notify leo of ccw?

[RomanDad]

Thanks for the replies all... So no requirement except SA to not get shot.

. A lot of cops don't know that OC is leagle let alone CC in CALI.

You have no idea how true that is.... (Actually, UNLOADED open carry is legal, but the bill to outlaw it is on the governors desk....Loaded open carry is illegal here)

I took my local police department's "Citizen Academy". 16 weeks of lectures on various topics- Staffing, tactics, ,4th amendment, traffic, Jail, IAD, Weapons, Vice, gangs, SWAT, Ride-along etc etc etc....

One week a VERY nice officer was giving a presentation on search- Specifically vehicle searches... Anyway, he brings up a scenario where he sees a gun on the seat and what he does in that instance, and its pretty aggressive. An older lady in the class raises her hand and asks "what if they have a permit for the gun to carry it?"

The officer smiles... Almost LAUGHS and says:
"There's no such thing."

My hand shoots up, I (almost coming out of my skin) yell, "I have one." And he looks at me quizzically... I say "Wanna see it?"

Then a guy a few seats down says "Ive got one too." (this is in a class of about a dozen people).

On my ride-along, a DIFFERENT cop Also had NO idea there was such a thing as a CCW in California.

Cops dont need CCWs. So they dont look into them. And in the course of their jobs, they never see them.

 

[JoshuaW]

+1

Or, "I'm not at liberty to discuss that with you, officer. Am I being detained or am I free to go now?"

Questions during a traffic stop should pertain to the reason I'm stopped. I'm not going to carry on a conversation about other issues.

Now THAT is stupid, IMO. Its indirect, and essentially a lie. You dont have a duty to disclose, but that also doesnt mean you CANT disclose. The officer is just going to get very suspicious. Have fun with that one!

 

[henktermaat]

Thanks for the replies all... So no requirement except SA to not get shot.



You have no idea how true that is.... (Actually, UNLOADED open carry is legal, but the bill to outlaw it is on the governors desk....Loaded open carry is illegal here)

I took my local police department's "Citizen Academy". 16 weeks of lectures on various topics- Staffing, tactics, ,4th amendment, traffic, Jail, IAD, Weapons, Vice, gangs, SWAT, Ride-along etc etc etc....

One week a VERY nice officer was giving a presentation on search- Specifically vehicle searches... Anyway, he brings up a scenario where he sees a gun on the seat and what he does in that instance, and its pretty aggressive. An older lady in the class raises her hand and asks "what if they have a permit for the gun to carry it?"

The officer smiles... Almost LAUGHS and says:
"There's no such thing."

My hand shoots up, I (almost coming out of my skin) yell, "I have one." And he looks at me quizzically... I say "Wanna see it?"

Then a guy a few seats down says "Ive got one too." (this is in a class of about a dozen people).

On my ride-along, a DIFFERENT cop Also had NO idea there was such a thing as a CCW in California.

Cops dont need CCWs. So they dont look into them. And in the course of their jobs, they never see them.

Wow. Thanks for sharing. It's must be bad out there that your cops are actually less informed than ours!

 

[RomanDad]

Please stick around our forum RomanDad. Give us a play by play of your experiences in CA. We know things are bad there and getting worse all the time.

Things are bad and arguably getting worse....

A few things HAVE improved. We have found a loophole in the states "Assault weapon ban" that has allowed hundreds of thousands of AR15 type rifles as well as many other types of "Evil black rifles" (AKs HKs, etc... I should post up my collection sometime) to be legally sold in the state in the last few years.

On the other hand, the legislature keeps passing MORE and MORE laws to hassle lawful gun owners. I have been fighting for CCW rights in California for over a decade, and we were recently dealt a pretty bad blow.

But I beleive there may be a light at the end of the tunnel.... Heller and McDonald (You guys have maybe also heard of "Nordyke" which was the first case to find the 2nd amendment was incorporated to the States, even before McDonald) have given us the ticket to enter the court and challenge some of these stupid laws.

Just the same... Im tired of fighting... And California has a lot more problems than just guns, and thanks to the particular gerrymandering issues in California, THEY ARE UNFIXABLE. I know people outside the state think an earthquake will sink California into the ocean.... Dont worry about it. We are so underwater already, nobody would notice the difference. That loud sucking sound you hear to your left is us circling the drain.

So Im preparing my exit strategy and gathering my transition team.

 

[junglerogue]

Per your CCW scenario at academy, the cops' response was justified, considering that the license is a CONCEALED carry weapon (please correct me if that is not what CCW stands for in CA). Texas is the same way, however I wouldn't hesitate if I saw a weapon on the front seat and was conducting a traffic stop, especially if there was no duty to inform. What's to separate the good from the bad riding around with a weapon on the front seat.

