Is It Good For The Gun Cause To Bash Suppliers On The Open Internet?

[BE Mike]

I've learned over the years that some people have what I consider unreasonable expectations. Politicians, entertainers and others who are wealthy seem to expect special treatment. In this time of a pandemic, companies (especially firearm related ones) seem to be trying harder than usual to overcome supply shortages, shipping problems, worker shortages (quarantines), etc. Those people who consider themselves above we average Joes and Janes (can't forget the ladies) expect to get what they want, when they want it. On the other side of the coin are a few businesses, i.e. CTD who take advantage of the flood of new "ignorant" firearm owners and those desperate to get something that they want regardless of the cost. People, just like soldiers, have the right to b_tch and some are going to complain "even if they're hung with a new rope!" None of this really hurts businesses because there are always enough positive comments to overcome one or two unjustified complaints. Healthy discourse is good.

 

[MCgrease08]

I find it interesting that in all the replies about CTD no one has the foggiest idea how such a reviled business can stay in business all these years through all the changes in our world. It is clear there is a true hatred for them. As bad as they are one would think they would fail immediately. How do they survive not only the bad business practices but all the bad publicity?

Doesn't this also disprove your theory that "bashing" vendors will ultimately hurt them or 2A causes in general?

If CTD can stay in business with all the negativity pointed at them, then shouldn't other vendors be able to weather similar storms or online bashing?

 

[Ingomike]

Doesn't this also disprove your theory that "bashing" vendors will ultimately hurt them or 2A causes in general?

If CTD can stay in business with all the negativity pointed at them, then shouldn't other vendors be able to weather similar storms or online bashing?

The question is certainly not lost on me, I asked myself the same thing as I was writing the post. Maybe we don’t matter like, at least, I thought…

 

[stocknup]

I think this is as likely an answer to Mike's question about why CTD is still in business as any. Some people just don't know any better. They probably don't know about sites like gun-deals.com or ammoseek to find better deals.

It has been said that there are over 5 million( Some say +7 ) new gun owners since the Scamdemic ............
As mentioned already , I`m sure there are many of them not on "Gun Forum " sites to see what "Reviews" may be out there for companies that specialize in Guns/Supplies/Accessories (CTD) .....I`m sure they have welcomed and have been profiting on the new "Uninformed " .

 

[brentlacy]

Funny thing about that SPB thing. I have shot there several times and always had a good time. The RO is/was cool and the range is nice. I also purchased a firearm from them once. They actually had the best deal even against my usual online suppliers. The guy making the sale was nice and the paperwork was no different then what I usually do to purchase a firearm.

Other than to my range, they would be the first place I would take a new shooter. That or Top Guns in Terre Haute.

Will second the folks at Top Guns. Great people!

 

[Ingomike]

It has been said that there are over 5 million( Some say +7 ) new gun owners since the Scamdemic ............
As mentioned already , I`m sure there are many of them not on "Gun Forum " sites to see what "Reviews" may be out there for companies that specialize in Guns/Supplies/Accessories (CTD) .....I`m sure they have welcomed and have been profiting on the new "Uninformed " .

So I said folks are too stupid to do reviews (I didn’t look but I bet CTD has tons of good ones) and was criticized but it is reasonable to assert that CTD stays in business because people are stupid?

The word stupid may be replaced with ignorant or naive to sound less harsh…

 

[stocknup]

So I said folks are too stupid to do reviews (I didn’t look but I bet CTD has tons of good ones) and was criticized but it is reasonable to assert that CTD stays in business because people are stupid?

The word stupid may be replaced with ignorant or naive to sound less harsh…

How about replacing the word Stupid with " Uninformed " ...........just as I mentioned earlier .
I could care less that CTD is still in business . They are not doing it with my money .......
You are the one that is all bent out of shape because they are still in business and the negative reviews did not bring them down ?

