10 Dead In Colorado Theater Shooting

[Blackhawk2001]

From bits and pieces I've read all over the place it sounds like he was armored up and took pain-killing vicodin... Since the plan evidently was to "give up immediately" to the cops... who was the body armor and pain-preventative meds for? I think he thought there WAS going to be an armed movie-goer.
That's my

While we don't know for certain, early reports mentioned Holmes said he took vicodin to "calm down" while waiting to implement his plan. I think he didn't want to appear jittery with anticipation, so took the drug. I have to wonder about his state of consciousness during the shooting with a combination of adrenaline and vicodin fighting for dominance in his body.

 

[JetGirl]

While we don't know for certain, early reports mentioned Holmes said he took vicodin to "calm down" while waiting to implement his plan. I think he didn't want to appear jittery with anticipation, so took the drug. I have to wonder about his state of consciousness during the shooting with a combination of adrenaline and vicodin fighting for dominance in his body.

If that was true, valium would suffice. In the area which he was a student, he'd know that.
Vicodin is for pain. He knew that, too. I don't buy the "calm the jitters" thing.

 

[Valvestate]

At least he wasn't on bath salts and eating their faces...

 

[Blackhawk2001]

If that was true, valium would suffice. In the area which he was a student, he'd know that.
Vicodin is for pain. He knew that, too. I don't buy the "calm the jitters" thing.

I would have thought "valium" would have been the choice for that, as well, but "vicodin" was what was reported. I don't have much experience with pain-killers so I have to ask: what would the effects of a pain-killer on a person in the absence of pain? Light-headedness? Floating sensation? Slight sense of unreality?

 

[jeremy]

I would have thought "valium" would have been the choice for that, as well, but "vicodin" was what was reported. I don't have much experience with pain-killers so I have to ask: what would the effects of a pain-killer on a person in the absence of pain? Light-headedness? Floating sensation? Slight sense of unreality?

Depends on the dosage levels...

 

[GBuck]

I would have thought "valium" would have been the choice for that, as well, but "vicodin" was what was reported. I don't have much experience with pain-killers so I have to ask: what would the effects of a pain-killer on a person in the absence of pain? Light-headedness? Floating sensation? Slight sense of unreality?

Whether in pain or not the person would experience a floaty "high" experience, or he could experience nothing adverse. Either way it would definitely calm the nerves. It could be that Valium knocks him out and Vicodin would take the edge off but keep him awake.

 

[JetGirl]

I would have thought "valium" would have been the choice for that, as well, but "vicodin" was what was reported. I don't have much experience with pain-killers so I have to ask: what would the effects of a pain-killer on a person in the absence of pain? Light-headedness? Floating sensation? Slight sense of unreality?

No clue. I've only ever taken them after surgeries and in conjunction with stuff that makes you sleep. I'm guessing it'd have to do SOMEthing because you hear about people stealing it and re-selling it on the street.
(The pain-killer part, not the sleep part)

 

[Valvestate]

No clue. I've only ever taken them after surgeries and in conjunction with stuff that makes you sleep. I'm guessing it'd have to do SOMEthing because you hear about people stealing it and re-selling it on the street.
(The pain-killer part, not the sleep part)

Err both.

I just heard on the radio. Holmes had a match.com profile that was still up. His religion is agnostic, his political views are middle of the road, and he wanted sexy time. Weather's comin up in a few. Isn't that millions of other Americans that aren't killers? W T F

 

[Mackey]

Someone as of this date has the following [post=3126008]quote from this thread[/post] as their signature.

...
While the gun nuts in us focus on the hardware, what is missing is the will to fight.

This is actually quite profound and will definitely be included in Kirk's biography.
I'd amend it somewhat to read:
While the gun nuts in us focus on the hardware, what is missing in many is the will to fight.

 

[Denny347]

Someone as of this date has the following [post=3126008]quote from this thread[/post] as their signature.



This is actually quite profound and will definitely be included in Kirk's biography.
I'd amend it somewhat to read:
While the gun nuts in us focus on the hardware, what is missing in many is the will to fight.

Truer words were never spoken.

 

[cobber]

Err both.

I just heard on the radio. Holmes had a match.com profile that was still up. His religion is agnostic, his political views are middle of the road, and he wanted sexy time. Weather's comin up in a few. Isn't that millions of other Americans that aren't killers? W T F

Here's an angle the media missed! Maybe tomorrow they'll pick up on it. Or move back to Zimmerman, who is languishing in media limbo as of late.

 

[netsecurity]

Whether in pain or not the person would experience a floaty "high" experience, or he could experience nothing adverse. Either way it would definitely calm the nerves. It could be that Valium knocks him out and Vicodin would take the edge off but keep him awake.

