Seat Belt Exemptions

[Bunnykid68]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vakEtQABocU

 

[reesez]

They were not thrown around, they side swiped a pole. The pole snapped the passenger side mirrors off, through it around the inside of the bus. The injuries were from flying shards of glass caused by the mirror coming through the window.

And I fail to see what that has to do with an impacted collision with another vehicle or rollover......

Ok, it's been fun, but we will have to agree to disagree. Again I just drive a bus everyday, not sure what the rest of you do for me to understand your points of view better. I just hope some of you can see where I am coming from after a few years driving a bus.

And as a mechanic that works on heavy equipment you should see where I am coming from. I for years have dealt with all aspects of buses, semis, cars, trucks, among other things. I also used to be a collision repairer.

 

[reesez]

Seat belts save kids from getting injured right? Would they of saved these kids from getting hurt?

That is the most ridiculous example to this discussion since none of the factors brought up had to do with grazing a pole.

Guess I am missing the humor in that statement.....

So your proposal is to equip all buses with seatbelts, approximately 440,000 public school buses alone, plus all other buses at $5500-7500 each, nearly $2.5 to $3.3 billion for public buses alone, and add additional staff to make sure the seatbelts are buckled?

Guess I missed how saying retarded automatically meant special needs. Just redundant. And yes. To me that cost is not a factor. It is the other RETARDED things they spend our money on.

I don't think the .gov should tell us we should wear our seatbelts or not. It's not their business if I bash my head against my steering wheel. I rarely wear my seatbelt and if I get into a crash that's on me for being unsafe. I'm just glad my truck doesn't beep like crazy when your seatbelt is unbuckled.

You are right, if you are over 18. As a parent I would like my kids to have seatbelts til they are old enough to make the decision to or not.
I am done with this conversation. LOL. I have other things to do if my proof is not enough for people. I am wasting my time.

 

[Brandon]

And I fail to see what that has to do with an impacted collision with another vehicle or rollover......


And as a mechanic that works on heavy equipment you should see where I am coming from. I for years have dealt with all aspects of buses, semis, cars, trucks, among other things. I also used to be a collision repairer.

So you have dealt with driving a bus load of kids?

 

[Bunnykid68]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68cHMoTHnXE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=liDePFnu4u4

 

[reesez]

So you have dealt with driving a bus load of kids?

Yes actually I have if that must be logic to this discussion, which I don't see how.

 

[qwerty]

Guess I missed how saying retarded automatically meant special needs. Just redundant. And yes. To me that cost is not a factor. It is the other RETARDED things they spend our money on.

Over the last 10 years, there have been an average of 6 deaths per year involving passengers on a school bus. That equates to approximately $417,000,000-550,000,000 per fatality per year, not counting the staff needed to monitor seatbelt use.

And what about children killed by a schoolbus they were getting on or off? That number over the past ten years is nearly 5 times that of passengers killed (average of 29 per year). What about them? That number is considerably higher. Maybe hire more people to stand around the bus?



http://sbi.elitedecision.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=13&Itemid=28

 

[Bunnykid68]

Over the last 10 years, there have been an average of 6 deaths per year involving passengers on a school bus. That equates to approximately $417,000,000-550,000,000 per fatality per year, not counting the staff needed to monitor seatbelt use.

And what about children killed by a schoolbus they were getting on or off? That number over the past ten years is nearly 5 times that of passengers killed (average of 29 per year). What about them? That number is considerably higher. Maybe hire more people to stand around the bus?



http://sbi.elitedecision.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=13&Itemid=28

I am thinking maybe just good bus drivers, no extra people needed to keep bus drivers from running over kids

 

[qwerty]

I am thinking maybe just good bus drivers, no extra people needed to keep bus drivers from running over kids

Wait, forget it, not worth arguing over. Perhaps more training, maybe a $10,000 mirror or something too....

 

[Bunnykid68]

Wait, forget it, not worth arguing over. Perhaps more training, maybe a $10,000 mirror or something too....

