2016 centerfire deer rifle push?

[MRP2003]

The 30-06 analogy with squirrels can replaced with coyotes. We can shoot yotes with just about anything but not deer? Does not make sense. And who cares if semi autos are not allowed for hunting in PA, I wouldn't care if it was single shot as long as we can use center fire ammunition. Heck Pa is backwards with their no hunting on Sundays which they are working to get changed.

And yes, IND can regulate the deer population with tags rather than caliber restrictions. Why can we use a trimmed 35 REM but not a regular 35 REM?

I am sure that they will pass the bill and DNR will create some kind of week long season for centerfires that is after Muzzleloader season and since it will be for private land only, it will really limit the use of centerfire but it will be a first step that I am sure after 2 or 3 years, they will realize that there is no safety issues and will open it up for use during regular gun season

 

[d80hunter]

The 30-06 analogy is not nonsense. It illustrates that the caliber restrictions that we are under is not for safety (as you advocate), but for deer population control.

I argue that Indiana can regulate the deer population with tags and not these crazy caliber restrictions.

Caliber restriction is not decreasing the number of harvested deer. A deer will be just as dead if you shoot it with a 30-06, 44 magnum, or a 12 gauge. Of course the 30-06 has more range than the other 2 but who can't get within 100 yards of a deer. In that regard I could take it that you mean not being able to shoot a deer across an open field is about deer population control and not safety? That is how the opposition would take it.

I bought a 7mm-08 in 2014 thinking I would be using it by now. Sure it would be fun to use but the .450 bushmaster I recently bought will be all I ever need and plenty more for the ranges around here. A proposal like keeping the minimum caliber size and increasing the maximum case length to accept 35 remington, 444, 45-70, 450 marlin would be a good start and very likely to accepted by the public. At least everyone would have a 200 yard capable rifle in every rifle action available. Then we could go for lifting all restrictions that might or might not ever get passed.

 

[avboiler11]

A proposal like keeping the minimum caliber size and increasing the maximum case length to accept 35 remington, 444, 45-70, 450 marlin would be a good start

I'd much rather keep the existing maximum case length and reduce the minimum bullet diameter down to 6mm...doing so would be MUCH more friendly to youth, women, and recoil-adverse shooters.

 

[Expatriated]

Screw PA.
Tired of how everything is referenced from there, NY or Wis.


Ruger came out with the .44 auto when? In the freakin' 60's..................must have some market for it.
Sure as heck wasn't Indiana deer huntin'. Or PA with their progressive thinking of no semi autos allowed.

When did Browning do their 92 in .44 mag? Or Winchester 94?

And that .30-06 for squirrel in trees nonsense.................horrible attempt at an argument. Drop it.
Makes one look like a moron for even mentioning it, as if what is legal always makes up for common sense.

Remember, the majority of deer hunters are probably not gun people.
And the rules as written now are not hard to understand, nor is the progression of them to this point.

If one doesn't understand them...........well that's just more reason to NOT allow reg HP rifle.
Not confusing at all.

If one simply doesn't like them, that's a different matter.

Your post is pretty much nonsense. You're referencing common sense. I'm referencing legality. Yes I agree it's stupid to shoot up in the trees with a .30-06. So, is it not stupid for the law to allow it? And then not allow it for a deer? But then allow it for a coyote. We are not questioning the stupidity, we are questioning the legality. One would presume that somewhere in DNR, they are not simply throwing darts at a board to come up with rules; one would hope there's some measure of critical thinking, logic and common sense behind some of these decisions. In this decision, it's very difficult to see how that rabbit warren of logic must have been applied.

Don't imply that people that don't understand this rule are the unusual ones. Few, if any, of the states have rules like this. Every hunter outside of IN finds this rule perplexing that I've ever spoken to about it. And to further imply this is the standard progression of DNR-type rules certainly goes against the grain of the other states. Indiana is unique in this regard. If it weren't, there would be no crazy .358 Hoosier and the cutting down of different cartridges for the sole purpose of deer hunting. That doesn't exist elsewhere.

I can operate within the rules--I use my .12 ga and get my share of deer. But as soon as someone can apply some common sense to the rules, my .25-06 will be pressed back into service.

 

[oldpink]

I am Fudd, hear me roar.

 

[Willie]

I can see that the bill was read on Jan 11th and the date targeted for it to be in effect is July 6 this year but when is the next action due for this bill? When does DNR have to respond?

The bill will be heard in the Natural Resources Committee on January 25 at 10:30 in Room 156A.

The DNR does not have to, and will not respond. They pretty well stay out of the legislative process unless specifically asked.

 

[Willie]

The bill...

House Bill 1231 - Hunting and property management - Indiana General Assembly, 2016 Session

 

[Hookeye]

The coyote argument is also BS.
Varmint hunters use varmint bullets.
The hunters are lesser in number and more spread out, unlike deer hunting.

You can walk around on public ground now going after yotes.
Go to Mississinewa Res and try that on the gun opener of deer.

Of course, with all the hype there are a new folks who are chomping at the bit to shoot Wile E.
And many use rigs not of varmint bullet.

Those are the friggin' Fudds.

 

[Hookeye]

Big deer run my bud's dad's place. It is NWI and of big open flat fields.
Not much in cover.
You'll see bruisers out in the middle, hundreds of yards from the ditch lines or small patches of woods.
Ideal rigs there would be a 7 Mag and a rangefinder.

And some folks have been using that kind of stuff for years, hence the DNR putting a decoy on his place trying to catch the roadies.
Unfortunately they didn't nab any.

