Market "Fairness" Act passes cloture

[dross]

Of course this will hurt the economy. Taxes are a brake on the economy. All this does is apply the brake to a different part of the economy.

This is effectively a tax increase. There should be an accompanying spending reduction.

Here's the sad thing - it's not going to help Mom and Pop all that much, anyway. The internet is a much more efficient way to deliver lots of kinds of goods. It will make everything more expensive for the consumer and the internet will still be cheaper than Mom and Pop. Who gains? The politicians who dole out goodies for votes.

Ask yourself how they're going to track and enforce this. Ask yourself what intrusive monitoring gets passed in five or ten years when for instance Wyoming or some small state realizes that they can attract internet businesses by not enforcing their collection of other states' sales tax.

Then ask yourself how the feds are going to keep their hands out of the collection. After all, this will be true interstate commerce.

This could easily be the beginning of a government-controlled internet.

 

[IndyGunworks]

i didn't say your name but I stated my opinion like you stated yours. Your coming here telling me you agree with people coming and stealing my money. Do you think I'm gonna post statements like: can we be best friends for life and sing stories around the camp fire?

Sorry, I don't like people who take what I worked for or support those who do.

They are not stealing your money, they are just preventing you from avoid what you already owe. If income tax, were reported by you alone, would you opt to not pay ANY? If you don't have property tax esgrowed, do you pay NONE? If you didn't pay any tax's at all don't you think that there would be repercussions? Nobody is stealing your money, they are just taking the reporting obligations away from you and putting it on the shoulders of someone who is responsible enough to actually pay it.

 

[Trigger Time]

I think the IRS is looking for people

 

[IndyGunworks]

Of course this will hurt the economy. Taxes are a brake on the economy. All this does is apply the brake to a different part of the economy.

This is effectively a tax increase. There should be an accompanying spending reduction.

Here's the sad thing - it's not going to help Mom and Pop all that much, anyway. The internet is a much more efficient way to deliver lots of kinds of goods. It will make everything more expensive for the consumer and the internet will still be cheaper than Mom and Pop. Who gains? The politicians who dole out goodies for votes.

Ask yourself how they're going to track and enforce this. Ask yourself what intrusive monitoring gets passed in five or ten years when for instance Wyoming or some small state realizes that they can attract internet businesses by not enforcing their collection of other states' sales tax.

Then ask yourself how the feds are going to keep their hands out of the collection. After all, this will be true interstate commerce.

This could easily be the beginning of a government-controlled internet.

OK, then stop requiring mom and pops to collect sales tax and place the burden SOLEY on the consumer, at least its fair that way.

 

[hornadylnl]

I just ordered 54 mtm ammo boxes online. Is there a single mom and pop shop that has 54 of them in stock, let alone 30 of the same one? And isn't at least 50% more on price?

Mom and pop aren't losing business due to sales tax. And mom and pop thinking this bill will help them helps to underscore why they're failing. Their support of this bill is nothing more than them seeing their own personal benefit. They could give 2 ****s about the government getting theirs.

There's very little stuff I buy that I can buy locally. If mom and pops service is worth it, I'll pay for it. The majority of the time it's not. If I have to go to a dealer to have him order my ammo boxes and make a return trip to pick them up, why should I pay 50% more for a service I can spend less time at home ordering them myself?

 

[silverspoon]

This will have absolutely no effect on the local brick and mortar mom and pops.

When I'm looking for something I don't even think about sales tax. Anything I happened to save on taxes is typically ate up in shipping charges anyway so it's a moot point. If I go to the local brick and mortar and he's 50% higher than what I can buy it online guess what, I'm buying it online whether or not I need to pay sales tax. The online businesses you purchase from have the items you buy shipped to them too. So this whole argument the reason the local mom and pops are higher is because of shipping and then they have to add 7% sales tax is BS. Nothing short of pure BS.

This is the government using the little guy to his advantage knowing full well it will have 0 effect on the amount of business done by the brick and mortar mom and pop shops.

Almost 90% of the time the local stores don't have what you want anyway. They have some Made in China Generic form of the goods you want for twice the money. This whole thing is nothing but a government funded ruse to collect more taxes.

I believe in paying my fair share of taxes but the government's greed has become almost unbearable. Time to find me a deserted island somewhere along the equator and just move there

 

[VikingWarlord]

It is neither.

I concede that, technically, you're correct.

In practice, it has the same effect of being a new and/or higher tax. It increases the amount that consumers have to pay for the same products. That decreases the amount of money available to spend other places, effectively decreasing our purchasing power.

I can't think of a single time that an increase in tax revenue from either new taxes, higher taxes, or increased collection efforts (to address that technicality) of existing taxes has ever worked out in the favor of the public.

 

[kludge]

I think what you guys are missing is out of state internet purchases ARE taxed, its just your responsibility to report it. BUT since a vast majority of the people are not honest enough to report it themselves this bill just shifts the burden to the companies selling the product to collect it. The tax has always been in place, this just adds accountability to make sure its being collected.

It passed 74-20 so it sounds like it has a good chance of making it through.


