Had to pull firearm...+1 to fishers pd and Hamilton co sheriff

[LPMan59]

i've been thinking and i dont think any of this happened- the OP didn't describe his 1911 or what holster he was using. If this was the real deal he would have said something like "I had to pull my two-tone Durakote Springfield Operator with VZ Operator II grips and Trijicon night sights from my custom made baby deer skin holster....."

 

[Boost Lee]

that amazing that both parties of this are members here

+1 to op and leo

This.

I'm also glad to hear that the OP reacted quick to the situation,
Made awareness to his options and did what felt right (hearing those words absolutely screams life in imminent threat and/or danger).

Props to the OP and the LEO involved here. I'm lovin' it.

 

[7.62]

i've been thinking and i dont think any of this happened- the OP didn't describe his 1911 or what holster he was using. If this was the real deal he would have said something like "I had to pull my two-tone Durakote Springfield Operator with VZ Operator II grips and Trijicon night sights from my custom made baby deer skin holster....."

Lol ok. A 5 inch kimber crimson carry. The holster is a black leather IWB by Stoner holsters.

 

[Magnum]

To the OP, I am very curious because I have wondered about highly ambiguous real-life scenarios like this myself. Did you choose not to shoot because you were cool and the adrenaline wasn't racing badly enough to cloud your judgment, or were you somewhat stunned, and you felt like maybe you should be shooting but you were unable to do it? (I understand if you don't want to answer that question on a public forum) I found in the FoF training I did that what I thought I would do, or even what I wanted to do, and what my body did were two different things sometimes. How did it go in the moment? That was a fine line you were walking, weighing out two possibilities at the speed of light. I am glad you made the right choice, you and your family stayed safe, and you stayed out of the legal system. I commend you keeping your cool in a situation that was far from black and white.

I also give a big +1 to the OP and the LEO alike. I agree that it is most uncanny that they are both INGO members!

 

[7.62]

To the OP, I am very curious because I have wondered about highly ambiguous real-life scenarios like this myself. Did you choose not to shoot because you were cool and the adrenaline wasn't racing badly enough to cloud your judgment, or were you somewhat stunned, and you felt like maybe you should be shooting but you were unable to do it? (I understand if you don't want to answer that question on a public forum) I found in the FoF training I did that what I thought I would do, or even what I wanted to do, and what my body did were two different things sometimes. How did it go in the moment? That was a fine line you were walking, weighing out two possibilities at the speed of light. I am glad you made the right choice, you and your family stayed safe, and you stayed out of the legal system. I commend you keeping your cool in a situation that was far from black and white.

I also give a big +1 to the OP and the LEO alike. I agree that it is most uncanny that they are both INGO members!

Good question. I say its a few factors.

1. I was raised in a family of martial artist and have been doing martial arts myself my whole life. It has taught me tremendous self control over adrenaline, nerves, etc (not that they are not a factor for me because trust me my heart was racing...i just have a good hold on them)...also i have gotten great reaction time from all my training.
2. Before I was at my current job I use to be a licensed recovery agent (proper name of a bounty hunter.) And unlike the tv show dog....you ran into people who wanted to fight you to not go to jail. That also helped. Because there was alot of times I had to make quick decisions.
3. Train train train. What I mean is if you practice drawing your gun all the time...you will gain that muscle memory and it will become so routine that if you ever have to do it in a stressful situation it will be one less thing that will distract you from identifying if the threat requires deadly force. I practice drawing my gun from standing, kneeling, sitting...sitting in car, etc. There are other dry fire drills you can do with a partner to train for friend or foe as well.

I think all this helped. I am a very level headed individual anyway so that too is a factor.

 

[Magnum]

Thanks for sharing that. With that information provided it sounds like your life experiences/training equipped you to deal with that better than 90%+ of people who carry every day.

 

[IMakeGum]

I think all this helped. I am a very level headed individual anyway so that too is a factor.

+1 OP and LEO....I am glad this turned out well for you and crappy for the BG (although, mere job loss doesn't seem to be enough of a consequence, IMO).

I agree with the previous poster that its too bad this didn't make the papers. A level headed, safe carrier would be a great person to broadcast the benefit of 2A rights.... I think you did very well given the split seconds this situation took and your restraint.

....speaking from experience, drawing on someone sucks. I hope you never have to do that again.....

 

[Magnum]

+1 OP and LEO....I am glad this turned out well for you and crappy for the BG (although, mere job loss doesn't seem to be enough of a consequence, IMO).

I agree with the previous poster that its too bad this didn't make the papers. A level headed, safe carrier would be a great person to broadcast the benefit of 2A rights.... I think you did very well given the split seconds this situation took and your restraint.

....speaking from experience, drawing on someone sucks. I hope you never have to do that again.....

Would anyone report on this? It's not too late is it? I guess it comes down to how the editors lean around here, I have no idea since I don't even read the paper.

 

[thompal]

Would anyone report on this? It's not too late is it? I guess it comes down to how the editors lean around here, I have no idea since I don't even read the paper.

With the near-daily murders and shootings in Indy lately, someone who merely defends his life without firing a shot will never make it on to the local news. A 30 minute local news show anymore consists of 10 minutes of commercials, 10 minutes of blather about the Colts, 5 minutes of weather, and up to 5 minutes of actual local news.

 

[PlinKing2392]

crappy for the BG (although, mere job loss doesn't seem to be enough of a consequence, IMO)

I think you said it best. Not only did he not have a job but I'm pretty sure he had a "crappy" day. At least, I know I would need a change of shorts in that situation, if I were at the business end of a 1911, completely unarmed. But I'm not the idiot threatening people's lives with my hand in the shape of a gun.

