Patriot Sporting Arms

[Mr.Hoppes]

Patriot Sporting Arms on Maple Ave Terre Haute In.
I went in there today to look-see what they had. I had my eye on a Taurus for my wife. The sales clerk comes over and asks to help me. I said I was looking for a concealed carry and the Taurus. I made comment about having had enough of the sheriffs here. The guy says well concealed is the law in Indiana. I said Uhm.. Nope. No, it's not. The guy raises his voice to me and says "I know the law".

After that he could have said the guns were free and to take as many as I wanted, I didn't hear a word. It was over. Agree or not on the issue a dealer should know better than to expound on things he obviously doesn't know about and really should. Just because TH LEOs prefer BB doesn't make it the LAW. Not yet anyway.

I HATE SHEEP. And that one lost a costumer who is ready to purchase more than one gun, and any future business.

Oh well... Back to the store closest to me.

 

[melensdad]

Well, did you set him straight?

 

[Mr.Hoppes]

Well, did you set him straight?

By the tone of his voice I could tell it wasn't worth the breath. I did state that it was Legal and then he started to go on. I was there looking for a gun not meaningful debate. And to debate with one who is willing to loose business over his inability to keep his opinions to himself just wasn't going to be of any value. He was sheeped and converting sheep is better left to those who have more patience than I. I learned a lesson though, just shut up and buy the guns.

I hate that, I found a gun reasonably priced and, in a local shop, that my wife wanted and now I won't do business with them. It's not all about the issue, as much as how I was treaded as a costumer. I can tollerate the sheep but I won't allow the sheep to preach Sheeple to me.

 

[Bubbajms]

I dunno, I've heard several folks chatter about all kinds of things in shops all over the place, and I generally ignore them all. Some folks are helpful, some aren't - there are folks who are salesmen (who will get you to try to buy anything) some that want to help ("oh, you're looking at Glocks?? What do you like about them?? Maybe an XD or M&P would be something else to check out while you're here.. buy both!!") and then some that couldn't care less ("when you want me to get one in the box from the back room, let me know..")

I would think that a shop that sells handguns would know what a license allows and what it doesn't, seeing as it's their business, but try going into an electronics store and asking about FRS/GMRS radios. There are a few that will tell you that you need a license to use the GMRS frequencies, but most tell you that all you have to do is take them out and use them.

Personally, I do my own "shopping", only talking to someone when I need to. Working with customers in retail on a daily basis I'd love to just have someone be polite, ask me where something is, ask topical questions, then do whatever they wish. Buy from me? Great! Leave? Have a nice day!

I wouldn't abandon the store, though. I'd print out a copy of the Indiana code and ask where it says "concealed" or "open". When it is discovered that it doesn't, tell the employee that it's a license to carry, and there's nothing in the law that says how it HAS to be done. Invite them here - there's plenty of folks who would love to discuss the point!!

 

[Mr.Hoppes]

I wouldn't abandon the store, though. I'd print out a copy of the Indiana code and ask where it says "concealed" or "open". When it is discovered that it doesn't, tell the employee that it's a license to carry, and there's nothing in the law that says how it HAS to be done. Invite them here - there's plenty of folks who would love to discuss the point!!

I actually carry a copy in my vehicle and or in my jacket.

It wasn't so much his being adamant. It was about him raising his voice to me, and generally speaking in a demeaning tone. I can exist and do business with those who don't see things they same way I do. The problem lies in the way I, as the one with the money, was treated like a sheep. "Do as I say and don't question it" was the attitude. He did concede that the law as it is written allows for open carry but that the police enforce a non existent law and he was going to do as told and so should any one else. I began to inform him that the law says nothing about how the gun is carried. He was interrupted and I took that opportunity to walk out.

I just made the mistake of saying something about my situation and why I was looking for a certain line product, and did not expect a response. It was a rhetorical comment not meant to solicit commentary, just to inform, so the sales person could better service my interest.

I have a Gun store, closer to home, that I am happy with but has a limited selection. I pass this guy by regularly and thought I would see what he had. I won't be returning.

 

[Bubbajms]

That's your right as a consumer - I will, personally, not patronize one of the major home improvement stores, not due to how I was treated by one employee but by the store manager and their corporate office as well.

If police enforce a "non-existent law", that generally means they're going to arrest you, right?? Wouldn't that be false imprisonment??

George, I think you guys just need to move away from the 'Haute.. :P

 

[Soundslikejosh]

I tend to agree with Mr. Hoppes on this one, but there are two sides.

I don't mean to attack, so don't interpret it that way. My point is that if you were not interested in the CC v. OC discussion, you shouldn't have brought it up. I understand that you were chatting and wanted him to agree with you, but all OCers should be aware that MANY people don't know, are/were misinformed, and probably disagree with you. If you don't want them to disagree or tell you things that are factually wrong, avoid the subject. I know you shouldn't have to avoid it, and that it sucks so many people are misinformed, but thats how it is and noone said life would be fair.