Just think about buds gunshop, if they have to start charging sales tax the mom and pop store will see an immediate boost in sales!

Tell me again how a state has power to tax/regulate interstate commerce?

Notice there is no penalty in the Indiana law. Read: They know it's not constitutional, and are afraid it won't stand up in court, hence no penalty.

They get you when you sign under penalty of perjury. (The cowards!)

Shipping charges (paid or built into the price) usually make up for the difference anyway. I usually only buy things online that I can't get locally.

P.S. I report and pay the "use" tax. I'm against it though.

 

[dross]

OK, then stop requiring mom and pops to collect sales tax and place the burden SOLEY on the consumer, at least its fair that way.

Now you're talking.

 

[printcraft]

I wonder if the INGO LLC will need to collect tax on internet classified ad sales...........

Yeah, it's a stretch.... but once you open the door........

 

[hornadylnl]

I wonder if the INGO LLC will need to collect tax on internet classified ad sales...........

Yeah, it's a stretch.... but once you open the door........

It'd only be fair.

 

[printcraft]

It'd only be fair.

But obama told me that taxes would only go up on the "rich".

 

[Lex Concord]

I completely 100 percent disagree with you guys. This will HELP the little guy. online purchases where someone can save the 7 percent sales tax here in Indiana causes ALOT of items to be purchased online instead of locally from the small guy. ESP w/ products that have MAP. Ask Vette of A and A optics how many times he has given a lot of customer service to potential customers helping them figure out what they need only to have that person go and buy it from an out of state online retailer because they can get it 7 percent cheaper by not paying sales tax.

This has been a long time coming, and I approve 100 percent!

It's a shame that "helping the little guy" has been boiled down to "screw the big guy too".

It would be nice if people worked toward not letting the government screw anybody, rather than screw the other guy too and I'm okay with it.

Taxes are, for the most part, theft...the state has no more right to 7% of Amazon's revenues than they do to yours.

Doesn't anyone else see the idea that the state has a right to any percentage of income based on capital they didn't risk, work they didn't do, and goods and services they didn't provide as absurd?

Just another example of the neo-feudalistic/protection set up we and our ancestors have allowed ourselves to be herded into.

 

[IndyDave1776]

But obama told me that taxes would only go up on the "rich".

I believe that means anyone richer than the poorest of his Kenyan relatives.

 

[NathanJefferson]

But obama told me that taxes would only go up on the "rich".

Well if you have money to buy a gun then you obviously have too much money. No sane person would ever spend money on a gun, therefore they must take your money to enact stricter laws to keep you from hurting yourself.

 

[NathanJefferson]

It's a shame that "helping the little guy" has been boiled down to "screw the big guy too".

It would be nice if people worked toward not letting the government screw anybody, rather than screw the other guy too and I'm okay with it.

Taxes are, for the most part, theft...the state has no more right to 7% of Amazon's revenues than they do to yours.

Doesn't anyone else see the idea that the state has a right to any percentage of income based on capital they didn't risk, work they didn't do, and goods and services they didn't provide as absurd?

Just another example of the neo-feudalistic/protection set up we and our ancestors have allowed ourselves to be herded into.

All out of rep, but:

Right on Brotha!

 

[steveh_131]

OK, then stop requiring mom and pops to collect sales tax and place the burden SOLEY on the consumer, at least its fair that way.

You've made some very reasonable points in this thread, in my opinion. My only disagreement ended with this last statement.

Less government intrusion is the best way to make it fair, not more. Well said.

 

[RockofStrength]

The chief issue I have (having an ecommerce site myself, though one that would be under the $1,000,000 threshold at this point) is the advantage it gives to local stores/humongous brick and mortar/internet operations. A mom and pop store only needs to collect one sales tax: I now am expected to do so for 50 states plus individual counties? How can I stay in business doing that?

It makes much more sense to either:

remove sales tax at all (won't happen, but why not mention it?)
put the onus on the individual to pay their own sales tax for everything.

Or the government can start paying me to implement the huge system that collects tax money for them. I charge people to rent equipment, but I'm supposed to spend oodles of money collecting someone else's money...utterly ignorant.

 

[Trigger Time]

They are not stealing your money, they are just preventing you from avoid what you already owe. If income tax, were reported by you alone, would you opt to not pay ANY? If you don't have property tax esgrowed, do you pay NONE? If you didn't pay any tax's at all don't you think that there would be repercussions? Nobody is stealing your money, they are just taking the reporting obligations away from you and putting it on the shoulders of someone who is responsible enough to actually pay it.

No they are stealing it. They do not have the authority to tax these purchases. Then you bring up another illegal tax called property tax. Your on a roll .....

Is indygunworks a business? Ill make sure I do zero business with you if it is as well as anyone I know. I guess you think this is gonna bring back some income you feel you lost from other online vendors or something? Your arguments do not hold water.

 

[IndyGunworks]

Indygunworks is not a business, it used to be years ago. And I will stand by my side of this all day long. Its something I do feel as strongly about as you do. I understand where you are coming from, I really do. I don't think the system in place is just at all right now, including property tax, but the system is what it is.