What do you tell the LEO?

[rhino]

I've mentioned this before (in other contexts as well), but after reading so many of the explanations of why some people offer unsolicited information about their weapon, it leads me to believe there is more to it. I think, and I could be wrong of course, that at least some of them believe on some level that they are doing something wrong by carrying a gun because of the way our modern society has programmed them that only cops and criminals carry guns. They may not realize it on any conscious level, but shame is a tricky and powerful emotion that is not always obvious to the person feeling it. Offering unsolicited information is then like a confession of sorts, with absolution forthcoming from the authority figure (i.e. the police officer).

If this doesn't apply to you, there's no need to get your shorts in a twist over it, because . . . it doesn't apply to you. I do think it applies to a significant number of people whether they realize it or not, and I think a similar psychological phenomenon is involved in some individual's almost manic fear of open carry and contempt of those who choose to carry openly.

This unsolicited amateur psychoanalysis brought to courtesy of your favorite partially purple pachyderm.

 

[Roadie]

I've mentioned this before (in other contexts as well), but after reading so many of the explanations of why some people offer unsolicited information about their weapon, it leads me to believe there is more to it. I think, and I could be wrong of course, that at least some of them believe on some level that they are doing something wrong by carrying a gun because of the way our modern society has programmed them that only cops and criminals carry guns. They may not realize it on any conscious level, but shame is a tricky and powerful emotion that is not always obvious to the person feeling it. Offering unsolicited information is then like a confession of sorts, with absolution forthcoming from the authority figure (i.e. the police officer).

If this doesn't apply to you, there's no need to get your shorts in a twist over it, because . . . it doesn't apply to you. I do think it applies to a significant number of people whether they realize it or not, and I think a similar psychological phenomenon is involved in some individual's almost manic fear of open carry and contempt of those who choose to carry openly.

This unsolicited amateur psychoanalysis brought to courtesy of your favorite partially purple pachyderm.

I think you bring up an excellent point, and you just might be on to something.

I have yet to be pulled over since I have been carrying, and I am leaning more and more toward not disclosing. I even moved my LTCH away from my DL in my wallet.

 

[mk2ja]

Really, I appreciate someone telling me the have a LTCH and they have their gun on them and where it is. I'm just going to run your info and then decide if a warning is appropriate or if a ticket needs to be issued, I tend to lean more one way than the other if someone is up front with me and honest right off the bat.

So if a person chooses not to tell you something that they are not required to tell you, you veiw them as dishonest, and then feel you should punish them for not telling you. This is the kind mentality that has lead to a mistrust of LEOs by Americans. If you want respect you have to earn that respect, that takes more than a uniform, it takes strength of caractor and common sense. And no I am not anti LEO, I used to be one, and still hang with some.

You've read a significant amount into what he wrote, which you may feel is a safe extrapolation, but I don't. The rest of your post hinged on that misinterpretation. Since wtf didn't actually say what you understood him to have said, I give him the benefit of the doubt that he does not have the type of mentality you described.

On a related note... While I agree somewhat with your sentiments that it takes more than a uniform to earn respect, it has its limits. How many soldiers do you see in uniform and respect them first and THEN ask when/where they served? In general, I would say that LEOs both as a whole and any one with whom we have contact deserve respect as well because of their willingness to stand in the line of duty. In particular, however, on an individual basis, every man must prove his mettle and not simply count on his uniform to earn him *all* his respect at the personal level.

Anyway, I just thought I'd toss out there that I don't think wtf has that attitude you were talking about.

 

[JBob77]

I got pulled over the other night, on I-65. I had out my license and paperwork before he even got out of his cruiser. He came up on the passenger side, so the armrest was blocking my right side. I was carrying IWB at 3 o'clock with a jacket on. He never asked, and I never offered. He did give me a warning for a license plate light, but was cool about the tags, which I had yet to transfer to this particular vehicle. (I bought it on the first). He explained that He could Technically write me a ticket, but most didn't if the title was signed under 30 days ago. I always thought the 30 day thing was a law. Anyway, all in all it was a good encounter!

 

[Kick]

I don't think I would volunteer the information, but I would if asked. The alternative of either lying or sitting there in silence doesn't seem like a great idea.

+1 On the user name!

