Zimmerman Trial

[kiddchaos]

Whistleblower Ben Kruidbos Reported Concealment of Evidence In Zimmerman Case?Was Promptly Fired | The Gateway Pundit
Some of the phone information is described around the 24 minute marker.

From what I understand:
I.T. guy in prosecutor's office runs data dump from T.M.'s phone. Provides copy to defense.
Later, another data dump with more info found. (Edit: deleted gun transaction texts, pic of pot plant and pic of gun).
Tells prosecutor that it should be also provided to the defense.
Prosecutor says ok but does not provide the data.
I.T. guy seeks legal counsel to make sure data is brought to light, gets fired.

 

[UncleMike]

Whistleblower Ben Kruidbos Reported Concealment of Evidence In Zimmerman Case?Was Promptly Fired | The Gateway Pundit
Some of the phone information is described around the 24 minute marker.

From what I understand:
I.T. guy in prosecutor's office runs data dump from T.M.'s phone. Provides copy to defense.
Later, another data dump with more info found.
Tells prosecutor that it should be also provided to the defense.
Prosecutor says ok but does not provide the data.
I.T. guy seeks legal counsel to make sure data is brought to light, gets fired.

"The truth is the greatest enemy of the State."
Joseph Goebbels

 

[Dirtebiker]

And was then jumped by a doubling back with intent "T" with a beat down on his mind.
His "Girl"??? friend stated on Piers Morgan last night that "T" thought "Z" was a Gay creepy ass cracka (this is her spelling) and "T" felt the same so is this a hate crime on "T"
The sound bites from the interview were played on Rush today.

I heard that too.
according to the (girl)friend, "cracka"= "someone who act like a police" "or a security"
So I guess she thought Martin was being followed by a creepy gay rapist who acted like a cop!?

 

[printcraft]

I heard that too.
according to the (girl)friend, "cracka"= "someone who act like a police" "or a security"
So I guess she thought Martin was being followed by a creepy gay rapist who acted like a cop!?

 

[churchmouse]

I heard that too.
according to the (girl)friend, "cracka"= "someone who act like a police" "or a security"
So I guess she thought Martin was being followed by a creepy gay rapist who acted like a cop!?

That was the transcript Rush was reading from. So in her own words "T" was looking to beat down a gay guy or a security guy or at least a "Police"
Does she not have the most wonderful vocabulary of any high school student you have ever encountered.

 

[JLL101]

Please. Some perspective? If someone is following you, and you lose them, do you go back to find them so you can confront and MMA their ass? All other decisions made prior to that are at that point no longer relevant. I think that's what the jury decided as well. Trayvon made the decision to bring into the confrontation. He didn't deserve to die for that poor decision. And Z didn't deserve to have his head pounded into the concrete just for trying to help the police know where T went.

This is about a person having the right to use lethal force to stop the use of potentially lethal force against him. This has nothing to do with race or SYG. Yet that's what's playing in the media all day long. Do you buy into that bull****?

Nice summary of the basic factual content of this tragic case. Certainly appears Martin initiated the final confrontation and was the physical aggressor. Given these basic facts, I personally feel Zimmerman had every right to use deadly force to protect his life. Under the same circumstances, I would have done the same thing. I feel sorry for the Martin's family loss, but their relative brought this upon himself.

 

[JLL101]

Whistleblower Ben Kruidbos Reported Concealment of Evidence In Zimmerman Case?Was Promptly Fired | The Gateway Pundit
Some of the phone information is described around the 24 minute marker.

From what I understand:
I.T. guy in prosecutor's office runs data dump from T.M.'s phone. Provides copy to defense.
Later, another data dump with more info found. (Edit: deleted gun transaction texts, pic of pot plant and pic of gun).
Tells prosecutor that it should be also provided to the defense.
Prosecutor says ok but does not provide the data.
I.T. guy seeks legal counsel to make sure data is brought to light, gets fired.

I think both the prosecutor and the originally assigned special prosecutor should be fully investigated for their rolls in this trial. Based on what I have seen and read, this trial should have never happened. Appears these people had an agenda other than to bring justice to a tragic event. No Grand Jury, evidence not turned over to the defense, initial filed paperwork had outright mis-information. Now the firing of a whistle blower. The whole situation on the prosecution side seem to reek of crap. I wonder what else happened duing the course of this affair that is as apparently as dirty as what we already know.

