So I might have to stop carrying to church...

[Blue Tile Spook]

After a long thought, I answered, "yes; under one condition..."

"That my accusers personally come and ask me to deny my very right to defend my wife and loved ones from violence."

Don't get ahead of yourself and God. I think that, for now, your answer is in the words quoted. You have to let God work on the hearts of minds of the people that brought this to the attention of your elders. If they choose to come to you and explain to you why they feel that you do not have a right and duty to protect your wife, they may learn something about themselves in the discussion with you.

I congratulate you on not getting mad. That is a wonderful way to allow them to see the situation from your eyes. +1 IBTL!

 

[Prometheus]

Are there any biblical verses to the effect of "Carry thy sword" or "Defend thine own blood" or something of the like? If so, I'm sure you know what to do with them.

Luke 22:36
Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

Don't leave your church. Force them to honor Jesus' words.

Buying a new gun is BS. Especially a P11, junk guns, I had one and it was no where near as reliable as should be.

FWIW I try and carry fairly well concealed just because I don't want to distract anyone from what may be there "revelation". That said, I'm not going to lie and say I'm not carrying to appease anyone. I'd leave if push actually came to shove.

 

[Sweetums]

Ummm, see my sig



"A prudent person foresees danger and takes precautions. The simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences." - Proverbs 27:12 NLT

 

[ddenny5]

I may have missed this in reading the thread but I am assuming that your church does not have a school or pre-school which, if present, would indeed possibly change the discussion too a legal one.

That only applies to puble schools. I know a pastor of a church that has a school and he has decons that are armed as part of the security team. If you home school your children does that make your home a school? If it does than you need to sell your guns.

 

[Jack Ryan]

Are there any biblical verses to the effect of "Carry thy sword" or "Defend thine own blood" or something of the like? If so, I'm sure you know what to do with them.

See this is the example I've been looking for. This is why I don't much care for man's churches. They decided what they want to do and then look for Bible verses to support it.

If God wants me to succeed or do something no man on earth could keep his will hidden from me or stop but me.

If God doesn't want it done no one on this planet can help me.

I need no earthly man to interpret God's will for me. God is multi-lingual he knows every language any priest or preacher knows. All I need do is ask, then watch and listen. God gave me TWO ears, TWO eyes, and only ONE mouth for a good reason. I'll trust his judgement on the design.

 

[mconley]

my paster packs every service, usally a keltec... but sometimes a smith or taurus revolver.

 

[mconley]

along with half the people in the service

 

[TopDog]

So far I think the OP is handling it well. I don't carry to church out of personal choice. I carry everyday and leave my weapon in the car during church. But I have no problem with anyone that wants to carry in church OC or CC.

If I were the OP I would either CC and let it ride. As long as the church does not post no gun signs then the people complaining are just blowing hot air and should not effect attendance. If that becomes the case,then look for another church that is not filled with people that are so closed minded.

Not going to church because of the people that are there to me would be compromising my beliefs. I go to church to commune with and serve God. Too many people use church to socialize, I dislike that. If the church itself starts making decisions that I feel are contrary to God's will (like the Catholic Church System of Indianapolis) then I move on.

 

[Roadie]

That only applies to puble schools. I know a pastor of a church that has a school and he has decons that are armed as part of the security team. If you home school your children does that make your home a school? If it does than you need to sell your guns.

If the church has a K-12 school then the law applies to it. If it has Bible school, then the law does not apply.

 

[Roadie]

Frustatingly sad news,

There was a complaint about my carrying to church services. It seems that some people believe it's morally wrong for me to do so. Furthermore, they didn't confront me directly. They went to my church elder and complained to him.

Long story short, I was asked why I carried. I replied, "because I love my wife and will not permit a violent crime to come against her. It's not illegal nor is it sinful to protect yourself from criminals."

Of course, the elders were won over by logic and they personally had no objections to my carrying. But the fact remains that I have become a stumbling block for some. Then I replied, "what about me? Wouldn't they become a stumbling block for me and my family?" Again, they agreed with me that they had no less right to impose their beliefs upon me. Gun rights 2, and gun grabbers 0.

Finally, it was asked that if the situation got to the point that there was an uproar about my carrying, would I not carry in order to keep the peace. After a long thought, I answered, "yes; under one condition..."

"That my accusers personally come and ask me to deny my very right to defend my wife and loved ones from violence." Now, I don't know where all this was coming from. It was felt good to be able speak the truth without getting angry or being misunderstood. Frankly, I didn't think I would ever hear myself say those words.

So, that's my sad news folks. I guess I need to uber-discreet when I carry, so that I don't scare anybody at services. I won't be asked not to carry by my elders (who shouldn't have been bothered with the issue in the first place). Might be time to buy that Kel-tec P11...

Biblicaly, that is what they SHOULD have done. Your fellow church members handled it wrong, as did your Elders.

Matthew 18:
15 “Moreover if your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he hears you, you have gained your brother. 16 But if he will not hear, take with you one or two more, that ‘by the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.17 And if he refuses to hear them, tell it to the church. But if he refuses even to hear the church, let him be to you like a heathen and a tax collector.

I think the Elders should have asked the "offended" party to talk to you FIRST before the Elders got involved.