C'mon, what is there to argue over? You said kids were getting killed by buses while outside of buses, sounds like better drivers might solve that problem. I know I am crazy and all

They got some pretty big mirrors for $10 and you can buy cheap camera/video setups for less than $100

 

[qwerty]

C'mon, what is there to argue over? You said kids were getting killed by buses while outside of buses, sounds like better drivers might solve that problem. I know I am crazy and all

They got some pretty big mirrors for $10 and you can buy cheap camera/video setups for less than $100

School bus drivers go through pretty vigorous training, although folks here seem to think they are nothing but uneducated country bumpkins driving luxury cars who are trying to get out of work. I have had a class A with a passenger endorsement, it was a long process. Considering that approximately 450,000 buses transport 24 million children daily (8.8 billion passengers a year) all those numbers are pretty impressive honestly. Accidents are accidents, not intentionals, and are going to happen.

 

[Whosyer]

All this bus talk is absolutely riveting, but how is it going to save me from paying the City of West Lafayette $50? Back on topic peeps!

 

[mrjarrell]

All this bus talk is absolutely riveting, but how is it going to save me from paying the City of West Lafayette $50? Back on topic peeps!

It's not. You can try to fight the ticket by twisting the language, but the judge is going to make you pay the ticket, plus court costs. Pay the ticket and wear your seat belt next time.

 

[Curls & Swirls]

Hate to bump my own post. I am guessing that everyone else hates math as much as I do, but would like to discuss the statistics if these seem correct. If not, I now know how to kill a thread.

I still do not think you can use this because to make it right you would need the number of kids riding in cars over the year, not just total number of hours someone could be in a car for one year.(not going to be able to get that) and number of kids riding in bus over a year (much easier to get). Also this doesn't take into account that some of the kids riding in cars were hit by drunk drivers or riding with drunk drivers etc. Putting them at a greater risk of being injured in the first place. Just to little information known to really make this valid. In my opinion, and like I say I don't have feelings one way or the other about seatbelts on buses.

Compartmentalization does nothing for side impacts or rollovers

Just like seatbelts are not safe in cars for all types of accidents but they still made it a law for cars and such. But there is not a way to make money on buses not being able to keep the kids buckled and I think that is what that law is all about!!

Only because I do the job 5 days a week, know how the kids are not disaplined at school, how many times I have called home to talk to a mom or dad about their habbits on the bus incase of an accident and how they could get hurt. Does that help anything? NO, do I get to say this kid or that kid does not get to ride the bus? No.

I find ^^This^^ to be a Real Problem in schools today. They are not giving schools enough power to deal with the bad, and therefore making all the rest of the kids unsafe.

All this bus talk is absolutely riveting, but how is it going to save me from paying the City of West Lafayette $50? Back on topic peeps!

Sorry we you!! It's just that most of us feel that it shouldn't be a law in the first place and from what I hear in a lot of places they have made it so expensive to fight it (if you lose) that noone will. Thus, they get their money!!

 

[BK1962]

Never wore my seat belt until I woke up with my butt on the passenger side floor. Hip dislocated allowing my knee and foot to be above/behind my head. Speaking of my head, it was inside the glove box and missing most of it's nose...Buckle up. You never know when someone elses stupidity will impact you...And some fine individuals will have to use the jaws to cut you out of that wadded up mess.

 

[Buzzard]

All this bus talk is absolutely riveting, but how is it going to save me from paying the City of West Lafayette $50? Back on topic peeps!

Pay the fine. You were not "on a farm" as outlined in the IC exceptions so you do not have a valid argument and will only waste your time and money taking it to court. If you want to fight the law itself then I suggest you make friends with a gov official since that's where the law change would happen.
FWIW I am not a lawyer or judge, but will play one tv for the right price.