 

[IndyDave1776]

No, the last bastion is to tell you to "F" off.

I really don't care what you think I said. It's obvious you are unable to comprehend the nature of a hypothetical question in the context of the entire post or within the context of the debate.

The comment was a generic hypothetical related to a Florida activity. Why you are unable to understand that is beyond me.

Good day.

You made a very plain declaration of what you would do in the situation that Martin was in, specifically that you would shoot a person you deemed to be following you if he strayed into an exclusionary zone you arbitrarily defined.

The bottom line is that you said something stupid and got called out for it. This is one of those times that you might as well own it and move on as opposed to continuing to act like, well, less than a rational thinking individual.

 

[Manatee]

You made a very plain declaration of what you would do in the situation that Martin was in, specifically that you would shoot a person you deemed to be following you if he strayed into an exclusionary zone you arbitrarily defined.

The bottom line is that you said something stupid and got called out for it. This is one of those times that you might as well own it and move on as opposed to continuing to act like, well, less than a rational thinking individual.

What is with you guys?!!! I've seen dogs worry a bone less than you. OCD?

What happens behind a keyboard is NOT the real world. What happens on the street is. I really don't care what you think because 1) I don't know you and 2) I stopped looking for public affirmation years ago.

If you believe you would not defend yourself with the appropriate amount of force to stop the threat, then you're a victim. I'm a vet with combat experience. I'll leave it there.

 

[IndyDave1776]

What is with you guys?!!! I've seen dogs worry a bone less than you. OCD?

What happens behind a keyboard is NOT the real world. What happens on the street is. I really don't care what you think because 1) I don't know you and 2) I stopped looking for public affirmation years ago.

If you believe you would not defend yourself with the appropriate amount of force to stop the threat, then you're a victim. I'm a vet with combat experience. I'll leave it there.

Plain truth? In general, you are irritating as Hell and it is refreshing to vent, in addition to being objectively correct.

A vet with combat experience? OK, that explains it. Anyone who is not a recognized member of your party is a target.

 

[Manatee]

Step away from the keyboard and keep your hands where I can see them.

What's really interesting is that some of my more liberal friends think I'm a reactionary. They ought to see you guys.

 

[IndyDave1776]

Step away from the keyboard and keep your hands where I can see them.

What's really interesting is that some of my more liberal friends think I'm a reactionary. They ought to see you guys.

If you can see my hands, I guess I'll have to downgrade the NSA a few places on my list of concerns!

 

[jbombelli]

What is with you guys?!!! I've seen dogs worry a bone less than you. OCD?

What happens behind a keyboard is NOT the real world. What happens on the street is. I really don't care what you think because 1) I don't know you and 2) I stopped looking for public affirmation years ago.

If you believe you would not defend yourself with the appropriate amount of force to stop the threat, then you're a victim. I'm a vet with combat experience. I'll leave it there.

Well this is the civilian world - not a combat zone. You can't approach the civilian world like you would approach combat in a war zone and kill anyone who looks threatening. That sends you to prison in this world.

You might want to figure that out.

And what you say while sitting behind a keyboard acting tough WILL be used against you in court if you're ever involved in a shooting.

You might want to figure that out, too.

 

[Manatee]

Well this is the civilian world - not a combat zone. You can't approach the civilian world like you would approach combat in a war zone and kill anyone who looks threatening. That sends you to prison in this world.

You might want to figure that out.

And what you say while sitting behind a keyboard acting tough WILL be used against you in court if you're ever involved in a shooting.

You might want to figure that out, too.

Let's review the bidding for a moment. I don't think Zimmerman was guilty of murder. I think he was guilty of making poor choices as an adult and ccw holder and probably violated a few basic tenets of civilian neighborhood overwatch. The jury found him not guilty of manslaughter and murder. It's over.

Now, if you are of the mind that a car following you in the dark for a couple of blocks doesn't represent a possible threat to you, you are probably mistaken and I urge you to take a defensive training course from one of the fine instructors that frequent this website.