Personally, I think the rules are fine as is.
But if they open it up to 6mm or larger in rifle I'll take a .256 Win (puny yes I know) and pop a deer with it.

Women and kids rifles...............what is wrong with the .357 magnum under current regs?
Ammo is available.
Several platforms......reasonable some are (like CVA Scout).
Most shots under 100 yds (and beginners might do well to keep that as a limit even if their cartridge is capable of farther).

 

[Hookeye]

I like rifles, have had quite a few, and been handloading for years.
I'd consider myself a proponent of rifles in general.
But I rather dislike my fellow man, for most are stupid.
And I am not keen on opening the floodgates for them in deer season.
It's bad enough already.
Work gun retail a few years and maybe you'll get a better understanding.
Not just the snapshot of the night before the opener.

Worse. These folks breed and vote.

Dumb guy A meets stupid woman B and has exponentially Ef'd up kid C.
I go to the woods to get away from these mofos.

Am not keen on the DNR starting some Golden Ticket campaign.

 

[BigMatt]

Hookeye, I will ask you the same question you ignored a month ago - Why do you think the hunters in Indiana are so much dumber and irresponsible than the hunters in other states?

 

[Hookeye]

Much of it probably traced to the "Four R's"

Readin'
Ritin'
Rithmatic

and

Route 31 north


Indiana is huge for manufacturing, we've imported stupids from all over.
Maybe some contaminates in the water, or workplace modifying genetics over the last 3 or 4 generations

possibly other factors.

 

[BigMatt]

Much of it probably traced to the "Four R's"

Readin'
Ritin'
Rithmatic

and

Route 31 north


Indiana is huge for manufacturing, we've imported stupids from all over.
Maybe some contaminates in the water, or workplace modifying genetics over the last 3 or 4 generations

possibly other factors.

Wow, I was being sarcastic, but you really do think the hunters in Indiana are dumber than the rest of the United States. I guess I can stop trying to talk sense then.

 

[clfergus]

I know some of these irresponsible hunters and I doubt that any of them would trade their shotguns in for a high powered rifle. They love love their shotguns and blasting away. Do you think the type of hunter who goes to walmart the day before season would pick a Remington 770 in 30-06 when they could get a 870 or a 500 that will shoot a 3.99 box of sluggers.

I am curious about that...especially in a state where all that most have ever known is shotgun.

The sportsman seems to be the bigger consumer for the new guns and or wanting these changes passed. He most likely already has 2,3,4,5,6 + of these illegal calibers waiting for the day when he can take him Grandpa or Pappys 30-30 or 35 rem out and hunt with it. Take out that .270 he uses for coyotes and sit a blind on the edge of a corn field and kill those damn deer that always seem to come out 50 yards outside of the range of his muzzleloader or .44 mag. I think this group is made up of passionate hunters, shooters who will put more energy into safety when using the new calibers in the field.

I am sure we will see our share of brain cell starved hunters with the new calibers but I think that will be the fault of the guys behind the gun counter acting like big stuff so they can spout off about the new law and make a sale. I dunno, I think Indiana has a fairly big population of hunters that fall right in the middle who are educated and experienced. They either will see a new caliber rifle as a waste of money or a waste in terms of the need for the land they currently hunt.

Again, maybe i am wrong but I think most people will stick with what they know. Then again I once had a guy off the site buy a gun from me and tell me that he had to find a way to make his car payment since he just spent the money on the gun.

I should be buying up ever lever gun in 30-30 right now. I bet those will be a hot item if this passes.

 

[oldpink]

Wow, I was being sarcastic, but you really do think the hunters in Indiana are dumber than the rest of the United States. I guess I can stop trying to talk sense then.

For someone ordinarily so sensible on other subjects, it's a real shock to run into such undisguised contempt for a fellow man.

 

[tyrajam]

And that .30-06 for squirrel in trees nonsense.................horrible attempt at an argument. Drop it.
Makes one look like a moron for even mentioning it, as if what is legal always makes up for common sense.

I am passionate about opening deer hunting up to deer rifles in Indiana, but you are right, this argument makes me cringe a little every time I hear it. Why is it legal to hunt squirrels with a 30/06? BECAUSE NOBODY DOES IT, SO IT'S NOT A PROBLEM. The very real impact of a quarter of a million deer hunters using deer rifles cannot be compared to the imaginary use of centerfire rifles for squirrel hunting. Arguments that disregard logic are a frustrating thing to me.

 

[BigMatt]

For someone ordinarily so sensible on other subjects, it's a real shock to run into such undisguised contempt for a fellow man.

Weird.

 

[avboiler11]

None of the issues, problems, or possible calamities citied here on INGO that modern centerfire rifles for whitetail would entail occur in Kentucky.

NONE.

 

[MRP2003]

yeah and NONE of those issues would happen in Indiana either. Just like they don't in Michigan, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Pennsylvania, West Virginia or any other state that allows center fire rifles for deer hunting. What is funny is some of the states that have restrictions for the center fire rifles such as not allowing semi auto rifles (PA), talk about the horrible myths of what would happen if they removed those restrictions. People have their misconceptions about a lot of things when talking about guns and hunting.

 

[oldpink]

I put down much of the opposition to people clutching at pearls, those who invested a small fortune in getting a rifle chambered in .358 Hoosier or with some other heavily modified gun or ammo to make it compliant with our current arcane laws.
Having the entire state suddenly able to resort to off the shelf rifles that are more capable would immediately make their investment less worthy.
It's really quite pathetic.