Coronovirus IV

[HoughMade]

I did a Zoom depo last year because we were an ancillary party and the client didn't want to pay for us to travel/stay overnight for it. It was fine. Other attorneys in the office have had pandemic Zoom depos. Some have been really difficult, especially with exhibits. Lots more logistics involved.

The App. Ct. oral argument by Zoom would be interesting. Given the small delay, the interrupting questions could get awkward. It also seems like, other than the judges on the bench, it would be easy to socially distance for that and do it in person.

The deps have been pretty pain free so far. These are all expert deps and we have an agreement that the SDT rider response will be made 10 days before the dep, then we send the exhibits we intend to use to counsel at some point before the dep so the deponent can have them at hand. You give up the element of surprise, but where experts are concerned, that's largely TV stuff anyway. I have 3 deps next week, all experts, 2 by Zoom and one in person.

The oral argument wasn't too bad. When the judge has a question, if there is not a natural break, he puts up his hand to interrupt the lawyer (which was necessary more than once with my partner....not entirely sure he inhales during arguments).

 

[Denny347]

Are you saying conservatives are peaceful protestors?

They tend to be more peaceful than the lefter wing activists. So pound for pound, yes.

Without knowing what every protesters individual leanings are, I would say that protests that support Conservative ideals are more peaceful than those that support more Liberal ideals. Now having said that, the vast majority of liberal leaning protests are quite peaceful here in Indy as well. Only a very small percentage are not. Even then, their breach of the peace is minor.

 

[Phase2]

Without knowing what every protesters individual leanings are, I would say that protests that support Conservative ideals are more peaceful than those that support more Liberal ideals. Now having said that, the vast majority of liberal leaning protests are quite peaceful here in Indy as well. Only a very small percentage are not. Even then, their breach of the peace is minor.

I can believe that. The worst Antifa violence seems to be in locations where either college administrations or local government support them and order police to stand down.

 

[Ingomike]

That's because there is no way to control the variables enough to produce a usable study. However, there are studies on use in controlled environments and how it affects disease transmission. It can't perfectly imitate environments with people moving around freely and all in different exposures that are impossible to measure.

Dr. John Campbell discusses a study that just came out. He wasn't originally convinced of the effectiveness of masks, but has come to buy into their benefit. First 15 minutes are significant, the rest if fluff.

[video=youtube;zhQw7vLNsDA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zhQw7vLNsDA[/video]

Micro version:
Experiment used Covid-19 infected hamsters and non-infected hamsters and a fan to push air from the infected to non-infected.
Case #1- Placed filter (equivalent to surgical mask) around infected hamsters. 15% transmission and lighter viral load.
Case #2- Placed filter (equivalent to surgical mask) around non-infected hamsters. 33% transmission and lighter viral load.
Case #3- No filter. 66% transmission and heavier viral load.
Comment- Would have been interesting for completeness to see what filters on both groups achieved.

There are links to additional info at the YouTube page.

We already discussed this study, and the FOX News headline that said it proved "mask wear" worked.

All it proves is filter media works, and even better when it is doubled, in an aquarium with hamsters in it. What earthly relevance would this have to a construction worker picking out lumber at Menards?

 

[Ingomike]

That's because there is no way to control the variables enough to produce a usable study. However, there are studies on use in controlled environments and how it affects disease transmission. It can't perfectly imitate environments with people moving around freely and all in different exposures that are impossible to measure.

Dr. John Campbell discusses a study that just came out. He wasn't originally convinced of the effectiveness of masks, but has come to buy into their benefit. First 15 minutes are significant, the rest if fluff.

[video=youtube;zhQw7vLNsDA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zhQw7vLNsDA[/video]

Micro version:
Experiment used Covid-19 infected hamsters and non-infected hamsters and a fan to push air from the infected to non-infected.
Case #1- Placed filter (equivalent to surgical mask) around infected hamsters. 15% transmission and lighter viral load.
Case #2- Placed filter (equivalent to surgical mask) around non-infected hamsters. 33% transmission and lighter viral load.
Case #3- No filter. 66% transmission and heavier viral load.
Comment- Would have been interesting for completeness to see what filters on both groups achieved.

There are links to additional info at the YouTube page.

We already discussed this study, and the FOX News headline that said it proved "mask wear" worked.

All it proves is filter media works, and even better when it is doubled, in an aquarium with hamsters in it. What earthly relevance would this have to a construction worker picking out lumber at Menards? This is not in any way a "mask" study..