If there ever comes a time where I must use a firearm in defense of my family or another, I hope I have the presence of mind to react with judgement, not just muscle memory.

ymmv

 

[BogWalker]

Let's review the bidding for a moment. I don't think Zimmerman was guilty of murder. I think he was guilty of making poor choices as an adult and ccw holder and probably violated a few basic tenets of civilian neighborhood overwatch. The jury found him not guilty of manslaughter and murder. It's over.

Now, if you are of the mind that a car following you in the dark for a couple of blocks doesn't represent a possible threat to you, you are probably mistaken and I urge you to take a defensive training course from one of the fine instructors that frequent this website.

If there ever comes a time where I must use a firearm in defense of my family or another, I hope I have the presence of mind to react with judgement, not just muscle memory.

ymmv

The issue here is that you said you'd shoot a person following you. The majority here disagree. We've all seen the quoted post.

 

[Manatee]

I'd say there is a high degree of likelihood that a person following me for a couple of blocks in the dark is not going to get within 21 feet of me.

Again, if you guys want to play in your hot tub and not evaluate threats, I'll send flowers to your widows.

 

[24Carat]

Anyone get the feeling that Trayvon's girlfriend would be more comfortable answering questions with grunts, clicks and whistles?

 

[BogWalker]

I'd say there is a high degree of likelihood that a person following me for a couple of blocks in the dark is not going to get within 21 feet of me.

Again, if you guys want to play in your hot tub and not evaluate threats, I'll send flowers to your widows.

So if somebody got within 21 feet of you at night you'd shoot them?

 

[Libertarian01]

Let's review the bidding for a moment. I don't think Zimmerman was guilty of murder. I think he was guilty of making poor choices as an adult and ccw holder and probably violated a few basic tenets of civilian neighborhood overwatch. The jury found him not guilty of manslaughter and murder. It's over.

Now, if you are of the mind that a car following you in the dark for a couple of blocks doesn't represent a possible threat to you, you are probably mistaken and I urge you to take a defensive training course from one of the fine instructors that frequent this website.

If there ever comes a time where I must use a firearm in defense of my family or another, I hope I have the presence of mind to react with judgement, not just muscle memory.

ymmv

To Manatee (et alia),

First I think part of the problem here is that something you posted was read in a manner that lead to a different meaning than you intended, the internet is hard that way. So for some guys, back off a bit, Manatee didn't throw in all the caveats he probably was thinking of.

Now, to this particular post I will respectfully disagree with some of your thoughts and explain why.

Regarding Zimmermans actions: I do not think Mr. Zimmerman was guilty of making poor choices. I do believe he was guilty of being zealous in his cause to defend his neighborhood from hoodlums and thieves. In this I find no fault and wish him to keep that fire burning for whatever cause he takes up. I do not see the reasoning that it is evil/wrong/misguided/bad/unwise to patrol your neighborhood, your community with great attention to detail. He was not a vigilante on his own, but was known by everyone in that neighborhood and accepted by them AS the neighborhood watch guy. If anything the neighbors are guilty for not intervening when the were aware of trouble. If just ONE other neighbor would have come out and helped it is possible that either Mr. Martin or Mr. Zimmerman would have left with an assault/battery charge and both would have been home the next day.

Regarding "It's over." This I strongly and respectfully disagree with. The Florida criminal trial has concluded. True. However, there is still talk of Federal Civil Rights charges being leveled against Mr. Zimmerman. There is also the antigun rhetoric that is being bantered about with increased fervor. Just tonight I saw AG Holder pushing for a repeal of ALL "stand your ground" laws. He claims they "escalate" confrontations. While I do not agree with our AGUS the fact remains that he is in an extremely powerful and well connected position that can undo what I believe to be logical and reasonable laws.

Regarding the rest of your post I agree that training is an excellent idea and INGO is a wonderful asset for this pursuit.

I also strongly agree with your goal of "acting with judgement" whenever the use of a firearm is necessary. We should all look to firearms usage as a last resort when all other reasonable alternatives have failed. However, when they often do fail, God bless all the folks who have the tools to defend themselves and their neighbors when necessity arises.

Regards,

Doug

PS - I love Mad-Eye Moody. Brendan Gleeson is a great actor and has brought tremendous presence to all of his roles.

 

[Manatee]

So if somebody got within 21 feet of you at night you'd shoot them?

Attend a training course. Perhaps force on force.

You might be surprised at how quick things can happen.

bye