 

[RomanDad]

I would like to know how about you ended up being approved in cali. Please pm me! Me love you long time if you do!

Long story short- California CCWs are handled on a County by County basis. Any County Sheriff or Police Chief can issue and they are valid throughout the state. Most of the Police Chiefs defer to the Sheriff.

They require training, "good moral character" and "good Cause".

I put those two in quotes because the definition of them differs from county to county. We have an attorney general memo from 1974 that "Good Moral Character" means "modesty" and sort of hints as homosexuals lacking it.

In the rural counties, (Some of which are HIGHLY populated in and of themselves) "I walk alone at night and want to carry a gun to protect myself" suffices as "Good Cause". In San Francisco you can present a signed confession from a notorious gang member specifically stating the time and place he intends to kill you and they will not issue you a ccw. In Los Angeles, good cause is that you are a political donor to the Sheirff.

In 1998 Orange County (where Disneyland is) elected Mike Carona and he instituted a more liberal CCW policy, whereby almost anybody (including me) could get one. Unfortunately, you may have heard, he turned out to be a pretty sleazy guy and was Federally indicted in 2008. The County Board of Supervisors hand picked his successor (we did not get to vote) and they chose a woman, anti-gun, deputy sheriff from Los Angeles.

Ive spent the last two years trying to beat her politically.... We ran a really good candidate against her, but beating a sitting incumbent sheriff is almost impossible. The election was last month, and she won.

 

[RomanDad]

Per your CCW scenario at academy, the cops' response was justified, considering that the license is a CONCEALED carry weapon (please correct me if that is not what CCW stands for in CA). Texas is the same way, however I wouldn't hesitate if I saw a weapon on the front seat and was conducting a traffic stop, especially if there was no duty to inform. What's to separate the good from the bad riding around with a weapon on the front seat.

No... California law considers a handgun in the passenger compartment of a vehicle to be "Concealed" (CPC 12025). In the vehicle if you have a permit, you can lay it right there on the seat or in glove box or anywhere else (people who are licensed under cpc 12050 are exempt from 12025.) . Its not RECOMMENDED to lay it out where a passing trucker MIGHT see it (I usually toss a coat or book over it if Im in the car alone and its on the seat next to me), but as long as its "Under your exclusive control" in the vehicle, you're legal.) It doesn't actually HAVE to be on your person, and if it is you can take your coat off, etc...

The fact is, California cops just arent aware they exist. THEY NEVER SEE THEM in the course of their job. One of the REASONS CCWs are SO hard to get is they are given away as political favors. Los Angeles County has a population of 9 million people (I beleive thats larger than the ENTIRE STATE of Indiana?) It has around 300 permits issue. And many of those permits belong to big named hollywood stars who's names you would recognize, or to reserve police officers and Judges.

 

[Keith_Indy]

Just the same... Im tired of fighting... And California has a lot more problems than just guns, and thanks to the particular gerrymandering issues in California, THEY ARE UNFIXABLE. I know people outside the state think an earthquake will sink California into the ocean.... Dont worry about it. We are so underwater already, nobody would notice the difference. That loud sucking sound you hear to your left is us circling the drain.

So Im preparing my exit strategy and gathering my transition team.

Well, you'll be welcome here as long as you leave any liberal policies you may have picked up behind. We should really start testing people to see if they want to change Indiana into their version of "paradise."

Be prepared for the absolute SHOCK of random people smiling and saying hello for no reason what-so-ever.

Except for the following, unless asked, I wont mention it. If the gun were say, in the glove box with the vehicle registration, I'd bring it up before trying to get the papers. If the officer wanted me to get out of the vehicle, and I had the gun on my person, I'd also bring it up.

 

[NDguido]

+1

Or, "I'm not at liberty to discuss that with you, officer. Am I being detained or am I free to go now?"

Questions during a traffic stop should pertain to the reason I'm stopped. I'm not going to carry on a conversation about other issues.

I've never understood this philosophy. We spend so much time.....(especially OC advocates) trying to convince the public that gun owners are everyday people. We try to convince them that we're non-threatening, level headed individuals just as they perceive themselves to be. You ruin that image by being obtuse and uncooperative with somebody that is generally only concerned with his own safety and yours.

I don't get it. What gives YOU the right to decide what is pertinent to the stop and not HIM? Answer: Nothing....he has a right to know.

 

[RomanDad]

Well, you'll be welcome here as long as you leave any liberal policies you may have picked up behind. We should really start testing people to see if they want to change Indiana into their version of "paradise." .

My version of paradise is my neighbors leaving me the **** alone.

 

[JoshuaW]

I like this guy All in favor of starting a "Bring RomanDad to Indiana" fund, say "I"!

Congrats on managing that difficult permit. How often do you have to renew it, and is it equally as hard to renew as it is to initially achieve one?