 

[BugI02]

I find it interesting that in all the replies about CTD no one has the foggiest idea how such a reviled business can stay in business all these years through all the changes in our world. It is clear there is a true hatred for them. As bad as they are one would think they would fail immediately. How do they survive not only the bad business practices but all the bad publicity?

Doing your homework for you

CTD has no brick and mortar operations. Their latest reported revenue was $20.8 million and they have 106 employees

That comes to just under $200k generated per employee. Their listed business address is a nondescript 60000 square foot single story combination warehouse and office building just off the freeway (loop I-820) in Fort Worth. It is unclear if they occupy the entire building as there are five street addresses associated with it. The back of the building has at least ten separate single bay loading bays and google street shows no visible signage nor anything resembling a main office

With the low investment in staff and overhead for facilities, and in light of the fact CTD manufactures nothing, it could be reliably estimated that at least half of that gross revenue is profit. I suspect the business has contacts or resources to buy stock at market rates and then simply marks them up for resale. Providing that they can maintain access to stock even in times of shifting corporate ownership, they can likely survive forever - in fact difficult times in the industry likely works in their favor relative to the degree of mark-up they can get away with

As to why anyone is willing to pay their prices, two possibilities occur:

One, that people who know little or nothing about the many sources of ammunition available are in some way exposed to their advertising more than any competitive firm

Two, that their clientele is of the sort who don't wish to buy ammunition from more legitimate sources in an FTF transaction

or possibly both

 

[BugI02]

So I said folks are too stupid to do reviews (I didn’t look but I bet CTD has tons of good ones) and was criticized but it is reasonable to assert that CTD stays in business because people are stupid?

The word stupid may be replaced with ignorant or naive to sound less harsh…

Cheaper Than Dirt | Complaints | Better Business Bureau® Profile

View customer complaints of Cheaper Than Dirt, BBB helps resolve disputes with the services or products a business provides.

www.bbb.org

 

[xwing]

The beauty of forums like this is that people can speak their minds and share their experiences. If someone has a poor experience or dislikes a policy of a gun shop or gun seller, it benefits the community for them to share that experience. Likewise, people who have a great experience should share. Self-censorship and ignoring bad policies serves no purpose. Just tell the truth and people will decide individually what is best for them. One person’s “petty” is another’s “major turn off”. As long as the posts are truthful, they are a benefit to all.

And if one has a bad experience with a supplier, it is absolutely ok to hurt that supplier’s business (e.g. by posting a bad review.) If the supplier is bad enough, they will go away and be replaced by another. If not, they will survive.

I actually had many good experiences with Cheaper Than Dirt, although they were all a long time ago. I haven’t needed to purchase anything there recently.

 

[edporch]

I think this is as likely an answer to Mike's question about why CTD is still in business as any. Some people just don't know any better. They probably don't know about sites like gun-deals.com or ammoseek to find better deals.

Your post brings to mind there's two kinds of businesses.
Those who cultivate repeat customers, or those who draw from a large enough group of uninformed potential customers they take a "screw everybody once" philosophy.

 

[Ingomike]

You are the one that is all bent out of shape because they are still in business and the negative reviews did not bring them down ?

I’m not “bent out of shape”, just curious as to how such a reviled business can stay going for so long. Appears Bug found out how they do it…

 

[Ingomike]

Doing your homework for you

CTD has no brick and mortar operations. Their latest reported revenue was $20.8 million and they have 106 employees

That comes to just under $200k generated per employee. Their listed business address is a nondescript 60000 square foot single story combination warehouse and office building just off the freeway (loop I-820) in Fort Worth. It is unclear if they occupy the entire building as there are five street addresses associated with it. The back of the building has at least ten separate single bay loading bays and google street shows no visible signage nor anything resembling a main office

With the low investment in staff and overhead for facilities, and in light of the fact CTD manufactures nothing, it could be reliably estimated that at least half of that gross revenue is profit. I suspect the business has contacts or resources to buy stock at market rates and then simply marks them up for resale. Providing that they can maintain access to stock even in times of shifting corporate ownership, they can likely survive forever - in fact difficult times in the industry likely works in their favor relative to the degree of mark-up they can get away with

