Active shooter at Mandalay Bay in Las Vegas...

[AmmoManAaron]

a couple of good things came about under Obama (eg carry in national parks), but I don't see him getting any pro-2A "credit" here. They weren't illegal, and he had nothing to do with making them "legal." I bet Obama never heard anything about these or heard of them; it was just an ATF interpretation letter... no legislation or EOs involved, and I seriously doubt he put pressure on ATF to rule the way they did...

Given the "multiple rounds per trigger pull" definition of an MG, they'll have a hard time solving this w/ just another ATF letter, IMO... I suspect it will take legislation, and if Trump signs it, then yes, he can take "credit/blame" whatever you want to call it for them becoming illegal...

-rvb

Kinda Sorta. The ATF reviewed the product to determine whether using one constituted firing more than one bullet per pull of the trigger. Since they do not, the ATF issued an opinion that they did not constitute a machine gun under the national firearms act. The ATF had previously issued an opinion that a similar product which used a spring to bring the weapon back forward did constitute a machine gun.

It is an engineering question related to a legal definition, not a question of dangerousness or end effect.

Ok, how about this, "the Obama administration presided over the agency that put to rest the legality of certain bump fire stocks."? That work?

The stock that Akins submitted for BATFE evaluation didn't have a spring in it. BATFE said it's A-ok. The problem arose when Akins added the spring to the production models of the stocks. Which is not ok and is why the BATFE smacked him so hard. They were never legal with the spring. Buyer lists were obtained and notice sent to the owners stating they needed to remove and mail in the spring to BATFE or face consequences. A friend had one so this is why I know the details.

The slide-fire stock determination used exactly the same mechanical reasoning as the spring-less stock that Akins submitted. BATFE was simply being consistent when they evaluated the slide-fire stock. The initial Akins ruling of spring-less being A-ok was pre-Obama.

 

[HoughMade]

Has anyone mentioned here that he had hotel reservations in August for a hotel in Chicago that overlooked Lollapalooza, but he never showed?

Las Vegas gunman booked hotel overlooking Lollapalooza, report says | WGN-TV

 

[Ericpwp]

Maybe he didn't like young people.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Has anyone mentioned here that he had hotel reservations in August for a hotel in Chicago that overlooked Lollapalooza, but he never showed?

Las Vegas gunman booked hotel overlooking Lollapalooza, report says | WGN-TV

Oh dayum... I had no clue that Conservatives had infiltrated the Lolla? I'm starting to think this guy was just looking to kill people.... didn't really make a difference who.

 

[indiucky]

Next thing, they'll want to melt down all the existing Gatlings.

NNNNNOOOOOOOOO...Not the Gatlin's!!!!!! All we will have left then is Ted Nugent, Kid Rock, and Lee Greenwood to play Republican events....

 

[HoughMade]

If my 10/22 was that laughable, I'd do whatever I could to get rid of it too.

Wonder if that LEO took them home or sold them? I would've.

No more mass squirrel murders!

If I was the cop I would have said: "Hey, hero, quick question...you don't happen to have the original stock and magazines do you?"

 

[T.Lex]

The stock that Akins submitted for BATFE evaluation didn't have a spring in it. BATFE said it's A-ok. The problem arose when Akins added the spring to the production models of the stocks. Which is not ok and is why the BATFE smacked him so hard. They were never legal with the spring. Buyer lists were obtained and notice sent to the owners stating they needed to remove and mail in the spring to BATFE or face consequences. A friend had one so this is why I know the details.

The slide-fire stock determination used exactly the same mechanical reasoning as the spring-less stock that Akins submitted. BATFE was simply being consistent when they evaluated the slide-fire stock. The initial Akins ruling of spring-less being A-ok was pre-Obama.

Wow. Great info.

The rep-ATF reversed their opinion and no longer allows me to rep you. (The will eventually change their mind back, but who-knows-when.)

Has anyone mentioned here that he had hotel reservations in August for a hotel in Chicago that overlooked Lollapalooza, but he never showed?

Las Vegas gunman booked hotel overlooking Lollapalooza, report says | WGN-TV

This is starting to sound more and more like a deranged fantasy that he built up to.

Anyone remember the movie The Vanishing with Jeff Bridges? (Which I think was a remake of a foreign film.) It did as good a job as I can think of in a wide-release film of capturing how these evildoers build up to their evil actions. People generally don't just turn into Hannibal Lector. Rather, it is incremental.

