra barrier between the glass and the weapon I choose to leave in my car. Anyone should do what they feel works for them. I am more comfortable with a lock box.

 

[Slider]

This is an easy fix. If you leave your gun in the car, print this out When the criminals see it, the will just simply walk away without breaking into your car.

 

[richardraw316]

Ah, so we can't take precautions because if we take sensible precautions someone may force us to take sensible precautions. Of course there's no way a law could be passed because criminals continue to gain access to firearms from vehicle break ins, right?

I seriously don't get this idea, ESPECIALLY from people who've elected to carry a firearm to protect themselves, that your own actions cannot impact your likelihood of being the victim of a crime or that you should not take responsibility to reduce your own risk.

After all, why carry a gun? The criminal who robbed you was breaking the law. The stalker who shot you was breaking the law. Shouldn't that be enough protection? Carry a gun and soon everyone will have to carry one.

I love your multiple use of the word sensible. I hear it everyday out of libtards and new "sensible" gun laws. Sensible changes with public opinion. Years back it became sensible to lock your home. Then it became sensible to get a safe inside your locked home. Now its sensible to put a safe in your car. What will sensible tommorow? Carry a small safe on you at all times? All you must do is change public opinion and what seemed outrageous and weird becomes sensible.
For those of you who want a lock box or safe, more power to you. I am not saying you shouldnt have one if you want one. I am just saying, if we keep blaming the victim for the crime, we will eventually see more "sensible" restrictions placed upon us to help the criminal not be a criminal anymore.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

I love your multiple use of the word sensible. I hear it everyday out of libtards and new "sensible" gun laws. Sensible changes with public opinion. Years back it became sensible to lock your home. Then it became sensible to get a safe inside your locked home. Now its sensible to put a safe in your car. What will sensible tommorow? Carry a small safe on you at all times? All you must do is change public opinion and what seemed outrageous and weird becomes sensible.
For those of you who want a lock box or safe, more power to you. I am not saying you shouldnt have one if you want one. I am just saying, if we keep blaming the victim for the crime, we will eventually see more "sensible" restrictions placed upon us to help the criminal not be a criminal anymore.

Ah, so saying take precautions so you are less likely to be victimized is "blaming the victim" and because someone uses the word in a political context it suddenly becomes verboten to use.

Tell me how the battle cry "criminals are arming themselves with stolen guns" isn't more likely to result in new laws. Yes, it is SENSIBLE to secure a deadly weapon when it is unattended. If you wouldn't leave a gold brick there, why would you leave a gun there?

 

[richardraw316]

BBI. I couldnt help but notice you posted in another thread that your not a fan of the ugly hole they put on s&w firearms now. Do you not think that came about because someone thought it was sensible for a gun that can be locked for extra added security?
Here's how it goes for me. Ymmv. I dont like leaving my gun in the car but when i have to, i put it in the arm rest, roll up my windows, lock the doors and set the alarm. That all the security i feel is necessary. Im just trying to say, at one point in our time 0 locks was good enough, then one lock was good enough. Now its 2 locks is sensible. Following the pattern it will then be 3 or 4 or 5 locks before its considered secure. When is it secured enough? I vote 1. You feel free to pick which ever number you like most.

 

[SMiller]

There are no guns besides the one on my hip in my house that is not locked in a safe. I take every precaution as a responsible gun owner to secure my firearms. First off I paid too much to lose them and keeping them out of the hands of thieves is even more important.

Cool, that won't work for me as I could need a long gun at a moments notice and don't have time to go unlock the safe to retrieve my rifle, guess I will take my chances by leaving it sitting around with a loaded mag. If I lived in town I might be able to do something differently.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

BBI. I couldnt help but notice you posted in another thread that your not a fan of the ugly hole they put on s&w firearms now. Do you not think that came about because someone thought it was sensible for a gun that can be locked for extra added security?
Here's how it goes for me. Ymmv. I dont like leaving my gun in the car but when i have to, i put it in the arm rest, roll up my windows, lock the doors and set the alarm. That all the security i feel is necessary. Im just trying to say, at one point in our time 0 locks was good enough, then one lock was good enough. Now its 2 locks is sensible. Following the pattern it will then be 3 or 4 or 5 locks before its considered secure. When is it secured enough? I vote 1. You feel free to pick which ever number you like most.

