Why bother with the GOP if this is all it has to offer?

[BehindBlueI's]

Trump does show a difference. He isn't promoting LGBTQ+ agenda that I know of.
There is a difference between promoting this behavior, and saying let God judge them as it's their choice.

Maybe read his speech to those same log cabin Republicans. I'd say his standing is pretty mixed, but that's par for the course with him. Likely pretty left of what evangelicals of any Abrahamic tradition would prefer, though.

Regardless, my point stands that if the party can't make allies with large swaths of the population by excluding people based on their demographic then it's doomed to powerlessness. You can't change anything from outside the system and 'better candidates' who don't get a seat at the table are useless as a result.

 

[jwamplerusa]

right now, in this moment in history, basically two parties is what we have.

And just as the Communists have taken over the democratic party, constitutionalists must take over the Republican party.

Parties are not static. Remake the one we have.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

You think Jenner needs a subset of the Republican party to have a platform? Jenner *already* has a platform, that's the point of making them your ally.

You're asking why someone with *social influence* is a helpful ally in the formalized popularity contest known as an election.

The republican party largely agrees with the culture. It may be a few years behind where the democrats are but they are definitely going the same direction. It does them little good to go along to get along. I heard a stat last week that in nearly all of the special elections in the recent year(?) the democrats, in almost every (maybe all, can't remember off the top of my head) have out performed their demographic. The republicans, with the gay-friendly Trump being the standard bearer of the party, and Bruce doing whatever he's doing, weren't enough to deliver the red wave we were promised by all the smart people--even with Biden-omics spinning this country out of control.

There might be another way besides me-too-ism.

 

[DadSmith]

Can we get 20 Republicans to agree on all issues, or a majority of issues here on this forum?

 

[blain]

Can we get 20 Republicans to agree on all issues, or a majority of issues here on this forum?

When you use the word "agree", how do you mean it?
1. Sure, I can go along with that.
2. That's a hill I would die on.

 

[printcraft]

 

[Twangbanger]

The republican party largely agrees with the culture. It may be a few years behind where the democrats are but they are definitely going the same direction. It does them little good to go along to get along. I heard a stat last week that in nearly all of the special elections in the recent year(?) the democrats, in almost every (maybe all, can't remember off the top of my head) have out performed their demographic. The republicans, with the gay-friendly Trump being the standard bearer of the party, and Bruce doing whatever he's doing, weren't enough to deliver the red wave we were promised by all the smart people--even with Biden-omics spinning this country out of control.

There might be another way besides me-too-ism.

Trump did win; he just didn't win after the pan(dem)ic. He also successfully overturned Roe v Wade, after a generation of square, prayer-breakfast Republicans only tried to.

You'll get a chance to test your theory. If the Man Who Overturned RvW can't get re-elected in 2024, then "values politics" can't possibly mean that much to Americans.

PS - you do realize LC Republicans is a pro-gay group to begin with, right? You may not agree with them, but photo-opping with Bruce Jenner, for them, is like NRA aligning with Oliver North (wait...bad example...)

 

[Shadow01]

Again I see many advocating that the slow walk left is preferred over the possibility of a new more robust conservative party. They’re default is always that a new party is dead on arrival and only helps the communists. It’s always the doom and gloom in hopes that conservatives will stay aboard. Funny how the left part of the GOP begs the conservatives to buck up and tow the line with the party. Seems if we are needed that desperately, then we should have a larger portion of the power base. I’m for winning by any means. Either a true conservative push to the right or helping the communists create a complete collapse so they can be eliminated and we start over. As it stands now we are just participating in 2 steps left and 1 step right at each election.

 

[Shadow01]

This doesn’t bother me at all. As long as they don’t force their beliefs on me, I couldn’t care less what they do. As far as I can tell “Bruce” has said the same thing. I don’t recall him/her/whatever being in favor of trans in women’s sports, forcing the use of pronouns, etc. maybe I missed it. I care about policy, not personal preferences.

What about when the Jenner mindset controls the party. Will it bother you then?

 

[Ingomike]

Funny how the left part of the GOP begs the conservatives to buck up and toe the line with the party.

Are we not constantly trying to get the left part of the party to toe the conservative line? I know I am…

 

[Shadow01]

Are we not constantly trying to get the left part of the party to toe the conservative line? I know I am…

But I don’t believe we need the communist boot lickers on the left half. I would rather start over with a new party. Those that fear change insist we need the left RINOs to avoid catastrophe. I don’t fear change. I don’t fear the risk. Becoming a communist country next year or a decade from now isn’t really anything different. I guess our differences are that I have mentally removed the RINOs from the party and see them as the enemy that can’t be brought back in line and we need not waste effort trying to do so. Time to put that effort in growing like minded conservatives in a new party. For the most part you have not.