He was probably fantasizing about shooting up an open air festival, booked Lolla, but chickened out. Booked the Chance the Rapper one, went, but didn't do anything - just fantasized about it. Then Vegas.

 

[HoughMade]

NNNNNOOOOOOOOO...Not the Gatlin's!!!!!! All we will have left then is Ted Nugent, Kid Rock, and Lee Greenwood to play Republican events....

After what they did to Becky in "Coward of the County", they deserve a beat down anyway.

 

[indiucky]

Oh dayum... I had no clue that Conservatives had infiltrated the Lolla?

Oh yeah....We just wear plain t shirts and state we're not real political people when asked...

That could be why he didn't act on that event....

"Alright ready to go...NO WAIT!!!! OMG those are MY fellow travelers...Better wait for a country music show...."

(Purple implied...)

 

[gmcttr]

I hate to say it, but at this point, even I am not for keeping bumpfire stocks, cranks, binary triggers legal/available.

While LV may have been the first time an "accelerator" was used in crime, now that it has been and will continue to be highly publicized, it's only a matter of time until the next copycats, terrorists and gangbangers regularly put them to use if they are readily available.

 

[openwell]

The SOB was EVIL and CRAZY. Probably did "dry runs" with baskets of puppies & kittens for all we know. We need so much more information about this guy before we "might" be able to understand pieces of this puzzle..

 

[indiucky]

After what they did to Becky in "Coward of the County", they deserve a beat down anyway.

There were three of them....

(LMAO BTW...Nice 80's reference from a 90's guy...)

 

[Alpo]

Wow. Great info.

The rep-ATF reversed their opinion and no longer allows me to rep you. (The will eventually change their mind back, but who-knows-when.)



This is starting to sound more and more like a deranged fantasy that he built up to.

Anyone remember the movie The Vanishing with Jeff Bridges? (Which I think was a remake of a foreign film.) It did as good a job as I can think of in a wide-release film of capturing how these evildoers build up to their evil actions. People generally don't just turn into Hannibal Lector. Rather, it is incremental.

He was probably fantasizing about shooting up an open air festival, booked Lolla, but chickened out. Booked the Chance the Rapper one, went, but didn't do anything - just fantasized about it. Then Vegas.

Yep. Some of INGO had a sense that was the case early on. Others tried to prove he hated conservatives. I don't remember who that was......

 

[lonehoosier]

Has anyone mentioned here that he had hotel reservations in August for a hotel in Chicago that overlooked Lollapalooza, but he never showed?

Las Vegas gunman booked hotel overlooking Lollapalooza, report says | WGN-TV

Just another coldhearted killer but I still think prescription drugs still have something to do with these.

 

[KittySlayer]

Has anyone mentioned here that he had hotel reservations in August for a hotel in Chicago that overlooked Lollapalooza, but he never showed?

Las Vegas gunman booked hotel overlooking Lollapalooza, report says | WGN-TV

After booking the room he found out that because of Chicago's draconian gun laws it would be illegal for him to bring his collection into the city.

 

[SheepDog4Life]

He had 13 prior to going on his shopping "spree." How many guns does one need to be considered a "gun enthusiast?" I'm a woman "enthusiast," but can only afford one. And as far as I'm concerned, being an "enthusiast" is more about mindset and opinions.

I'm not sure you can say that. It might be true, it might not be true... I think at this point it is unknown, or at least unpublished to the public. I've read his first purchase (I'm assuming this means purchase via a 4473) was in 1982. I've read that 33 of his purchases were within the past year, again I'm assuming this is due to direct, purchased new from a gun store, with a 4473 and background check.

I've not read anything (if you have, please point me) that authorities have any idea when the other 13 were purchased. He could have, for an extreme example, bought all of them just the day before the shooting from a private individual without a 4473. I'm not saying that happened, just illustrating that we don't know when...

 

[lonehoosier]

After booking the room he found out that because of Chicago's draconian gun laws it would be illegal for him to bring his collection into the city.

I think that's the first time that Chicago gun laws might've worked.

 

[T.Lex]

After booking the room he found out that because of Chicago's draconian gun laws it would be illegal for him to bring his collection into the city.

 

[Ericpwp]

Probation works then?

 

[ChristianPatriot]

After booking the room he found out that because of Chicago's draconian gun laws it would be illegal for him to bring his collection into the city.

Are you implying what I think you’re implying?