A lock with a large easily broken glass pane over it is irrelevant. Sometimes we have to adjust to the changes in the world. You are basically suggesting we trust criminals to not be criminals. Cool. Then why carry guns?

If "sensible" doesn't ring a bell with conservatives, how about "personal responsibility". I thought that was all the rage, and it's absence was much lamented. The fact is criminals are breaking into cars and obtaining guns. The fact is those guns will potentially be used to victimize others. A $25 box like this: Amazon.com: GunVault NV300 NanoVault with Combination Lock: Home Improvement will prevent nearly all of the smash and grabs because the thieves aren't carrying bolt cutters and they aren't willing to stand around and work at it after the noise of the window break. They are using easily concealable window punches (or trying for unlocked doors) and spending very little time in each vehicle.

Play slippery slope if you like. You can make anything ridiculous by taking it to extremes no one is suggesting. I mean, you own 1 car right? What's next? You're a car horder and need more garage space and it consumes your life. Better just not buy a car and take the bus.

 

[richardraw316]

A lock with a large easily broken glass pane over it is irrelevant. Sometimes we have to adjust to the changes in the world. You are basically suggesting we trust criminals to not be criminals. Cool. Then why carry guns?

If "sensible" doesn't ring a bell with conservatives, how about "personal responsibility". I thought that was all the rage, and it's absence was much lamented. The fact is criminals are breaking into cars and obtaining guns. The fact is those guns will potentially be used to victimize others. A $25 box like this: Amazon.com: GunVault NV300 NanoVault with Combination Lock: Home Improvement will prevent nearly all of the smash and grabs because the thieves aren't carrying bolt cutters and they aren't willing to stand around and work at it after the noise of the window break. They are using easily concealable window punches (or trying for unlocked doors) and spending very little time in each vehicle.

Play slippery slope if you like. You can make anything ridiculous by taking it to extremes no one is suggesting. I mean, you own 1 car right? What's next? You're a car horder and need more garage space and it consumes your life. Better just not buy a car and take the bus.

As i said before. Pick your number of locks you want between people and your gun. All i ask is maybe you shouldnt judge others because they chose a number different than yours.
This arguement cant help but remind of everytime i go by tha gas station at night to see the local cops inside with their vehicle outside running. Are there firarms in these vehicles? Only a peice of glass keeping someone crom taking the vehicle and doing some rather unpleasent things with it and whatever they find in it. So the sensible thing to do would be double lock the car. No wait armoured vehicles. That way nobody can get in.
Now see that example was taken to the extreme.
Didnt you say something about if property is kept out of plain sight it reduces the likely hood of having a smash and grab to damn near 0? So why the need to hide it and lock it up?

 

[BehindBlueI's]

As i said before. Pick your number of locks you want between people and your gun. All i ask is maybe you shouldnt judge others because they chose a number different than yours.
This arguement cant help but remind of everytime i go by tha gas station at night to see the local cops inside with their vehicle outside running. Are there firarms in these vehicles? Only a peice of glass keeping someone crom taking the vehicle and doing some rather unpleasent things with it and whatever they find in it. So the sensible thing to do would be double lock the car. No wait armoured vehicles. That way nobody can get in.
Now see that example was taken to the extreme.
Didnt you say something about if property is kept out of plain sight it reduces the likely hood of having a smash and grab to damn near 0? So why the need to hide it and lock it up?

Well, at least for IMPD firearms inside the vehicle went unattended must be secured and IIRC you aren't supposed to leave it running, either. There used to be a valid reason to leave them running, all the electronics ran the battery down. There was a master kill switch that shut down all the electronics onboard at the end of the shift, but if you didn't want to reboot your MDT, re-verify your radar, and be without radio contact (if your agency still used repeaters in the car) you had to leave it running. Modern cars and modern electronics don't need to be left running, so unless it's snowing and you need to keep the windshield clear or the like there's no good reason to leave a patrol car running any longer. Well, I take that back. K9s have a valid reason. However just routinely leaving it running is being a candy-ass about hot/cold or just doing something because that's the way it's always been done.

As for the second part, well hiding it is how you keep it out of sight so that seems self explanatory. Locking it up, well did someone see you unholster? Does anyone in the neighborhood know you carry? Did you forget and leave a charging cable plugged in so they may root around for the electronics? Same reason I have locks on my doors and have a home alarm. Layered security ups the risk, which deters criminals.

