Lets talk AR uppers. Take a newb to school.

[Lebowski]

Working on my first AR build, got the lower completed and all I am missing now is the completed upper. I'm completely new to ARs, this will be my first build and my first AR15. I'm looking at completed uppers online and am not sure what would suit me the best, one in particular that caught my eye was this one: Core Rifle Systems C15 AR-15 Complete Upper Assembly .223 Rem/5.56 NATO 16" M4 Barrel Carbine Length Gas Magpul MOE Handguard A2 Front Sight Black 100273B However I can't really say what drew me to it, other than the appearance and I like that it doesn't "look cheap" compared to some of the others, whatever that means. And yes, I know y'all hate CheaperThanDirt. Sorry, this is going to be a semi-budget build, and although I am not wanting to buy the cheapest parts for it I don't want to spend more than I have to for the parts I do want. A penny saved is a penny earned.

I know that .223 can be fired from a barrel marked for 5.56, and I know that the opposite isn't always true (unless it's .233 Wylde chambered), though I am unsure if I should seek out a 5.56 upper for shooting both, or if I should get one marked specifically for .223, or .223 Wylde. I'm unsure what ammo is available more.

I s'pose choosing the right upper also depends on what I want to do with it, right? Well, the closest range near me is Crosley and the one I'd be at the most this summer I'd reckon. I believe their longest range is 200 (or 300, forget) yards, never used it. My pistols aren't accurate at that distance (haha). In the ideal world I'd be able to plink a targets on the shorter ranges and move down to the long range. So this leads me to believe I'll be needing something where I can easily add/remove optics. For short range plinking I'll be alright with stock iron sights or something cheap. For longer range stuff I suppose I'd be needing to attach something better, correct? Because I want something sort of 'all around', what barrel twist rate should I be looking for?

Should be noted that I'm not deadset on the upper I linked to above, was simply using it as an example of something that 'looked nice' to me, though it's likely it's completely wrong for my intended use so please don't confuse what I consider to 'look nice' to that of what I need. I don't know what I need, I'm hoping you can help me figure that out.


As always, appreciative of the guidance and the knowledge here. Ask me questions if needed to help dial down options. Trying to keep the cost of the completed upper at $600 or less if possible.

 

[lovemachine]

Spike's Tactical 16" Midlength LE Upper (5.56)-STU5035-MLS



This ones better.

 

[lovemachine]

And this one.

https://www.agsarmament.com/spikes-tactical-16-m4-le-complete-upper-556mm


INGO advertiser as well.

 

[Fordtough25]

I would also say Spikes Tactical, BCM, or PSA. Hard to beat the quality of Spikes and BCM.

 

[KillStick]

BCM and done..

 

[Electronrider]

600 dollars is a great budget for an upper. I would do a LOT of research on what you want before buying. With that kind of budget you have LOTS of options.

 

[Lebowski]

600 dollars is a great budget for an upper. I would do a LOT of research on what you want before buying. With that kind of budget you have LOTS of options.

I mean, realistically I'd like to be around $450-$500 area, but if there is something that will be drastically better than a cheaper option I can extend up to $600.


Thanks for the suggestions on brands everyone, though I am more curious about the specs and what I should be looking for based on my original post. Or does it not matter that much? I think the main concern I have is I want the ability to be able to quicky add/remove optics so that means that if I have iron sights they should be removable. Iron sights for not-so-distant shooting, and not have them in the way for when a scope is mounted.

 

[Txlur]

M4carbine.net

Read for a week

Make the decision to buy a quality upper and bcg

Profit

But seriously, a quality free floated stainless barreled upper is even more pricey than a quality BCM, colt, LMT blah blah upper. Get a bolt rifle if you want to scope it. Budget and optics don't seem to go together.

