Maybe dumb concealed carry ??

[jdmack79]

Kirk, I don't see many instances where guns are just firing with no cause. (we know about your 870) Every single one of these holster discharges I have read about involved something pulling the trigger on the gun.

Then you must be new to INGO cause I post them up.

Gun CAN go bang without triggers being pulled. To deny the obvious is to risk our collective safety and right to carry.

Revovler in pocket (where else) in Florida discharges into leg because of bowling ball.

Man accidentally shoots self while bowling, police say | Palm Beach County News - WPBF Home

The instances you post almost always have a cause other than the gun. A bowling ball hits the gun, someone drops their gun, a worn out holster pulls the trigger, someones shirt pulls a trigger, etc.

The guns aren't just going bang out of thin air.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Every single one of these holster discharges I have read about involved something pulling the trigger on the gun.

You asked for incidents where something does not pull a trigger. I give them to you.

You do not NEED a trigger to be pulled for the gun to discharge, e.g. a certain 870 in Alabama.

Once we understand this fact, we can take countermeasures. Denial is a fine river but a poor plan.

 

[snowwalker]

Interesting. The third post down showing Clint Smith, the same Clint Smith that pocket carries a 44 special, or at least he used to. A S&W 21 I believe.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Still does.

 

[eldirector]

Still wondering what holster to use for my 870 that allows me to never sweep anything.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

May work for other shotguns, not certain though.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pXiDTdsdvfg

 

[PX4me]

Note all the high speed flippy tactical appendix carry videos. They are never seated.

Never is a strong word. You should know better than to use it.

5 minute mark...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwJa4otqq6M

 

[BIGnTall83]

Wow....yah, with my size I won't be carrying in that manner.

Same here

 

[Bapak2ja]

Carrying a gun is a risky matter. It is inevitable that your weapon will sweep someone. Deal with it and get over it. This constant nagging about sweeping is unrealistic and childish. If you want 100% non-sweep sell the weapon because you can never achieve it.

The greatest safety device is the mind and finger of the gunner (i.e. one carrying). Keep the finger off the trigger until ready to fire at a known, assessed target. Additional safety devices are helpful. I switched from a G26 to a Taurus 24/7 and 709 in part because they have an external safety. These reduce the chance of shooting my self in the butt with my own Glock due to a faulty holster (failure of the mind of the gunner - he should have replaced that holster long before that ND occurred!).

We carry weapons. We carry dangerous things. We take the risk. We buy our tickets and we take our rides. If we mess up we take the consequences. It is called maturity and taking responsibility.

Be smart. Be trained. Be careful.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Never is a strong word. You should know better than to use it.

5 minute mark...


You Tube

And so? Not tracking.

1. He is not demonstrating the draw.

2. Look where his muzzle is pointed, now superimpose the photos I provided where the pistol discharges in the holster.

Again, as I said, all those flippy high speed appendix videos, they are never shown drawing seated. Your video is no different. If they do, watch their muzzle, where is it pointed?

It's hip and cool and all, but we should be aware of the cons before we decide to join the cool kids.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Lots of questions left unresolved on the bowling ball incident. How would simply striking a revolver with a bowling ball make it discharge? Was it in a pocket holster? Was it cocked? Was there other stuff in the pocket.

From my experience, the people who shoot themselves with pocket carry had other things in their pocket that worked into the trigger housing. That is a bad idea. The wounds have been superficial, as the bullet scores the top of the thigh. (Side story, once I got there and though the guy had blown a testical off. The medics had cut his pants and piled used guaze in such a manner it looked like that's where the blood was.)

Like most anything else, there's a right way and a stupid way, and a sliding scale in between.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

From my experience, the people who shoot themselves with pocket carry had other things in their pocket that worked into the trigger housing.

Guns just don't go off . . . until they do.

Detroit police chief: Fatal shooting after hug was accident - U.S. News

 

[Manatee]

I just realized that Kirk's ideal holster would be a tuckable bulletproof box.

Kinda my thought as well.

If you have that many concerns, don't carry with one in the chamber.

And if THAT bothers you, leave it at home in the safe.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

To me, awareness trumps fatalism.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Guns just don't go off . . . until they do.

Detroit police chief: Fatal shooting after hug was accident - U.S. News

Except it didn't just go off. It was in a lousy holster capable of rotating to the point it was pointing to the back and up and the trigger could be pressed and someone applied enough pressure to do just that.

You could hug me all day (and I know you've considered it) and never ever ever will you get my gun to fire. It is currently in a Galco Speed Paddle. It would come off my belt before rotating enough to fire into the lung of someone standing behind me.

Let's walk through the bowling ball incident you posted. Imagine a revolver in your pocket. What on the front of the gun could you hit with enough force to make it fire? It said he hit his leg on the back swing, so it would hit the front or top of the revolver. Modern revolver with a transfer bar that's drop safe? Winging it with a bowling ball won't set it off. Perhaps it was an old style revolver with the pin on the hammer and he hit the hammer hard enough to set it off (which is why those are supposed to be carried over an empty cylinder), but more likely he had something else in his pocket, hit THAT something with the bowling ball, the something acted as a lever on the trigger and...bang.

Keys are the usual culprit for pocket carry touching off, but occasionally you get a pocket knife.

 

[griffin]

more likely he had something else in his pocket

That would be extremely stupid, and I agree that's probably what happened.

 

[PX4me]

1. He is not demonstrating the draw.

Uh... yes he is. He gets into the car, sits down, demonstrates the draw and re-holsters.

Nice try though.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Uh... yes he is. He gets into the car, sits down, demonstrates the draw and re-holsters.

He is general he. The appendix carry videos are devoid of drawing while seated.

If they do show it, as the one you posted, they show lasering one's gear and legs.

I got it, it's cool and it's hip, it's just that there is a downside. Or, to be more specific, I have heavy concerns about breaking the Four Rules.

I know I am old and busted and not up for the new stuff but appendix carry and Position Cul makes me sweat.

 

[LPMan59]

this is why i just dont carry anymore. i'm more likely to shoot myself than be shot by someone else. And if someone shoots me with a pistol, i have an 85% chance of surviving.

What, me worry?

 

[griffin]

this is why i just dont carry anymore. i'm more likely to shoot myself than be shot by someone else.

I always shoot myself when I open carry. I hate it when that happens.