 

[Ingomike]

I think the dangers of mask wear are over stated. I can find a lot of studies on the dangers of wearing a tie too - also over stated. This may not be a scientific study but just look at the numbers for Hong Kong and the other Asian countries that wear masks a lot. Their death rates are much lower than ours in spite of their high population density. I'm glad I have the freedom to choose.

I am glad you have the freedom to choose as well. I get frustrated with the sheeple taking my right to choose...

 

[JettaKnight]

We already discussed this study, and the FOX News headline that said it proved "mask wear" worked.

Are you discounting the study because of the headline Fox News applies to it?

 

[nonobaddog]

Air filtration is a very old principle. It removes particles from the air. Personally I would leave it to the reader to figure out if that could help with an airborne virus.

I am not aware of any study that proves mowing my lawn makes the grass shorter either. Does that mean somebody needs a government grant and a few years to figure it out?

In the immortal words of Bob Dylan - You don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows.

 

[JettaKnight]

I am glad you have the freedom to choose as well. I get frustrated with the sheeple taking my right to choose...

 

[Ingomike]

Are you discounting the study because of the headline Fox News applies to it?

The study seems accurate. It is high quality filter media, not repurposed t-shirt material. It is the headline and assumptions people want to extrapolate from it are what I take exception to.

The study shows that filter media works which I would have expected. It says absolutely nothing about mask wear, in unsanitary public spaces, with normal human function...

 

[jamil]

I am saying it's not as black and white as the statement i replied to. I would also assert that is why conservatives are losing the battle, they don't agitate enough within the law. The one's I know hang out on forums, facebook pages, the office kitchen and complain in the echo chamber a lot but don't really do much.

Losing? ****’s getting opened up. In blue states of course it’s getting opened up slower than in red states. Not opening up may not be winning, but it doesn’t look like they’re losing either.

 

[foszoe]

Are most protests in Indy conservative or liberal in their cause?

Without knowing what every protesters individual leanings are, I would say that protests that support Conservative ideals are more peaceful than those that support more Liberal ideals. Now having said that, the vast majority of liberal leaning protests are quite peaceful here in Indy as well. Only a very small percentage are not. Even then, their breach of the peace is minor.

 

[Ingomike]

I believe the majority of those clamoring for masks and lockdowns are healthy scare out of their wits by CNN. That is a sheeple not independent minded...

 

[HoughMade]

Losing? ****’s getting opened up. In blue states of course it’s getting opened up slower than in red states. Not opening up may not be winning, but it doesn’t look like they’re losing either.

You have forgetten one of the undeniable truths of INGO.

Less that 100% of what I want when I want it is a loss.

 

[foszoe]

Talking about messaging not opening up. Replied to a comment regarding Antifa. Are they advocating shutdowns?

Losing? ****’s getting opened up. In blue states of course it’s getting opened up slower than in red states. Not opening up may not be winning, but it doesn’t look like they’re losing either.

 

[BigRed]

All it can do is tell you that you’ve possibly been in contact with an infected person. It can’t do anything else until you allow it to.

Do you think your mobile device is shut down just because you have the on/off switch set to off?

 

[T.Lex]

I believe the majority of those clamoring for masks and lockdowns are healthy scare out of their wits by CNN. That is a sheeple not independent minded...

Do you believe the majority of those who refuse to wear masks simply have a principled disagreement with those who advocate for masks?

 

[Ingomike]

Do you believe the majority of those who refuse to wear masks simply have a principled disagreement with those who advocate for masks?

I think reasons are varied from don't want to wear to they can't make wear one to they are just uncomfortable.

What has changed to make those believe that mask wear is some great savior to the point of threatening violence against those not wearing them?

 

[T.Lex]

What has changed to make those believe that mask wear is some great savior to the point of threatening violence against those not wearing them?

The onset of mental illness, either organically or because of isolation.

 

[JettaKnight]

I believe the majority of those clamoring for masks and lockdowns are healthy scare out of their wits by CNN. That is a sheeple not independent minded...

Clamoring? Yeah, they might be irrational; in the same way that people are decrying mask because you'll die of lack of O2.



Then there's the vast majority of people in the middle that think, "yeah it's no real skin off my nose to put on a mask when I'm in a closed facility with others, and will likely do some good for all."





If CNN is scaring group A with tales of COVID-19, then the Washington Examiner is scaring group B with tales of freedom forever lost.

You have forgetten one of the undeniable truths of INGO.

Less that 100% of what I want when I want it is a loss.

Reminds me of BBI's short lived avatar.