NRA: On the Second Amendment, Don’t Believe Obama!

[DustinG]

On the Second Amendment, Don’t Believe Obama! Friday, June 06, 2008

On the Second Amendment,​

Don’t Believe Obama!​

The presidential primary season is finally over, and it is now time for gun owners to take a careful look at just where apparent nominee Barack Obama stands on issues related to the Second Amendment. During the primaries, Obama tried to hide behind vague statements of support for “sportsmen” or unfounded claims of general support for the right to keep and bear arms.

Print PDF version But his real record, based on votes taken, political associations, and long standing positions, shows that Barack Obama is a serious threat to Second Amendment liberties. Don’t listen to his campaign rhetoric! Look instead to what he has said and done during his entire political career.

FACT: Barack Obama voted to allow reckless lawsuits designed to bankrupt the firearms industry.1
FACT: Barack Obama wants to re-impose the failed and discredited Clinton Gun Ban.2
FACT: Barack Obama voted to ban almost all rifle ammunition commonly used for hunting and sport shooting.3
FACT: Barack Obama has endorsed a complete ban on handgun ownership.2
FACT: Barack Obama supports local gun bans in Chicago, Washington, D.C., and other cities.4
FACT: Barack Obama voted to uphold local gun bans and the criminal prosecution of people who use firearms in self-defense.5
FACT: Barack Obama supports gun owner licensing and gun registration.6
FACT: Barack Obama refused to sign a friend-of-the-court Brief in support of individual Second Amendment rights in the Heller case.
FACT: Barack Obama opposes Right to Carry laws.7
FACT: Barack Obama was a member of the Board of Directors of the Joyce Foundation, the leading source of funds for anti-gun organizations and “research.”8
FACT: Barack Obama supported a proposal to ban gun stores within 5 miles of a school or park, which would eliminate almost every gun store in America.9
FACT: Barack Obama voted not to notify gun owners when the state of Illinois did records searches on them.10
FACT: Barack Obama voted against a measure to lower the Firearms Owners Identification card age minimum from 21 to 18, a measure designed to assist young people in the military.11
FACT: Barack Obama favors a ban on standard capacity magazines.12
FACT: Barack Obama supports mandatory micro-stamping.13
FACT: Barack Obama supports mandatory waiting periods.2
FACT: Barack Obama supports repeal of the Tiahrt Amendment, which prohibits information on gun traces collected by the BATFE from being used in reckless lawsuits against firearm dealers and manufacturers.14
FACT: Barack Obama supports one-gun-a-month sales restrictions.9
FACT: Barack Obama supports a ban on inexpensive handguns.9
FACT: Barack Obama supports a ban on the resale of police issued firearms, even if the money is going to police departments for replacement equipment.9
FACT: Barack Obama supports mandatory firearm training requirements for all gun owners and a ban on gun ownership for persons under the age of 21.9

1. United States Senate, S. 397, vote number 219, July 2, 2005. (http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=109&session=1&vote=00219)
2. Independent Voters of Illinois/Independent Precinct Organization general candidate questionnaire, Sept. 9, 1996. The responses on this survey were described in “Obama had greater role on liberal survey,” Politico, March 31, 20087. (http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0308/9269.html)
3. United States Senate, S. 397, vote number 217, Kennedy amendment July 2, 2005. (http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=109&session=1&vote=00217)
4. David Wright, Ursula Fahy and Sunlen Miller, "Obama: 'Common Sense Regulation' On Gun Owners' Rights," ABC News' "Political Radar" Blog, Political Punch, 2/15/08. (http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2008/02/obama-common-se.html)
5. Illinois Senate, March 25, 2004 SB 2165, vote 20.
6. “Fact Check: No News In Obama's Consistent Record.” Obama ’08, December 11, 2007. (http://www.barackobama.com/factcheck/2007/12/11/fact_check_no_news_in_obamas_c.php)
7. “Candidates' gun control positions may figure in Pa. vote,” Pittsburgh Tribune-Review, Wednesday, April 2, 2008, and "Keyes, Obama Are Far Apart On Guns," Chicago Tribune, 9/15/04. (http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/news/s_560181.html)
8. 1998 Joyce Foundation Annual Report, p. 7. (http://www.joycefdn.org/pdf/98_AnnualReport.pdf)
9. “Obama and Gun Control,” The Volokh Conspiracy, taken from the Chicago Defender, Dec. 13, 1999. (http://www.volokh.com/posts/1203389334.shtml)
10. Illinois Senate, May 5, 2002, SB 1936 Con., vote 26.
11. Illinois Senate, March 25, 2003, SB 2163, vote 18.
12. “Clinton, Edwards, Obama on gun control,” Radio Iowa, Sunday, April 22, 2007. (http://learfield.typepad.com/radioiowa/2007/04/clinton_edwards.html)
13. Chicago Tribune blogs, “Barack Obama: NIU Shootings call for action,” February 15, 2008, (http://blogs.trb.com/news/politics/blog/2008/02/barack_obama_comments_on_shoot.html)
14. Barack Obama campaign website: “As president, Barack Obama would repeal the Tiahrt Amendment . . .” (http://www.barackobama.com/issues/urbanpolicy/#crime-and-law-enforcement.)