 

[modelflyer2003]

I CCW'ed in church on Wednesday. I usually leave it in the van, but I wore it during that service. Since I am Assembly of God (Pentecostal) we raise our hands in worship quite often, and we are a very huggy group. I did manage to avoid (I'm pretty sure) anyone seeing my Glock 26 in a Crossbreed Supertuck IWB at 4 O'Clock. During the winter and fall months, I think I can get away easier with wearing bulky cloths or a light jacket. I think my pastor would want to know and would probably disapprove. He owns rifltes and a shotgun, since he lives in the country and has to kill the occasional opossum, per his wife. My heart goes out to you. If you are at a church where God has placed you, changing churches would not be in His plan, which is far more important than our excerising our 2nd Amendment Rights during a church service. If push came to shove I would leave it in the vehicle.

 

[henktermaat]

Reps to the OP for handling it well. Remember, concealed means concealed.

 

[henktermaat]

I CCW'ed in church on Wednesday. I usually leave it in the van, but I wore it during that service. Since I am Assembly of God (Pentecostal) we raise our hands in worship quite often, and we are a very huggy group. I did manage to avoid (I'm pretty sure) anyone seeing my Glock 26 in a Crossbreed Supertuck IWB at 4 O'Clock. During the winter and fall months, I think I can get away easier with wearing bulky cloths or a light jacket. I think my pastor would want to know and would probably disapprove. He owns rifltes and a shotgun, since he lives in the country and has to kill the occasional opossum, per his wife. My heart goes out to you. If you are at a church where God has placed you, changing churches would not be in His plan, which is far more important than our excerising our 2nd Amendment Rights during a church service. If push came to shove I would leave it in the vehicle.

FUnny, we're a huggy group too

What I do is on Sunday, I carry farther around towards the front, like at 2 or 2:30. otherwise, at 3 or 4 o'clock, it gets "touched"

 

[ChalupaCabras]

"stumbling block" doesn't apply here. how on earth is YOUR carry causing THEM to sin? Its not. They are stupid.

 

[WIZZO499]

I don't want to turn this into a carry debate, as it is clear to me that I need some uber-deep concealment.

It's clear to me that you need to not worry about what others think of that pistol on your hip. If someone comes in shooting, as has happened many times, you'll not forgive yourself for not carrying just to satiate a few ninny's that are afraid of guns.

Just my opinion.

 

[NDguido]

You should invite as many ingo members as you can to come to your church for one service and open carry. That should solve your problem.

I've never understood how throwing gasoline onto a burning ember would make things better.............unless a huge fire is actually your goal.

 

[Prometheus]

I've never understood how throwing gasoline onto a burning ember would make things better.............unless a huge fire is actually your goal.

Thats because you haven't studied fire sciences. You see, liquids don't burn, vapors do. Putting a liquid onto an ember would remove the heat and oxygen negating 2 of the 4 necessary components of the fire tetrahedron. Since it only takes removal of one of the 4, there can be no fire.

As to OC'ing in the church, I believe the poster is referring to the obvious presence of guns removing the idiot liberals 'fuel' that guns cause bad things to happen.

Of course since most liberals are devoid of major reasoning skills, it's not likely to have such a dramatic effect as the snuffing of a fire, but it could be worth a shot. Without a 'leg to stand on' the liberal would have to shut up... in theory

 

[Amishman44]

I carry at church...concealed so as not to offend anyone who might be bothered by my having a firearm in church! I'm not so hung up on my rights that I can't place my firearm in a belt pouch or on my ankle under my pants leg...at least I still have ti with me. Several of our friends carry at church...very few people know about it...and they don't need to...hence the term 'concealed carry.' It's not worth the discussion/arguement...I've learned to pick the battles I can win and I simply avoid those I cannot! It's not worth the headache!

At our previous church, we had a 'shooter's' small group! We would meet for breakfast, shooting, and discussion/lunch once a month on a Saturday morning. The senior pastor was part of the group and he and I went shooting (just the 2 of us) a few times just to hang out and have fun!

Personally, I'd rather be a 'sleeper' in public than the one everyone notices. Just a chosen way of living for myself.

 

[longbow]

I had my glock 26 blessed at church

holy hand grenade....has a new meaning......

The Monastery near my high school has an armory......

 

[NDguido]

Thats because you haven't studied fire sciences. You see, liquids don't burn, vapors do. Putting a liquid onto an ember would remove the heat and oxygen negating 2 of the 4 necessary components of the fire tetrahedron. Since it only takes removal of one of the 4, there can be no fire.

Obviously, you've never squirted lighter fluid on campfire embers.

As to OC'ing in the church, I believe the poster is referring to the obvious presence of guns removing the idiot liberals 'fuel' that guns cause bad things to happen.

It is illogical to assume that the fear of one object will be cured by the introduction of many of the same objects. Knowledge is what is needed, not forced acclimation.

Of course since most liberals are devoid of major reasoning skills, it's not likely to have such a dramatic effect as the snuffing of a fire, but it could be worth a shot. Without a 'leg to stand on' the liberal would have to shut up... in theory

Well.......far be it from me to stand in the way of any attempt to shut a liberal up