Judge? Honestly anyone who uses 'libtard' can't really complain about judging people. That said, lay it on your dashboard if you want to. I'm not advocating mandatory storage laws or the like. Just pointing out the risks inherent in poor security measures, and given the number of stolen firearms reported perhaps that's something people need to think about. Sort of like this thread: https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo...ur-odds-having-your-stolen-gun-recovered.html as few people keep records and can even provide a S/N when their gun does end up stolen because it won't ever happen to them so why bother.

 

[hopper68]

I see I should have titled the thread Stop leaving unsecured guns in vehicles.

Not much to say but some people get it and other just see another reason to complain. The rise in smash and grabs is all about in and out quickly. Grab what you can and go. The longer it takes them is time they can spend on easier targets.

 

[shibumiseeker]

A lock with a large easily broken glass pane over it is irrelevant. Sometimes we have to adjust to the changes in the world. You are basically suggesting we trust criminals to not be criminals. Cool. Then why carry guns?

Sadly not all of the changes in the world are on our side. Make real and permanent penalties for being a criminal who commits crimes with direct victims and there will be fewer criminals. Instead, if they get caught, they spend a few months in jail. Doing anything more is somehow not humane any more. Much as I think many things in the world and our criminal justice system has changed for the better, the trend we have heading here in the US to where the UK is now with it almost being a crime simply to defend yourself in your own home makes it low penalty to be a criminal. A tiny chance of getting caught, and if I get caught I spend a few months in jail? Easy money right there.

And yet, somehow, everyone, liberals and conservatives alike, seem to be ok with this.

 

[richardraw316]

You are correct. Using the word libtard is very judgemental. (i just like the way it sounds). I thinkbwe are on the same page when it comes to not forcing people to secure in a lockable box. If someone wants the best safe un their vehicle or home, that is their choice and i am glad they excercised their freedom to chose. I am just against any chance that we maybe setting our selves up for more laws limiting choice.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

You are correct. Using the word libtard is very judgemental. (i just like the way it sounds). I thinkbwe are on the same page when it comes to not forcing people to secure in a lockable box. If someone wants the best safe un their vehicle or home, that is their choice and i am glad they excercised their freedom to chose. I am just against any chance that we maybe setting our selves up for more laws limiting choice.

I'm sure. Like most of the Internet arguments, we're probably 90% on the same page and arguing over the small things.

Argument #1: This guy voluntarily used a lock box and it prevented a gun theft. We need to make these mandatory!
Argument #2: This criminal committed a heinous crime with a stolen gun. We need to pass storage laws to prevent this!

Which one has been used successfully in states with storage laws?

Just food for thought.

 

[Woody968]

I think the OP was just saying if you are going to leave them, make sure they are secure. I have a lock box in each of my cars that is out of sight and would take some doing to get it open or out. I advise that if you have to leave it in your car, buy one of these and mount it directly to the vehicle in an out of sight place. Then you have eliminated the risk of grab and dash. IMHO

I have been thinking about doing this lately. I have the little lock box and cable now but would like something better. My question is how did you mount it to your vehicle?

 

[BehindBlueI's]

I have been thinking about doing this lately. I have the little lock box and cable now but would like something better. My question is how did you mount it to your vehicle?

Depends on the vehicle if there are better options, but seat frame is the usual.

 

[dusty88]

I see I should have titled the thread Stop leaving unsecured guns in vehicles.

Not much to say but some people get it and other just see another reason to complain. The rise in smash and grabs is all about in and out quickly. Grab what you can and go. The longer it takes them is time they can spend on easier targets.

I agree with you of course.

I nonetheless brought up the "I have to leave it in the car due to the laws" because I think it's a valid argument in the "gun free zones" conversation. When I am conversing with a rational "why would you need to allow guns in school" I might be talking to someone who (for example) understands why I want my gun when I lock up at my office at night. They visualize that as a dangerous situation, even if they think that carrying everywhere is over the top.

I then explain that when I pick the kids up from school, I have to leave the gun in the car. If they are receptive, I also explain the part that removing the gun or holster actually can sometimes increase the chance of negligent discharge. They don't always appreciate the latter aspect, but most of them do appreciate that it's a stupid idea to mandate guns in the car near a school or post office when the alternative is having them stay in the possession of a licensed, responsible adult.

 

[throttletony]

OMG!! We shouldn't be victim blaming!! We should be teaching people not to break into things and steal

Or, how about we make it illegal ?!?! ... add purple as necessary