As to why anyone is willing to pay their prices, two possibilities occur:

One, that people who know little or nothing about the many sources of ammunition available are in some way exposed to their advertising more than any competitive firm

Two, that their clientele is of the sort who don't wish to buy ammunition from more legitimate sources in an FTF transaction

or possibly both

Interesting…

 

[jamil]

I find it interesting that in all the replies about CTD no one has the foggiest idea how such a reviled business can stay in business all these years through all the changes in our world. It is clear there is a true hatred for them. As bad as they are one would think they would fail immediately. How do they survive not only the bad business practices but all the bad publicity?

That’s a different argument altogether. I am personally uninterested in CTD. I’ve never used them, or at keast if I habe there was nothing memorable about the transaction either way.

What I’m saying is that it’s silly to hold all businesses as sacrosanct just because they fit within an industry that’s under attack. That is anti-market. If someone has a bad experience with a business they have every right to talk or rant about it. It’s not like they’re helping “the enemy” by complaining about a business that they think has cheated them in some way. I really don’t understand that line of reasoning at all.

 

[jamil]

For all the weeping, wailing, and nashing of teeth over ammo shortages there sure is a lot of animosity toward the idea of thinking through and self regulating ourselves to major issues when posting negatively about 2A suppliers.

It’s simple. If you do business with a company and they **** you, you don’t owe that individual business the same loyalty that you feel you owe the whole community. It sounds like a very foreign concept to me. But maybe I don’t understand what you mean by “toward the idea of thinking through and self regulating ourselves to major issues.” Maybe you could flesh that thought out a little more and explain what you mean there.

 

[jamil]

For all espousing their right to speak out, I sincerely hope you all are just as zealous in safeguarding our speech that the government/social media collaboration is taking…

How does one possibly relate to the other in a way that would make you doubt it? I really want to understand this moral that you think other people are missing. And obviously they are missing it. I’m missing it because I have no idea at all why all the moral language has to accompany this.

 

[Tyler-The-Piker]

But maybe I don’t understand what you mean by “toward the idea of thinking through and self regulating ourselves to major issues.”

 

[Ingomike]

Cheaper Than Dirt | Complaints | Better Business Bureau® Profile

View customer complaints of Cheaper Than Dirt, BBB helps resolve disputes with the services or products a business provides.

www.bbb.org

I looked through the last couple of years complaints. 11 in 2021 did not seem out of line for $20 million in sales and most seemed resolved. My post was related to their site reviews, google reviews, etc.

 

[jamil]

Doesn't this also disprove your theory that "bashing" vendors will ultimately hurt them or 2A causes in general?

If CTD can stay in business with all the negativity pointed at them, then shouldn't other vendors be able to weather similar storms or online bashing?

Well, even if they did go out of business because they **** all their customers without lube, let’s say. They don’t deserve to be in business just because they’re in this industry. It doesn’t harm the 2A if a ****y business goes under, any more than a ****y business harms the 2A for harming customers. Isn’t that a two way street then? If consumers of guns are supposed to treat gun businesses as sacrosanct because they rely on the 2A, why shouldn’t businesses consider their patrons as sacrosanct as well?

 

[Expat]

Well, even if they did go out of business because they **** all their customers without lube, let’s say. They don’t deserve to be in business just because they’re in this industry. It doesn’t harm the 2A if a ****y business goes under, any more than a ****y business harms the 2A for harming customers. Isn’t that a two way street then? If consumers of guns are supposed to treat gun businesses as sacrosanct because they rely on the 2A, why shouldn’t businesses consider their patrons as sacrosanct as well?

It's like a coffee company that says you have to buy their coffee because they are veterans and send free coffee to the troops... I like my veterans as much as the next guy but that doesn't mean I have to support them when they throw people under the bus.