 

[Hayseed_40]

Lol ok. A 5 inch kimber crimson carry. The holster is a black leather IWB by Stoner holsters.

The paper would have reported it as "a gun enthusiast carrying a red fully automatic Glock in a shoulder holster almost opened fire on helpless minorities just trying to feed their families. This would have caused most certain carnage involving children and puppies. He must be a member of the tea party. His membership in the NRA dmeonstrates his hatred for all things good. He was also quoted as saying he believes in the antiquated 2nd amendment. Andre Carson to be assigned special non-biased investigator."

 

[roscott]

Okay, I'll ask it...

What would have happened if he had fired? Particularly to the LEO, would he have been justified?

Just to be clear though, it's great that he did not have to fire!

 

[Flyguy]

The paper would have reported it as "a gun enthusiast carrying a red fully automatic Glock in a shoulder holster almost opened fire on helpless minorities just trying to feed their families. This would have caused most certain carnage involving children and puppies. He must be a member of the tea party. His membership in the NRA dmeonstrates his hatred for all things good. He was also quoted as saying he believes in the antiquated 2nd amendment. Andre Carson to be assigned special non-biased investigator."

Actually there is such a thing as a fully automatic Glock. But it isn't red.

 

[Liberty Sanders]

Okay, I'll ask it...

What would have happened if he had fired? Particularly to the LEO, would he have been justified?

Just to be clear though, it's great that he did not have to fire!

This is a crapshoot. Whether or not he is charged is going to depend on the political outlook of the police department and prosecutor's office in the jurisdiction.

In my opinion, with the suspect actually saying "Give me that car or I'm going to shoot you," and then beginning to raise his hand, shooting him would have been justifiable. The victim was hemmed in and escape was impossible. He would, IMHO, been perfectly justified in taking the suspect at his word. In Cincinnati, at least during my LEO days there, the shooter would have walked. We'd simply have chalked it up to Darwinism.

The important thing to remember, ironically enough, is that in a shooting what actually was happening is secondary to what the shooter THOUGHT was happening. Self-defense law throughout the US says that a person may use deadly force in self-defense if that person BELIEVES that he is in danger of death or grievous bodily harm. Being in compliance with the law does NOT, however, provide legal protection to the shooter, as my recent dustup with the Carmel PD where an officer charged me, for political reasons, with a crime that he knew full well I didn't commit and then blatantly perjured himself to bolster his case occurred.

At one time my advice, as a retired LEO, to a person involved in a shooting would have been to cooperate. Those days are gone. My advice now is to lawyer up and shut up.

 

[Magnum]

In response to the question of "what if," on top of the legal ramifications there are other considerations as well. I have to say that sitting in a car with your family there is a lot at stake if you drop the hammer:

1) Your entire family will have hearing loss for life,

2) By shooting across the path of your wife, you are putting her in a crossfire,

3) You are the first one shooting, which means if they had any thought about maybe not shooting, you have decided for them and invited return fire.

 

[Concerned Citizen]

In response to the question of "what if," on top of the legal ramifications there are other considerations as well. I have to say that sitting in a car with your family there is a lot at stake if you drop the hammer:

1) Your entire family will have hearing loss for life,

2) By shooting across the path of your wife, you are putting her in a crossfire,

3) You are the first one shooting, which means if they had any thought about maybe not shooting, you have decided for them and invited return fire.

OK, let's break it down:

1) Better than dead.

2) The BG's were right outside HIS window, therefore not putting his wife in danger.

3) See #1

4) I don't recall him mentioning being with his family..

 

[Flyguy]

In response to the question of "what if," on top of the legal ramifications there are other considerations as well. I have to say that sitting in a car with your family there is a lot at stake if you drop the hammer:

1) Your entire family will have hearing loss for life,

2) By shooting across the path of your wife, you are putting her in a crossfire,

3) You are the first one shooting, which means if they had any thought about maybe not shooting, you have decided for them and invited return fire.

I don't think you read the OP verry well.

1) His window was down and the suspect was at his 9 oclock position so the wepon was probably outside the vehicle as he turnd back.

2) No one in the vehicle (if there were any) were in danger of him shooting them (See above).

3) Only another hypothesis. There could be many.

 

[Swim404]

Genuine apologies everyone, this is pure ignorance because I am brand new to being a gun owner... I obviously know how critical hearing protection is, but does a single shot in self defense really make you have trouble for the rest of your life?

As stupid as it sounds, I almost wonder if I should look for child size hearing protection to put on my dog if *god forbid* I ever needed to use it in my house

 

[thompal]

Genuine apologies everyone, this is pure ignorance because I am brand new to being a gun owner... I obviously know how critical hearing protection is, but does a single shot in self defense really make you have trouble for the rest of your life?

As stupid as it sounds, I almost wonder if I should look for child size hearing protection to put on my dog if *god forbid* I ever needed to use it in my house

It CAN cause permanent hearing loss, but even if it does, it's better to have a slight ringing in your ears than be dead.

As for protecting hearing in a defensive situation, you will most likely not have time to even consider it. You will be lucky if you have enough time to consider anything except staying alive.

 

[Flyguy]

Genuine apologies everyone, this is pure ignorance because I am brand new to being a gun owner... I obviously know how critical hearing protection is, but does a single shot in self defense really make you have trouble for the rest of your life?

As stupid as it sounds, I almost wonder if I should look for child size hearing protection to put on my dog if *god forbid* I ever needed to use it in my house

Simple answer..NO.

One incident would have to be very severe to cause permanent damage.