Russia vs. Ukraine Part 2

[BigRed]

Having studied many many many studies on it, and looking at BOTH arguments, I call B.S.
Stopping the attack short of the actual attack would have accomplished the SAME RESULTS.
Except we wouldn't have started with a decimated navy.

And a list of hundred other reasons.

I actually have a 2 book set right in front of me, discusses both sides.


Basically, you had the US, that COULD NOT imagine those weak, short sighted Japs as attacking us, and winning.
So the Navy wasn't taking it serious.
Then, they assumed being in port, defense would be up to the army.
The army assumed the navy could handle defense.
everyone assumed it would be saboteurs,
Everyone assumed the 'japs' were flying inferior planes
etc.

I'll save the debate for a another day in effort to a avoid a thread hijack.

 

[actaeon277]

Look at the radar picking up the incoming flights.
But it was assumed to be B 17s.
Also, it was so new, and such a new concept, no one really had a plan of action, or even knew about it.
Radar was in the 'super secret' category.

Just like our torpedoes that sucked so bad, someone should have been shot.

 

[Brad69]

I have a “nerd” friend he is all about Pearl Harbor He was in the enlisted housing at Pearl.

In his opinion the Battle Ships could not have got the boilers going in time to haul a$$.

My father had a VFW buddy that was a retired Master Chief that was on the USS Pyro a ammo ship fully loaded at Pearl Harbor. He was the Chief gunners mate.

They had just finished breakfast when the alarm went off. The individual gun Chief’s had keys for the ammo. He asked the youngest LTJG the only Officer on the ship what he wanted to do.

”shoot them all down“

They damaged one Zero he said they only had one Officer on board with less than half the crew. They wanted to get out out if they had got hit it would have been catastrophic.

 

[Libertarian01]

Look at the radar picking up the incoming flights.
But it was assumed to be B 17s.
Also, it was so new, and such a new concept, no one really had a plan of action, or even knew about it.
Radar was in the 'super secret' category.

Just like our torpedoes that sucked so bad, someone should have been shot.

High ranking military officers seem to be a little more stubborn than the average human in adapting to new technologies. We've seen it over and over.

In WWI general on both sides thought for some insane reason that you could actually charge against entrenched machineguns and "just overwhelm them." Millions died.

In your field I heard the story of a WWII American Captain that refused to use his new radar because he didn't want to give away his position. The enlisted guy trying to explain "that's not how radar works" just wasn't good enough.

In Vietnam we tried to use line tactics from previous wars. That didn't go so well.

In Ukraine it seems that the Russians believe that using 19th century battlefield maneuvers will work...

Doing so may well cause a rebellion. Putin isn't Stalin. He doesn't have the infrastructure that Stalin did. He doesn't have a totally oppressed culture like Stalin did either.

Regards,

Doug

 

[jamil]

I have a “nerd” friend

Does he wear pocket protectors, pants too short, waist too high, and socially awkward?

 

[DragonGunner]

Are we sending ships into the area? I remember a war in the 60’s that got started when a country shot at US ships but we weren’t sure, then later they did it again but turns out it was a radar glip that didn’t happen but Johnson said it’s good enough…. “Good Morning Ukraine.” Will be an upcoming movie. Who will play Robin Williams in this one?

 

[jamil]

Are we sending ships into the area? I remember a war in the 60’s that got started when a country shot at US ships but we weren’t sure, then later they did it again but turns out it was a radar glip that didn’t happen but Johnson said it’s good enough…. “Good Morning Ukraine.” Will be an upcoming movie. Who will play Robin Williams in this one?

Definitely we should send ships. You can probably carry a lot more cash on a ship than on a plane.

 

[nra4ever]

German tanks to invade Russia once again.

 

[oze]

If I remember, they seem to think powder caused the Maine.
And if I remember, the Japanese attacked Pearl.

But the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor was orchestrated by Abraham Lincoln.

 

[oze]

Does he wear pocket protectors, pants too short, waist too high, and socially awkward?

Hey, I don't even know Brad69!

 

[erasure]

because I didn't see it posted yet

 

[KG1]

Russel Brand talked about who could have blown up the pipeline. Ok…..yup….yup….ok….yup. Rice said what back when?….yup….ok….Biden put his foot in his mouth. We did it. Got proof…are we going to have a trial? Is the CIA going to confess? This ain’t like the old days when Japan attacked Pearl Harbor.

Hey get it right. Germany attacked Pearl Harbor.

 

[KG1]

Then all we are left with is theories right? Could the US have done it? Yes. Could Russia have done it? Yes.

Sweden did an investigation and isn’t revealing what was found. Lots of theories about that also.

I think Sweden did it.

 

[KG1]

Are we sending ships into the area? I remember a war in the 60’s that got started when a country shot at US ships but we weren’t sure, then later they did it again but turns out it was a radar glip that didn’t happen but Johnson said it’s good enough…. “Good Morning Ukraine.” Will be an upcoming movie. Who will play Robin Williams in this one?

Is Ukraine anywhere near the Gulf of Tonkin?

 

[DragonGunner]

Is Ukraine anywhere near the Gulf of Tonkin?

History repeats itself, locations vary.

 

[tsm]

I think Sweden did it.

Nonsense, it was aliens! Grays, most likely.

 

[cobber]

German tanks to invade Russia once again.

Well, that's a cheery thought...

 

[oze]

German tanks to invade Russia once again.

Somewhere, Patton is giggling like a schoolgirl.

 

[Shadow01]

It is possible the US did it.
It's also possible a dozen or so other countries did it.
Does anyone not think other countries can benefit from it?
China wouldn't benefit?

 

[Brad69]

Hey, I don't even know Brad69!

I like to wear my INGO thong at training events.