 

[Lebowski]

M4carbine.net

Read for a week

Make the decision to buy a quality upper and bcg

Profit

But seriously, a quality free floated stainless barreled upper is even more pricey than a quality BCM, colt, LMT blah blah upper. Get a bolt rifle if you want to scope it. Budget and optics don't seem to go together.

Optics aren't in the budget I listed above.

Thanks for the advice though, I'll do some reading in between work and INGO lurking.

 

[ghostdncr]

Yeah, I'd pretty much avoid Cheaper Than Dirt like the plague. I've had nothing but splendid results in dealing with Palmetto State Armory and for a general purpose carbine upper, would look to something like this:

PSA Mid Stainless SS12G2 Premium - 16'' 5.56 NATO Stripped Railed Upper - Without BCG or Charging Handle

or this:

PSA 16" M4 Premium - With BCG and Charging Handle

These are both 1:7" twist for stabilizing the heavier bullets, but they have similar deals available throughout the week on 1:9" uppers for the more common 55-62gr bullets. With PSA, you have to be willing to haunt their website and wait for your specs to be posted. I think they have two guys building uppers, so it's more of a wait and see proposition.

 

[Lebowski]

PSA Mid Stainless SS12G2 Premium - 16'' 5.56 NATO Stripped Railed Upper - Without BCG or Charging Handle I like that!

Would still need a charging handle and bolt carrier... but it looks awesome, haha.

 

[cubbetm]

If you buy from PSA wait for either a sale on the upper you want or free shipping. They both happen regularly and if you order your upper at full price it's guaranteed that you'll see it at a lower price before you receive it

 

[Lebowski]

If you buy from PSA wait for either a sale on the upper you want or free shipping. They both happen regularly and if you order your upper at full price it's guaranteed that you'll see it at a lower price before you receive it

I've already have that one above in my cart and I've created an account.... I'm just not typed in my card details yet.... So tempting. At work and clients keep messaging me but trying to price out the rest of it too and decide if I'll pull the trigger and buy that upper or not... It'll be an impulse buy...

Talk me out of it.

 

[Lebowski]

I've already have that one above in my cart and I've created an account.... I'm just not typed in my card details yet.... So tempting. At work and clients keep messaging me but trying to price out the rest of it too and decide if I'll pull the trigger and buy that upper or not... It'll be an impulse buy...

Talk me out of it.

Well hell. Now it's out of stock. Got distracted by work. Knew I should of neglected work and ordered when still available.

Oh well, may be for the best.

 

[rkwhyte2]

The one you were looking at is real nice but like you said it is out of stock. They still have this one Blemished PSA Premium 16'' 5.56mm 1:7 Carbine Length M4 Profile - Without BCG or CH not as nice but the price is hard to beat.

 

[Lebowski]

The one you were looking at is real nice but like you said it is out of stock. They still have this one Blemished PSA Premium 16'' 5.56mm 1:7 Carbine Length M4 Profile - Without BCG or CH not as nice but the price is hard to beat.

This one (PSA Mid Stainless SS12G2 Premium - 16'' 5.56 NATO Stripped Railed Upper - Without BCG or Charging Handle) was in stock at the time I added it to my cart. I got distracted by work (I'm on the clock right now) and came back to it 10 - 15 minutes later and it was out of stock. I emailed them to see if perhaps a box fell behind some others or something hoping maybe one more is available... haha. Unlikely, but doesn't hurt to try.

 

[cubbetm]

Just remember that you won't see it for a while from PSA. Make sure you're happy with it and its not an impulse buy

 

[Lebowski]

What are your guys/gals thoughts on this: SABRE DEFENCE 16" 4150 CMV MID LENGTH UPPER 1-9 TWIST or this: https://www.runnerrunnerguns.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=UPPER-COMPLETE-YHM-BCG

 

[jrh84]

You won't go wrong with any of the suggestions listed above. I have some experience with PSA uppers, and they have been nothing but great as far as I've seen.

You should be able to get a good complete PSA upper (or upper + bcg and charging handle separately) for $400-450 if you keep an eye out on their website.

