22 people arrested at SHOT SHOW

[dubsac]

It doesnt look to good for these guys from S&W.
UPDATE 2-U.S. charges 22 with bribery involving arms sales | Reuters

 

[hornadylnl]

It doesnt look to good for these guys from S&W.
UPDATE 2-U.S. charges 22 with bribery involving arms sales | Reuters

Meh, somebody in our government was miffed because they weren't going to get their cut.

 

[Clearwat]

Wow

250 FBI agents worked on this. Seems like a waste of resources.

 

[hornadylnl]

250 FBI agents worked on this. Seems like a waste of resources.

They have to ensure the government gets their cut so they can get their salary checks!

 

[scheesman]

250 FBI agents worked on this. Seems like a waste of resources.

Potential multi-billion dollar contracts at stake, and you think 250 agents investigating was a waste of resources?

 

[Clearwat]

Potential multi-billion dollar contracts at stake, and you think 250 agents investigating was a waste of resources?

If I read the article right it was African "Dollars". At the way OUR government rifles through money, seems we should look internal first for fraud. But I don't expect them to bite the hand that feeds them, my dog doesn't.

 

[edsinger]

Well my S&W stock was up 0.07c......still this is not good. These numnuts should have known better.

 

[muncie21]

American ethics aside, let's compare the numbers.

The S&W folks marked up the sale of 1800 pistols by 20%.
At $800 each (which should be pretty steep if you are buying 1800) that comes out to ~$1.4MM.

Now, 250 agents working for 2 years on the project, as the article stated. Let's see what they cost...

• Assuming they work full time (40 hours)
• Put in 45 weeks a year (even Gov't people have to have a vacation every now and again)
• Have a base pay of $25/H (~$50K year, pretty meager for special agent pay)

That comes out to $22.5MM in expenses (not including fringes like insurance, 401K, etc.) on a sale of $1.4MM....hmmm

Keep in mind they (S&W) were paying an extra 'commission' (bribing) to an African (fictional) national. These types of payment are very typical in many parts of the world and considered an accepted part of business, to the extent that the 'commissions' are often 'budgeted'.

Hmmm, keep another country safe from the evil S&W empire or use the $22MM to really help America?

 

[abnk]

Potential multi-billion dollar contracts at stake, and you think 250 agents investigating was a waste of resources?

From the article:

In the case of the Smith & Wesson executive, Goncalves gave price quotes for two sales, a small one of 25 guns and a larger one with 1,800 pistols.

Where are you getting multi-billion dollars?

Let's say 2,000 pistols at $500 each = $1,000,000.

250 agents X 2 years X $50,000 (assuming they were all at the entry pay grade) = $25,000,000.

 

[abnk]

American ethics aside, let's compare the numbers.

The S&W folks marked up the sale of 1800 pistols by 20%.
At $800 each (which should be pretty steep if you are buying 1800) that comes out to ~$1.4MM.

Now, 250 agents working for 2 years on the project, as the article stated. Let's see what they cost...

• Assuming they work full time (40 hours)
• Put in 45 weeks a year (even Gov't people have to have a vacation every now and again)
• Have a base pay of $25/H (~$50K year, pretty meager for special agent pay)

That comes out to $22.5MM in expenses (not including fringes like insurance, 401K, etc.) on a sale of $1.4MM....hmmm

Keep in mind they (S&W) were paying an extra 'commission' (bribing) to an African (fictional) national. These types of payment are very typical in many parts of the world and considered an accepted part of business, to the extent that the 'commissions' are often 'budgeted'.

Hmmm, keep another country safe from the evil S&W empire or use the $22MM to really help America?

You beat me to it, but I'm glad our uncoordinated numbers are reasonably close.

 

[techres]

Very splashy arrest there.

 

[Clearwat]

American ethics aside, let's compare the numbers.

The S&W folks marked up the sale of 1800 pistols by 20%.
At $800 each (which should be pretty steep if you are buying 1800) that comes out to ~$1.4MM.

Now, 250 agents working for 2 years on the project, as the article stated. Let's see what they cost...

• Assuming they work full time (40 hours)
• Put in 45 weeks a year (even Gov't people have to have a vacation every now and again)
• Have a base pay of $25/H (~$50K year, pretty meager for special agent pay)

That comes out to $22.5MM in expenses (not including fringes like insurance, 401K, etc.) on a sale of $1.4MM....hmmm

Keep in mind they (S&W) were paying an extra 'commission' (bribing) to an African (fictional) national. These types of payment are very typical in many parts of the world and considered an accepted part of business, to the extent that the 'commissions' are often 'budgeted'.

Hmmm, keep another country safe from the evil S&W empire or use the $22MM to really help America?

Thanks for running the numbers. Like I thought, waste of resources.

 

[singlesix]

Anyone having done business overseas understands it's just part of how business is done in some countries. They call it many different things; but, in the end it is someone getting his cut of the pie. I believe it's called taxes in some countries.

 

[muncie21]

You beat me to it, but I'm glad our uncoordinated numbers are reasonably close.

LOL, they came out pretty even for having two independent folks running the figures.

 

[scheesman]

Potentially multi-billion dollar contracts. Just because they got caught with a "small" order doesn't mean that they wouldn't have done the same thing to land the re-armament of (insert your favorite country here). And if you reread the article, you will see that 250 agents didn't work full time on it. It clearly states there's only 20 agents working current cases anyways. 250 probably includes the undercover agents on the other end, all arresting and transportation agents, the investigating agents, and all of the other "part time players" in this sting. I still stand by my position.

 

[sprshggy07]

I give the guy in Miami props for chillin on the beach while the other 21 were lining up to be arrested. Probably cost a pretty penny just to find that one guy.

 

[Ricnzak]

I wonder what the VP of S&W's job pays. This came along at a great time. I could use a new gig. I shall spiff up the old resume tonight.

 

[Bisley Man]

So all commissions are bribes now? I'm SOOO ashamed of S&W, I'm selling all of mine, at $1500 a gun, plus 20% commission, of course! Who wants to buy an $1,800 .38?

 

[360]

Elvis would have been proud.

 

[in_betts]

Potentially multi-billion dollar contracts. Just because they got caught with a "small" order doesn't mean that they wouldn't have done the same thing to land the re-armament of (insert your favorite country here). And if you reread the article, you will see that 250 agents didn't work full time on it. It clearly states there's only 20 agents working current cases anyways. 250 probably includes the undercover agents on the other end, all arresting and transportation agents, the investigating agents, and all of the other "part time players" in this sting. I still stand by my position.

scheesman you are making up stories and believing them! "Potentially" doesn't mean squat! Have you ever heard the joke about the boy asking his dad the difference between potential and reality? You are naive to the way the OTHER 95% of the world turns. Yes it happens here too, but not anything like other places around the globe.

I am not defending the actions they are charged with, but the entire thing (with what we KNOW at this point) sounds like a real scam, on the part of the government. I will reserve final judgment until more facts are reliably corroborated.