I just think that what you said to the guy was baiting the conversation. "I made comment about having had enough of the sheriffs here." I presume this is in reference to the anti-OC attitude in TH. Personally, that seems like an invitation to a discussion that is going to end poorly, as it did.

Also, while the guy is wrong, put yourself in his shoes. Everyone of us has had it where we get into a discussion and end up finding out we are wrong. This gun shop guy held fast to his (incorrect) information. In his mind, it is fact, he just hasn't found out otherwise. That puts him in with 99.3% of the rest of the state. Yes, he works in a gun shop, but he could also work at Best Buy so don't presume that he knows about guns or gun laws. Also, don't presume he cares about OC. He was taught that its illegal so why should he go investigate to find out otherwise?

Maybe I am too pesimitic, but I don't ever expect an OC discussion to go well. The overwhelming majority of folks don't know, and too frequently it will happen like it did with Mr. Hoppes.

The main problem seems to be the way the gun store guy conducted himself in the face of a disagreement. FWIW, if he said exactly the same words in exactly the same tone to 10 different guys, they might reach 10 different opinions on how rude or informative the guy was. Remember, this guy thinks he is doing the right thing and you are doing something illegal, so he is very likely to be firm in his standpoint.

YMMV

 

[Mr.Hoppes]

That's your right as a consumer - I will, personally, not patronize one of the major home improvement stores, not due to how I was treated by one employee but by the store manager and their corporate office as well.

If police enforce a "non-existent law", that generally means they're going to arrest you, right?? Wouldn't that be false imprisonment??

George, I think you guys just need to move away from the 'Haute.. :P

yeah Montana is looking better every day. Wide open spaces and very low population.

 

[Soundslikejosh]

I was typing at the same time as Mr. Hoppes and the new information clears things up. Sounds like the guy is a jerk.

Raising your voice to a customer is bad policy.

 

[Bubbajms]

Josh has a point - in his mind, he could have been trying to prevent somebody from being hassled..

And George, you don't have to go THAT far.. there's plenty of friendlier areas in this state! Although Montana does sound nice sometimes, I WILL give you that

 

[Mr.Hoppes]

Agreed.

It is the mans store and he can choose to speak as he wishes. I as a consumer, have the right to walk away.

Like I said he did have a good selection of guns and at reasonable prices. The prices and selection in my experience didn't make it worth it. I can wait for now. I also prefer private sales, but My DW wants and needs HER personal gun now. So I was expanding my browsing area to accommodate her needs.

I respect several members here who spoke strongly for CC but did so with intellect and respect. I still don't agree with them on the subject but I still respect their opinions.

 

[Mr.Hoppes]

Montana has land at a fraction of the price here, and alot less developement. And a lot less people.

I moved out of TH to the "country" and with in 10 yrs I expect to be fighting a battle to keep my livestock because of urban sprawl. Right now my neighbor is corn and beens but I know it won't always be.

 

[Dough]

Amen to that!

 

[schm00g13]

In a previous post I described a similarly unpleasant experience with this shop. Not one thin dime of mine will ever be spent there.

 

[Dough]

Never had a problem with Patriots. Been going there for over 3 years and they treated me good. I can think of other stores that I've found otherwise. But I will not discredit them on the internet. Don't know the other side of the story anyway.

 

[schm00g13]

LOL. Nice handle, Dough. Must keep good records.

 

[Dough]

LOL. Nice handle, Dough. Must keep good records.

Thank you, I do my best!

 

[schm00g13]

So, Dough, does this means that I get my Mosin Nagant accessory kit? That would be a nice gesture and might restore some of your rep. Or you could become a sponsor like the other shop owners. After all, you must be the owner with access to the sales records. That explains the handle "Dough", the first 5 letters of my last name. Cute. After all, it was not a real mental leap to zero in on the sales record, IE, Illinois resident, Mosin Nagant M44 etc. Private message me so I can get you my new address and phone number. So you can update your records. I live in Terre Haute these days. But you probably already know that as your THPD buddies have already looked that up for you.

 

[iChokePeople]

+1/-1 from me for Patriot.

+1: Helpful, friendly.
-1: In planning a transfer from out of state, I intended to use Patriot as my local FFL... until I found out he wanted to charge 10% of the purchase price as the transfer fee. Probably won't be using him for FFL transfers any time soon.

 

[stchas]

How is the selection/prices in Patriots? I only recently moved into this area if IN and tomorrow Iam planning a to do some shopping, well more like buying. Lol. I have not bee in there or favre,s for that matter. Any thoughts on those two. It seems the service is lacking in Patriots.