OOPS!

[Jack Ryan]

...Brill told police he had a gun on his right hip, a loaded magazine of bullets in his front left pocket and a knife in his front right pocket.
Police found those weapons in a search, Batcho said, specifically a loaded Smith and Wesson .45-caliber automatic handgun.
Brill also had a valid Indiana personal protection handgun permit, Batcho said.
Brill, an Indiana University student, told police he brought the gun to the bar for his own protection, as he has been in fights in Bloomington before and has been injured.
...

Carrying, drinking, carrousing in the bars at 2am, got his back up edge defense weapon, sounds like 24/7, 360 degree, total awareness guy to me. LOL, I just have to jump to the end of the thread now to see if he's owned up to his screen name here.

 

[deadsquirrel]

they have plenty of security at the bar though. if it were outside the walls of the bar back in the alley to me it would be an entirely different situation

 

[chezuki]

LOL, I just have to jump to the end of the thread now to see if he's owned up to his screen name here.

I want to know how SootKing is posting so much from jail...

https://www.indianagunowners.com/forums/carry_issues_and_self_defense/78905-got_into_road_rage.html

 

[Blue Tile Spook]

as usual, even gun owners crucify one of their own after relying only on the accounts of the anti-gun media.

having words with a woman, even an argument, doesnt mean 5 guys need to break it up. my experience in college is that these bar hound pussies travel in packs, so it really wouldnt surprise me if they escalated the situation. i have never been in a fight in my life and probably couldn't beat up most women....so if 5 frat boys told me they were going to "**** me up", etc, you're damn right i'd be afraid of severe bodily harm.

If this were my son and he made a statement like the kid did, about having had trouble in the bars prior to this, my question to him would be, "Why the heck are you continuing to go out to bars, then?" If he encounters periodic times of trouble, he might want to look at just WHO the dots in the picture lead back to and accept some advice about making good decisions.

 

[LPMan59]

If this were my son and he made a statement like the kid did, about having had trouble in the bars prior to this, my question to him would be, "Why the heck are you continuing to go out to bars, then?" If he encounters periodic times of trouble, he might want to look at just WHO the dots in the picture lead back to and accept some advice about making good decisions.

i see your point, but even if he started every previous fight, that doesnt mean he started this one. i just find it ironic that so many people complain about the so-called liberal, freedom hating media, yet take it as fact when the gun-carrying community might need to save face.

 

[singlestacksig]

i see your point, but even if he started every previous fight, that doesnt mean he started this one. i just find it ironic that so many people complain about the so-called liberal, freedom hating media, yet take it as fact when the gun-carrying community might need to save face.

the "truth" lies with the woman he was seen talking with, what is her statement to the police? If she can not back up the guys story .. or if she says he was bothering her.. then he was totally in the wrong..

 

[LPMan59]

the "truth" lies with the woman he was seen talking with, what is her statement to the police? If she can not back up the guys story .. or if she says he was bothering her.. then he was totally in the wrong..

yeah in that case, he's screwed

 

[Paco Bedejo]

Conjecture - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Anyone have an opinion on the drapes in the bar?...

 

[finity]

When I started reading this thread I wasn't really surprised that some of the gun-owners on this forum would start to to crucify him without any real evidence.

Thanks to the ones who eventually got the ball rolling on a more reasoned approach to this.

Remember - no duty to retreat, disparity of force.

If you wouldn't draw when you are being threatened by 5 guys (assuming for a minute that's what happened) when exactly would you you draw?

A verbal altercation (with a woman or anyone else) that didn't include threats of violence is no justification for anyone to threaten you. A simple argument isn't a crime worthy of "stepping in". If I'm in a tiff with my wife & 5 guys "stepped in" I think I'd be justified in telling them to just mind their own business. If they don't walk away at that point then who's the agressor? If they continued to harass me or threaten me then I think I'd be justified in defending myself.

I'm not saying the guys threatened him, I really don't know any more than anyone else who wasn't there.

 

[mms]

yep just want we don't need with the hole carry on campus thing

I stand by my first post ... but i do agree with the latter direction the thread has taken of we don't know what happen I agree 5 to 1 could definitely be life threatening.... but ether way it is a prime example once it is spun ( look what it did to us at first) that the aint's will use against the carry on campus

 

[SavageEagle]

OK, now hold on guys. I'm confused. He's sitting in a bar arguing with a girl. A bunch of guys step in and start going at it with him. Now stop. It says he's been injured in bar fights before in and around bloomington.

Now if this is you, and you carried like normal but into a bar, having those previous experiences, and you're arguing with your ex when 5-6 guys come up and start threatening you. Would you not be in fear for your life? I mean, I'm a little guy. 28y/o, 5'7", 140lbs. Granted, I've had Tae Kwon Do training and can defend myself fairly well. However, that's not going to help outnumbered 5/1.

Now, I do agree that he shouldn't have pointed it at the crowd or whatever. Hell, he may not have needed to draw period, but just show it. However, if he was THAT scared for his life and those guys were seriously threatening him... I don't blame him for trying to defend himself.

I know a lot of you will chastise me for this, but seriously, put yourself into that situation. Maybe he could have used some training. Maybe he could have ran. Maybe not. Maybe he could have bought them all a beer and dropped it. We don't know.