Vicodin or Valium would have nothing to do with the situation IMO unless he took a massive dose, and then it would just make him sleepy. I just don't see how it would change anything at all, unless he was so doped up that it slowed him down, which doesn't appear to be the case. Calming jittery nerves would be the maximum a regular or double/triple dose might do. Some people think "Oh, he took a Vicodin, you couldn't have stopped him, he wouldn't even care if you shoot him", and I say nonsense to that. He might be buzzed, but that would be a disadvantage to him. Vicodin and Valium are not disassociatives, like PCP, just not even close.

 

[Yup!]

I've been trying to follow this as best as I can, but I don't have the right links. Does anyone know what caused the perp to flee the theatre? I know his AR jammed, and he switched to another weapon, but at what point did he flee the theater? From my understanding, he didn't flee because he encountered any resistance from LE or anyone else.

 

[Blackhawk2001]

Vicodin or Valium would have nothing to do with the situation IMO unless he took a massive dose, and then it would just make him sleepy. I just don't see how it would change anything at all, unless he was so doped up that it slowed him down, which doesn't appear to be the case. Calming jittery nerves would be the maximum a regular or double/triple dose might do. Some people think "Oh, he took a Vicodin, you couldn't have stopped him, he wouldn't even care if you shoot him", and I say nonsense to that. He might be buzzed, but that would be a disadvantage to him. Vicodin and Valium are not disassociatives, like PCP, just not even close.

The story said he told police he took vicodin for his nerves before entering the theater. My question was whether the combination of adrenaline and vicodin would affect his mental state . . . oddly. Not in the sense that he didn't know what he was doing, but more in the sense that things might be a shade "unreal", thus minimizing the mental effects of watching himself shooting people at close range.

 

[CathyInBlue]

Vic does not have any mood altering properties of which I am aware. It's not a psychotropic. It's a pain killer.

That might, however, alter the calculations for the effectiveness of a notional armed opponent. Even hitting him with .44MAG to the CoM covered in hard kevlar, that would seriously hamper the efforts to slow Holmes down or bring him down.

 

[GBuck]

Vicodin or Valium would have nothing to do with the situation IMO unless he took a massive dose, and then it would just make him sleepy. I just don't see how it would change anything at all, unless he was so doped up that it slowed him down, which doesn't appear to be the case. Calming jittery nerves would be the maximum a regular or double/triple dose might do. Some people think "Oh, he took a Vicodin, you couldn't have stopped him, he wouldn't even care if you shoot him", and I say nonsense to that. He might be buzzed, but that would be a disadvantage to him. Vicodin and Valium are not disassociatives, like PCP, just not even close.

I never implied him taking it would make him unstoppable or anything of that nature. I was just saying it would possibly allow him to carry out the action. It DEFINITELY could have let him get past the "oh sh**, what am I about to do" jitters.

 

[Tombs]

I never implied him taking it would make him unstoppable or anything of that nature. I was just saying it would possibly allow him to carry out the action. It DEFINITELY could have let him get past the "oh sh**, what am I about to do" jitters.

Take some valium or vicodin before going in for lasik.

You'll realize that no amount of the stuff that leaves you still breathing will have a meaningful impact on the situation, lol.

 

[GBuck]

Take some valium or vicodin before going in for lasik.

You'll realize that no amount of the stuff that leaves you still breathing will have a meaningful impact on the situation, lol.

I've taken one or the other before the dentist several times. Just like anything else, it has different effects on different people. MrsGBuck can take as much as medically safe and not even get the pain deadening benefits of Vicodin.

 

[sepe]

Vicodin or Valium would have nothing to do with the situation IMO unless he took a massive dose, and then it would just make him sleepy. I just don't see how it would change anything at all, unless he was so doped up that it slowed him down, which doesn't appear to be the case. Calming jittery nerves would be the maximum a regular or double/triple dose might do. Some people think "Oh, he took a Vicodin, you couldn't have stopped him, he wouldn't even care if you shoot him", and I say nonsense to that. He might be buzzed, but that would be a disadvantage to him. Vicodin and Valium are not disassociatives, like PCP, just not even close.

A high dose of vicodin could possibly alter his mental state but he'd have probably been closer to nodding off than getting to the point it altered his mental state. It could have made it so he didn't care at all in the moment. Valium could have easily calmed him enough that he'd be able to carry out his plan. I agree that vicodin and valium wouldn't have changed anything if he'd have met some armed resistance and been shot. BUT if he was taking a cocktail of drugs (if he was on some meds for psychological issues) even a lower dose could have had the same effect. The buzz could have made it a little easier to carry out the plan.

The bold part, totally agree.

 

[Tombs]

I've taken one or the other before the dentist several times. Just like anything else, it has different effects on different people. MrsGBuck can take as much as medically safe and not even get the pain deadening benefits of Vicodin.

I'm one of the unlucky individuals that no amount of anything will really have a noticeable impact on. At least nothing that affects pain, stress/nerves, or thinking/thought processes.

I've really always thought there was a placebo effect that went along with most of these medications, after all they just dampen the responses of nerves.