I hear that! I know whatcha mean! Im in the doghouse for buying a new Magnum Research Desert Eagle 1911G so either the Saiga or the Glock 37 (which is brand new)has to go,brother I feel your pain!Agreed SSD... and a properly done Saiga 410 will put out 15 X the above load... and will do it in a HURRY... Hang in there GarandGuy, if that 20 of yours sticks around long enough I may be able to pick it up without winding up in the dog house! You know the only reason I didn't already grab it was because a Saiga 12 beat your 20 in a race to my safe... I can only grab 'em so fast before the Accounting Department starts getting alarmed!