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[jontheturboguy]

Vote Islamic Socialist in 2009. WOW.

 

[Steelman]

Could they at least be objective and do a write-up on all the candidates? Just once. Please.

 

[DustinG]

They aren't trying to be objective, they look at the two candidates and see which one threatens the 2nd Amendment the most, which is clearly Obama. Obama voted to not allow people to keep guns in their house when he was in the Illinois senate. Although McCain (who I dislike, but don't hate like Obama) has not always voted pro-2nd Amendment, he is by far the lesser of two evils.

I personally believe that when a government official wants to rid a country of guns is because they want to prevent a revolution that may occur because of their oppressive policies. The last straw that the government will pull is the weapons, because it will prevent the citizens from revolting...

 

[Steelman]

I personally believe that when a government official wants to rid a country of guns is because they want to prevent a revolution that may occur because of their oppressive policies. The last straw that the government will pull is the weapons, because it will prevent the citizens from revolting...

If it's not an objective study...........it's not a credible study. It's more commonly called propaganda.



Ya know. I wouldn't be posting this if I didn't hold my 2nd amendment right near and dear to my heart.

That being said, the 2nd amendment is not the only thing at stake.

 

[Santee]

Look up the candidates voting record, find out what the candidates have said. With the facts in mind, you can work past the propaganda and vote accordingly.

And you are right, Steelman, there is a hell of a lot at stake, in fact, the full gambit is at stake.

 

[Steelman]

Look up the candidates voting record, find out what the candidates have said. With the facts in mind, you can work past the propaganda and vote accordingly.

And you are right, Steelman, there is a hell of a lot at stake, in fact, the full gambit is at stake.

I know the score and the history of each candidate.


It's just odd that a bunch of you want to slam Obama for voting against us.


And then loudly proclaim, "John McCain will save us! He cares about our rights!"


You're cutting off your nose to spite your face.

 

[Santee]

Steelman

John McCain is sure to hell not the next President that I would like, but the alternative is Obama. To get anything less than McCain is to get Obama, and that seems like "cutting your nose off in spite of your face."

 

[DustinG]

I can honestly tell you that John McCain was never one of my choices from the Republican primaries and I am still not sure that I have enough will to go to the polling station and vote for him. I have never liked McCain, I think he has represented my beliefs less than some of the Moderate Democrats. I do not vote according to the R or D next to their name, but rather what the politician's policies are.

With that being said, Barrack Obama is so scary that I might be forced to bite my tongue and place a vote for John McCain. I am very disappointed in the Republican Party for nominating McCain. I did not leave the Party, but I believe the Party has left me. I am deciding upon becoming a Libertarian, but I do not agree with their stance on the military and the war.

To sum it up, I either cut off my hand by voting for McCain or kill myself and allow Obama to win!

 

[haldir]

I haven't talked to any right thinking American that is excited about McCain. I have talked to a lot of kool aid drinking true believers that are really excited about Obama. I have struggled with the idea of teaching the GOP leaders a lesson by voting for Bob Barr this time on the Libertarian ticket. I just don't know if we can risk the damage that a government with Dems controlling both houses of Congress and the White House could inflict upon us. In addition to the problems with guns, this guy wants to make our soldiers subject to prosecution in the Hague, he wants to send $800 billion to the UN... and the list goes on.

 

[Crystalship1]

Steelman

John McCain is sure to hell not the next President that I would like, but the alternative is Obama. To get anything less than McCain is to get Obama, and that seems like "cutting your nose off in spite of your face."

True, but he's a lost cause and vote.... literally!!!! There's no turning this one around. He will effectively be casting his vote for Obama regardless of what he believes. :rolleyesedit:

 

[Steelman]

Well I wish you all the best in selecting you candidate this year. It's a tough choice for gun owners any way you look at it.

I guess I'm just a bitter Libertarian.

Maybe after 4 years of McCain or Obama you guys might be interested in voting 3rd party. Wishful thinking - I'm sure.

I cannot endorse Bobb Barr whole-heartedly due to his complete 180 on his political beliefs.

Once again - best of luck!

 

[Sphynx]

What, exactly, do you think the 2nd Amendment is? It doesn't begin and end at "A right to bear Arms". It begins with the right to have a Militia, which in these days means the right to protect your own home from hostile forces. It ends with giving "The People" a right to bear arms, not "Every Person".