Yes, he did wrong, but to me, if he'd done things a LITTLE different, we'd be praising him instead of damning him.

 

[r.o.b.o.]

To me the big problem here is where he did it at. He did this inside a campus bar where there were many other people, bouncers, bartenders, etc. Also everytime I have been there there are always cops somewhere very near. In this case I don't think his life was threatened at all. Yea maybe he would have taken a few punches to the face but nothing life threatening. It would have been broken up quickly.

 

[mk2ja]

To me the big problem here is where he did it at. He did this inside a campus bar where there were many other people, bouncers, bartenders, etc.

I thought for sure that somebody posted in this thread that it was in fact an off-campus bar, but I must be too tired cuz I can't find it now.

Also everytime I have been there there are always cops somewhere very near. In this case I don't think his life was threatened at all. Yea maybe he would have taken a few punches to the face but nothing life threatening. It would have been broken up quickly.

Well you've got :bigballs: if you'd be willing to take a few punches and just wait for security to break it up. I haven't been in such a situation, and I sure hope I don't end up in one, but I kinda doubt that I'd be willing to just take a beating and wait for somebody else to break it up.

Remember that the IC doesn't say your life has to be threatened to justify the use of force, even deadly force. It says you have to be in reasonable fear of serious bodily harm (or a few other possibilities).

 

[Glock Lover]

My question is what's his user name on here.

 

[finity]

In this case I don't think his life was threatened at all.

I sure wouldn't want you on my jury if I was in this situation. Does the term "innocent until proven guilty" mean anything?

Yea maybe he would have taken a few punches to the face but nothing life threatening. It would have been broken up quickly.

I guess you missed all the threads talking about how those "few punches to the face" have ended someones life or otherwise altered it forever by being paralyzed. Especially if it's FIVE GUYS doing the punching.

Nope. I'm not sitting around & letting FIVE GUYS punch me in the face or anywhere else...even if they think I deserve it.

 

[SavageEagle]

I sure wouldn't want you on my jury if I was in this situation. Does the term "innocent until proven guilty" mean anything?



I guess you missed all the threads talking about how those "few punches to the face" have ended someones life or otherwise altered it forever by being paralyzed. Especially if it's FIVE GUYS doing the punching.

Nope. I'm not sitting around & letting FIVE GUYS punch me in the face or anywhere else...even if they think I deserve it.

I never thought I'd say this, but I agree with finity. (Wow, I said it! )

Serious bodily harm. Yep, 5 guys, vs me. No contest. I would make it clear I have a way to protect myself. But I don't think I could draw my pistol unless they continued to advance together.

Something along the lines of "GET BACK! LEAVE ME ALONE!" and a few other choice words would have to be yelled in order for everyone in the bar to know I wasn't looking for a fight and in fact wanted out of the current situation before I even THINK about pulling my firearm. To me, my firearm is just a tool. A tool to fix a potentially deadly situation just as a hammer fixes a loose nail. It either pulls it out, or hammers it in. How it's used depends on the situation. In this situation, maybe I'd "reach for my wallet" and in the process swing back my coat to expose my EDC.

Again, I don't think I would draw unless they continued to threaten my life knowing I didn't want the fight and that I'm armed.

 

[finity]

I never thought I'd say this, but I agree with finity. (Wow, I said it! )

I knew if I kept at it you would eventually get drawn into the light side.

 

[Paco Bedejo]

To me the big problem here is where he did it at. He did this inside a campus bar where there were many other people, bouncers, bartenders, etc.

How does that matter? 5 -vs- 1 are dangerous odds regardless of geography or how you think it will affect you politically.

Also everytime I have been there there are always cops somewhere very near.

And when seconds count...

In this case I don't think his life was threatened at all. Yea maybe he would have taken a few punches to the face but nothing life threatening. It would have been broken up quickly.

Boise man faces stiffer crime for deadly punch - KIVITV.COM | Boise. News, Breaking News, Weather and Sports-
Omaha.com - The Omaha World-Herald: Metro/Region - Iowan sentenced for deadly punch
State: Student in jail for deadly punch warns others
Defendant's companion threw deadly punch, lawyer says.(Crime)(A deputy district attorney disputes the defense claim that Darrell Sky Walker is innocent in the death of Phillip Gillins) - The Register Guard (Eugene, OR) | Encyclopedia.com
UPDATE: Deadly Punch
Punch to the face kills man watching breastfeeding - INQUIRER.net, Philippine News for Filipinos
Deadly punch lands Ypsi man in jail | Ann Arbor News Archives - MLive.com
Water row led to deadly punch - National - smh.com.au

I think you've seen too many movies. Never ever throw a punch at somebody whom you don't believe intends you severe bodily harm. Never stand there, gun on hip, and take a punch either.

Punch = Deadly Force

 

[dburkhead]

I sure wouldn't want you on my jury if I was in this situation. Does the term "innocent until proven guilty" mean anything?



I guess you missed all the threads talking about how those "few punches to the face" have ended someones life or otherwise altered it forever by being paralyzed. Especially if it's FIVE GUYS doing the punching.

Nope. I'm not sitting around & letting FIVE GUYS punch me in the face or anywhere else...even if they think I deserve it.

QFT and well said.

 

[deadsquirrel]

apparently he only had his carry permit for a week