 

[RomanDad]

I like this guy All in favor of starting a "Bring RomanDad to Indiana" fund, say "I"!

Screw that. I can afford to move myself... Save your cash... When I get there Im going to run against Barron Hill- Just contribute to my campaign fund.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtmgQ2W3lhM

Congrats on managing that difficult permit. How often do you have to renew it, and is it equally as hard to renew as it is to initially achieve one?

My application was 28 pages long with all the supporting documentation. And it was rejected 3 times (For- Wait for it.... "lack of documentation"- My response was "I SENT YOU 28 PAGES!") The entire process takes about 3-5 months or so, and is as much about perseverance and not giving up in frustration (which is what they want, because then the statistics dont show you as a "denial".)

The "renewal" is the same application as the initial. Only the fees are different... (It goes from about $250 to about $100 not including the cost of training.) You have to "reapply"- With everything.

Its Every four years for Reserve LEO;
Every three years for Judges;
Every two years for everybody else.

 

[RomanDad]

So, this is totally off topic, I suppose its my thread and I got the answer I wanted so I can jack it if I want? Mods should move it if they want-

With my CCWs (CA., UT, NV & FL) I am legal to carry in Indiana when I visit two weeks from now.

Can I carry open, like you people can with your LTCH? Or am I restricted to the terms of my license under your reciprocity?

 

[Delmar]

So, this is totally off topic, I suppose its my thread and I got the answer I wanted so I can jack it if I want? Mods should move it if they want-

With my CCWs (CA., UT, NV & FL) I am legal to carry in Indiana when I visit two weeks from now.

Can I carry open, like you people can with your LTCH? Or am I restricted to the terms of my license under your reciprocity?

Indiana accepts the carry permits of every state that offers them so I am sure you can carry here on your visit. I assume you can OC but I admit I'm just guessing, which doesn't do you any good, I'm afraid. Do any of the states you have a permit for have OC?

 

[RomanDad]

Indiana accepts the carry permits of every state that offers them so I am sure you can carry here on your visit. I assume you can OC but I admit I'm just guessing, which doesn't do you any good, I'm afraid. Do any of the states you have a permit for have OC?

I dont know and Im not sure how to find out the answer. California allows UNLOADED open carry, but right now theyre trying (and they will succeed) to ban it.... Because.... You know, "There's been lots of people who have been shot with an unloaded gun."

IMG_1099.mp4 video by JJKESSEL - Photobucket

 

[Keith_Indy]

Hey, if you're around on Aug the 14th, I'd love to show you some Hoosier hospitality. We're having a get together of some forum members, and you're more then welcome to come. Shoot me a PM if you're interested.

I think the first time I got my LTCH, it took 3-4 weeks total. One or 2 pages, fingerprints, and the money. This last time it was about the same, but I got the LIFETIME LTCH, so I don't have to worry about renewing.

And put me down as a future supporter of your campaign.

 

[JoshuaW]

Oh wow! That is horrible! Jump ship now! I cant imagine. In some ways its almost not worth the effort. $100 every other year? 20+ Pages of documentation? If you are indeed planning on moving, I applaud your excellent decision! If not, perhaps you really should consider it!

 

[JoshuaW]

Yes, you can carry open here, even when visiting. You are under our laws (just like we would be under yours, Michigan's, Florida's, etc) and our laws are silent on the issue. So let lose and enjoy some freedom!

 

[Jerry C]

My son-in-law is a Indiana state trooper, I just recently ask him this same question. He wasn't sure so he called the head man in the licensing division at Indy and ask him. He said if your out of state license allows you to open carry in your state you can open carry in Indiana, if yours is for concealed only then it is concealed only in Indiana.

 

[RomanDad]

Hey, if you're around on Aug the 14th, I'd love to show you some Hoosier hospitality. We're having a get together of some forum members, and you're more then welcome to come. Shoot me a PM if you're interested.

I think the first time I got my LTCH, it took 3-4 weeks total. One or 2 pages, fingerprints, and the money. This last time it was about the same, but I got the LIFETIME LTCH, so I don't have to worry about renewing.

And put me down as a future supporter of your campaign.

Thanks for the invite but I beleive my EXFIL is scheduled for a week later....

Oh wow! That is horrible! Jump ship now! I cant imagine. In some ways its almost not worth the effort. $100 every other year? 20+ Pages of documentation? If you are indeed planning on moving, I applaud your excellent decision! If not, perhaps you really should consider it!

I wouldnt be here if I werent serious about it.... I think were definitely decided to move there.... I think the only issue now is timing... . May not be in the next year or so.... But I think we are both really set on a <5 yr time frame. Still a big transition for me and there are other obvious considerations (school etc). My wife would move back tonight if I gave the go order.