 

[Whosyer]

The whole " on a farm " language makes no sense. Someone please explain the logic, of going to all the trouble of writing an exemption to the IC, for an activity that is already perfectly legal. Or has there been a rash of instances where police went on private property, and issued seatbelt tickets.? I guess the farm truck exemption was written to keep me legal, while driving in the corn field? And yes, for the record #1 - probably going to pay the ticket #2- I don't really think that trying to understand the logic of an exemption for an already legal activity is " twisting the words". #3- I'll admit that I'm lucky, but statistics aside, 2 years ago I went upside down at 60 mph in my last F350. No seatbelt. Crawled out, walked 5 miles to the house, called the cops, ate a cheeseburger. Not being belted in an accident, is not an automatic death sentence.

 

[CountryBoy19]

Pay the fine. You were not "on a farm" as outlined in the IC exceptions so you do not have a valid argument and will only waste your time and money taking it to court. If you want to fight the law itself then I suggest you make friends with a gov official since that's where the law change would happen.
FWIW I am not a lawyer or judge, but will play one tv for the right price.

We're here to discuss the legal code and what recourse he has. Until someobdy provides a definition of "on a farm" found in the IC then your post is assuming that "on a farm" means "not on the roadway". As I've stated 3 times now in this thread, there has to be a reason the exemption was written no? See post below.

The whole " on a farm " language makes no sense. Someone please explain the logic, of going to all the trouble of writing an exemption to the IC, for an activity that is already perfectly legal. Or has there been a rash of instances where police went on private property, and issued seatbelt tickets.? I guess the farm truck exemption was written to keep me legal, while driving in the corn field? And yes, for the record #1 - probably going to pay the ticket #2- I don't really think that trying to understand the logic of an exemption for an already legal activity is " twisting the words". #3- I'll admit that I'm lucky, but statistics aside, 2 years ago I went upside down at 60 mph in my last F350. No seatbelt. Crawled out, walked 5 miles to the house, called the cops, ate a cheeseburger. Not being belted in an accident, is not an automatic death sentence.

 

[qwerty]

I still do not think you can use this because to make it right you would need the number of kids riding in cars over the year, not just total number of hours someone could be in a car for one year.(not going to be able to get that) and number of kids riding in bus over a year (much easier to get). Also this doesn't take into account that some of the kids riding in cars were hit by drunk drivers or riding with drunk drivers etc. Putting them at a greater risk of being injured in the first place. Just to little information known to really make this valid. In my opinion, and like I say I don't have feelings one way or the other about seatbelts on buses.

The statistical base is child fatalities per accident, not the number of kids traveling in a year. The calculations stand since they are based on the total number persons killed in each mode of transportation during a set time period (12 month period). The only variable is how long a person is in a vehicle a day....that is why I used ".138 children killed per hour in car accidents a year (8760 hours)", because the .138 is still higher than fatalities in school buses (.033) considering "a child rides a bus 60 minutes a day, five days a week, 9 months a year (180 hours)". The truth is, that a child probably never is in a automobile even 8 hours a day, but if you were to use 8 hours a day in a year (2920 hours) the rate is dramatically increased to .414.

 

[Buzzard]

We're here to discuss the legal code and what recourse he has. Until someobdy provides a definition of "on a farm" found in the IC then your post is assuming that "on a farm" means "not on the roadway". As I've stated 3 times now in this thread, there has to be a reason the exemption was written no? See post below.

Originally Posted by Whosyer
All this bus talk is absolutely riveting, but how is it going to save me from paying the City of West Lafayette $50? Back on topic peeps!

This is the part I was responding to. I do not see a way out for him and in my opinion think he will waste time money and energy fighting this particular instance in question.
As for the IC, no I do not see the logic in the farm exemption, or several of them for that matter. But I see that as a separate battle that would need to be driven through the government process for getting that type of law changed and would not be achieved by taking his "seatbelt ticket to court". I see those as two separate issues. That was my point. I do not know the origin of the exemptions nor do I plan to search for them. I was just offering my 2 cents on his "here and now" issue. So in summary, deal with the ticket to close that issue and if serious about getting the law (exemptions) changed spend his time energy on building a strong case and taking appropriate action through the state govt.
Again, just my opinion.


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How'd I get involved in this?
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lol