The oath of a President is to uphold the Constitution as written, not as translated by those who seek the most out of it.

I do not object to more and better gun control. Get guns off the streets and back into the homes and for hunting. Require that people be responsible in order to bear arms.

 

[RonPaulSupporter]

It ends with giving "The People" a right to bear arms, not "Every Person". The oath of a President is to uphold the Constitution as written, not as translated by those who seek the most out of it.

So when the 1st Amendment says "the right of the people to peacefully assemble.." the 4th Amendment says "the right of the people to be secure against unreasonable searches and seizures.." does that mean not "every person" (as you say) has those rights? The Constitution gives "the People" (meaning ALL people) the right to keep and bear arms. That means you can hunt, target shoot, carry for self defense, etc. The Constitution and Bill of Rights are not "living documents" that we redefine to fit our political views, they mean EXACTLY what they say.

 

[Sphynx]

We as a people have a right to assemble peacefully, a right to be secure against unreasonable searches and a right to bear arms. All true. Also true, Loitering is a crime despite the 1st amendment. Group vagrancy is a crime despite the 1st amendment. Airport security can still go through luggage despite the 4th amendment. Point being, these 'rights' always have limitations. We as a 'people' may all own and bear arms, and I'd be happy for it, as long as the limitations that provide security to me are set in place, such as a held-responsibility, a removal of that right when abused, etc, etc.

Rights should only be rights to a point, and if you were a Squatter instead of a hard-core gun-clinging NRA member, you'd push for the expansion of the 1st amendment to allow Loitering and grouped vagrancy. The key is to maintain a perspective that makes the entirety of the constitution equally limited and right-giving.

 

[Justus]

Sphynx:
I believe your interpretation is incorrect.
You're implying the 2nd amendment is the only one worded
in such a way as not to be an individual right.

Also, you might want to re-evaluate the last 4 words ".....shall not be infringed"
Aren't there enough gun control laws on the books?
Can you think of any more that would solve the crime problem?
Maybe you should research the Cook county and Wash DC laws to see
how well the additional restrictions work to reduce crime.
Chicago recently reported their highest level yet of gun violence despite
enacting some of the strictest gun control in the country, gun control that
Obama was instrumental in creating.

According to your logic, laws creating speech control would be the answer
to offensive comments protected under the 1st amendment.

You might also want to visit the Indiana constitution.

I see by your previous posts that you are an Obama supporter.
You and I are on different sides of the table on many subjects.

 

[Justus]

We as a 'people' may all own and bear arms, and I'd be happy for it, as long as the limitations that provide security to me are set in place, such as a held-responsibility, a removal of that right when abused, etc, etc.

Your comment in bold above tells me quite a bit about you.
Someday your views will change and I hope you haven't lost too
much freedom by then.

 

[Sphynx]

What do you think it tells you about me? I've had enough guns pulled on me to assure you my views will not change. There are people who simply should not have guns, and as long as they are in possession of such weapons, people who see them as devices with which to threaten, devices to commit crimes with, devices to vent ones emotions with, as long as people die because some vigilante with a permit to have a handgun took the law into his own hands in a situation where nobody should have died, I will have that opinion.

 

[BloodEclipse]

I do not object to more and better gun control. Get guns off the streets and back into the homes and for hunting. Require that people be responsible in order to bear arms.

Wow, this is the last thing I thought that I would ever see on an Indiana Gun Forum.

Sphynx are you a gun owner? If that picture is of yourself, I assume that is your child? Who's responsibility is it to protect that child?
Our society? The police? Or perhaps that responsibility would fall to YOU?

You seem to think that better gun control would somehow make those who break the law and prey upon others suddenly say to themselves "Gee this is better gun control I think I'll start obeying the law and not bring harm to others".

So knowing that there really are BAD people in the world, who do bring harm to others, the question is how do you best protect yourself and your loved ones?

Having a gun at home is a start and might work if you never left the house. Thinking nothing ever bad could happen to you is a big gamble. I'm sure you want to be around to watch your family grow.
So what is your plan. How do you protect yourself and your loved ones. Giving some thought to it, is what you are doing really being responsible enough?

I know that nothing means more to me than my family and there is no length I won't go to ensure their safety.

Also I take issue with your interpretation of the 2nd. The Bill of rights are about individual rights not States rights. If you haven't read the recent Supreme Court ruling on Heller I suggest you do.

 

[Justus]

Sphinx:
You didn't answer my question:
How would more gun control solve this issue?

Do you really think more laws would work to stop someone
with no respect for the law?
(the answer can be found in Chicago and DC)

Do you know of any permit holders that have become vigilantes
or is that just a passionate emotional statement?

For some reason I think you are an Obama campaigner trolling the gun boards.