 

[BugI02]

We do have one in Braun. Sadly, he is calling it quits. I hold little hope of getting one as good to replace him.

Change needs to take place at the party level and before the primaries. In a deep red or blue state, the lack of a competitive voting environment allows undesirable traits to be supported. In Indiana it seems pretty much anybody with an 'R' after their name has an election edge in most areas, so you need that 'R' to embody the characteristics and views you want - and that may take drastic reform of the state party apparatus because they may value carrying water for the big donors more than what the people want. Look
at the difficulty Trump is having in the clash of values with the GOPe

Changes have to be institutionalized at every level and it will take time. You didn't get into the bind you're in in a day and you won't get out of it quickly either - unless someone as charismatic as Trump arises from the hinterlands of Indiana politics

Edit: It might even be a good place for n00bs to get their feet wet in political action. Once you have a good candidate, you will have to go make the case for him in the areas that most of the voters in the primaries reside. Since you will be trying to convince people in comfortable suburbs and conservative small town exurbs the canvassers won't even have to go into the hood and likely won't be able to get into the country club, so really they only need preach to the choir - but don't think you won't have to go out and make the case for the superior values your candidate embodies vs a country-club republican and strong establishment candidate name recognition makes that job even harder

 

[Ingomike]

Becoming a communist country next year or a decade from now isn’t really anything different.

This is an absurd claim. Do you really think that those under communist rule would say freedom next year or a decade from now isn't anything different? We fight the battles today with the tools we have today.

 

[Ingomike]

I guess our differences are that I have mentally removed the RINOs from the party and see them as the enemy that can’t be brought back in line and we need not waste effort trying to do so.

No self awareness to understand that you and I are a small minority of Americans. You are the outsider, not the RINO’s. That we are able to co-opt them so much is a miracle, a miracle that you and a few others take for granted and want to blow up.

The left took over education and brainwashed entire generations. We must counter that through the system, it will not happen overnight as the brainwashing did not either.

 

[Shadow01]

This is an absurd claim. Do you really think that those under communist rule would say freedom next year or a decade from now isn't anything different? We fight the battles today with the tools we have today.

If we are heading there, arriving next year or a decade from now we are still at the same destination. I guess this is why so many prefer the slow walk. Believing they can avoid the inevitable Or not be here to avoid participation. I think meeting it head on is the best way to fight back. Most can’t fathom the downside until they live it. I say use that shock to remove the threat permanently and build a new nation.

 

[BugI02]

But as for me, right now, in this moment in history, basically two parties is what we have.

And history teaches us that even when a viable third party does form, the system pretty quickly collapse back to two parties. It isn't always the same two parties as at the start of the process but the system seems to favor either-or

Systems with proportional representation have an easier time forming multiple viable parties, but the history of parliamentary systems seems to indicate that those mostly wind up being commies and eco-nuts

 

[indyblue]

Didn’t we already try this with the tea party?

 

[BugI02]

Why give mentally ill social influencers any platform?

Or why can't we at least get back to the days when the perverse didn't flaunt their predilections and expect me to celebrate them and I didn't pay particular attention to what they did in the privacy of their own homes. In a word, détente

 

[BugI02]

What agenda does Bruce Jenner have that you object to. Someone who is against trans athletes in women's sports would seem to be someone to at least work with, or just because they are trans- means they are verboten? Because that's what the "joke" is, and keep losing

There is a point at which the 'tent' becomes too big and the agendas of the constituents don't have sufficient overlap to set coherent policy or planning. The inclusivity you want erodes the identity and values of the party itself. We can work with Jenner where our priorities align but under no circumstances should he be a an exemplar of what a republican is

 

[BugI02]

If we are heading there, arriving next year or a decade from now we are still at the same destination. I guess this is why so many prefer the slow walk. Believing they can avoid the inevitable Or not be here to avoid participation. I think meeting it head on is the best way to fight back. Most can’t fathom the downside until they live it. I say use that shock to remove the threat permanently and build a new nation.

In [that which we do not mention] 2.0 it is unlikely other countries will not try to meddle in the process this time around

People, rightly or wrongly, are reluctant to take a course of action where the outcome is so unpredictable. They delay in the hope that some pathway out of the problem will become apparent until their hand is forced. Losing and a communist government aren't the worst possible outcome, warlordism and Mogadishu 2.0 are