Unless you are dead-set on a carbine length gas system, I'd take a closer look at a mid-length setup. A mid-length gives a softer recoil pulse and generally easier on components, but the biggest benefit is a longer sight radius if you are planning on using irons any (and you should ). The extra handguard length doesn't hurt anything either.

Before you spend a bunch of money on optics, attend an Appleseed with it, and you'll find that you can make hits with irons at much longer ranges than you thought possible. Optics are great, don't get me wrong, but you can be VERY effective with irons at distance with some training and practice.

 

[cwillour]

Edit: just noticed a solid offer on a blem upper @ PSA & put the links at the bottom

PSA has some pretty decent deals and puts together a good upper for the money. I would avoid the PTAC, though, as there have been quite a few reports of major quality problems with them.

Back to the OP, it sounds like a standard M4 or M4A1 (medium contour barrel) will fit your needs. The handguards on the Core15 are simply MagPul units and run <$35 to add. Whether you go straight irons or irons + optic depends greatly on your eyes and the amount of time you are willing to practice. Generally speaking, most folks with good eyesight (or properly corrected eyesight) should be able to use irons well enough to hold groups in the 2-3moa range with adequate practice and decent quality ammo.

For your case, I would start with a good quality folding rear sight to use with the fixed front sight on the gas block. If you decide to put a scope on the rifle, you would simply fold the rear sight out of the way. Keep in mind that with most <$200 QR scope mounts you will be luck to return to +/- 1moa from your original zero.

As for the other parts of the system, a free-float rail (like the SS12G2 on the PSA you had in your cart) does have the advantage of keeping sling & support pressure off the barrel, but the long rail on the G12 means that your front sight is on the rail instead of the block (and the sight may move due to pressure on the rail.)

Between 1/7 & 1/9, it is likely somewhat of a toss-up. I know many folks that have no problems w/ the common 55gr out to 3-400yds in a 1/7 barrel, but I have also seen 1/7 barrels that have problems groups over 200yds with the shorter 55gr bullets. If you are not likely to move to 75 & 77gr bullets, a 1/9 or a 1/8 (typically found in stainless barrels) may suit your needs slighly better. That being said, I have only 1/7 barrels at this time and I know at least one of mine does fine with 50gr VMax loads.

A couple of items on the barrels:

.223 vs 5.56 is not much of an issue, as you are likely to find few folks offering a pure .223 chamber. If you want more accuracy, you could look for something with the .223 Wylde chamber you mentioned or the 5.56 SAM-R chamber.

4140 vs 4150 is about hardness. 4140 is easier to tool and is used in many quality commercial barrels. It may offer less barrel life, but is sometimes considered to be more accurate (presumably due to the reduce wear on the tooling.) The same concept applies for 410 vs 416 stainless steel.

Chrome lined chambers are particularly helpful in limiting throat erosion, but lined barrels seem to be more of a mixed blessing. While the lining should help with wear, many folks feel it results in somewhat lesser accuracy.

If you have a few minutes, this is a particularly good deal:

Blemished PSA Premium 16'' 5.56mm 1:7 Carbine Length M4 Profile - Without BCG or CH

5.56 HPT/MPI M-16 Bolt Carrier Group with PSA rear flip up sight

They are out of the MOE carbine gaurds at the moment, but you should be able to pick some up for under $35 if you want them, or you could go with a drop-in (not free-float) like this:

Palmetto State Armory AR-15 Drop In Carbine Rail

(You will see a 20% discount on it when you add it to your cart, so the price comes out to $95.99.)

Forgot to add a basic charging handle:

http://palmettostatearmory.com/index.php/ar-15-05/upper-parts/charging-handles/ar15-m16-charging-handle.html

FWIW, I prefer the extra grip of the BCM Gunfighter @ $50 but they appear to be out of those at the moment. You could always get the handle from somewhere else if you want a different handle.