 

[Kick]

Ok, I am an LEO but, I am over the border in a non-carry state. I have been stopped and when I told the Indiana LEO that I was armed, he took my pistol back to his vehicle with him.

While sitting in my car wondering if he was going to write me or not, I started to wonder why he would do that. If I am a law abiding citizen, which people with LTCH's are... If someone started shooting at him, I would assist him. But, now that he chose to disarm me, I cannot defend him or myself properly if needed.

That being said, I would want to know if the person I was dealing with was armed but, would be more than understanding if the person carrying did not want to tell me.

And before there is a response to this post asking why I would want to know, I really can't tell you. I guess it is just human nature.

 

[Roadie]

Ok, I am an LEO but, I am over the border in a non-carry state. I have been stopped and when I told the Indiana LEO that I was armed, he took my pistol back to his vehicle with him.

While sitting in my car wondering if he was going to write me or not, I started to wonder why he would do that. If I am a law abiding citizen, which people with LTCH's are... If someone started shooting at him, I would assist him. But, now that he chose to disarm me, I cannot defend him or myself properly if needed.

That being said, I would want to know if the person I was dealing with was armed but, would be more than understanding if the person carrying did not want to tell me.

And before there is a response to this post asking why I would want to know, I really can't tell you. I guess it is just human nature.

Exactly.
He is disarming you, AND putting you both at risk by handling an unfamiliar, loaded weapon..as my previous posts show, I am totally against this policy from both a rights, and a safety, standpoint.

 

[Kick]

Exactly.
He is disarming you, AND putting you both at risk by handling an unfamiliar, loaded weapon..as my previous posts show, I am totally against this policy from both a rights, and a safety, standpoint.

Couldn't agree more.

As an officer, it's a good general rule that you do not want someone else handling a loaded firearm in your presnece.

As a good gun owner, it's a good general rule that you do not want to hand someone else YOUR loaded firearm.

As a human being with a grain of common sense, it's a good general assumption that the situation would be a lot safer for everyone if everyone's firearms stayed right where they were before the "encounter" happened.

 

[Roadie]

Couldn't agree more.

As an officer, it's a good general rule that you do not want someone else handling a loaded firearm in your presnece.

As a good gun owner, it's a good general rule that you do not want to hand someone else YOUR loaded firearm.

As a human being with a grain of common sense, it's a good general assumption that the situation would be a lot safer for everyone if everyone's firearms stayed right where they were before the "encounter" happened.

I wish more LEOs used this logic! Thanks for your comments, and your service!

 

[mk2ja]

Couldn't agree more.

As an officer, it's a good general rule that you do not want someone else handling a loaded firearm in your presnece.

As a good gun owner, it's a good general rule that you do not want to hand someone else YOUR loaded firearm.

As a human being with a grain of common sense, it's a good general assumption that the situation would be a lot safer for everyone if everyone's firearms stayed right where they were before the "encounter" happened.

As a driver with any sense, we'd be even wiser to obey all traffic laws so we don't get pulled over in the first place! Eh, boss?

 

[tk6968]

You've read a significant amount into what he wrote, which you may feel is a safe extrapolation, but I don't. The rest of your post hinged on that misinterpretation. Since wtf didn't actually say what you understood him to have said, I give him the benefit of the doubt that he does not have the type of mentality you described.

On a related note... While I agree somewhat with your sentiments that it takes more than a uniform to earn respect, it has its limits. How many soldiers do you see in uniform and respect them first and THEN ask when/where they served? In general, I would say that LEOs both as a whole and any one with whom we have contact deserve respect as well because of their willingness to stand in the line of duty. In particular, however, on an individual basis, every man must prove his mettle and not simply count on his uniform to earn him *all* his respect at the personal level.

Anyway, I just thought I'd toss out there that I don't think wtf has that attitude you were talking about.

I don't think I read into what he wrote. I think that I understand fully what he was saying. Read his last sentance again and give it time to soak in. The meaning was very clear to me.

 

[mk2ja]

I don't think I read into what he wrote. I think that I understand fully what he was saying. Read his last sentance again and give it time to soak in. The meaning was very clear to me.

For reference, I think this is the sentence you were talking about.

I tend to lean more one way than the other if someone is up front with me and honest right off the bat.

When I read that, and let it soak in, it sounds more like a general statement related to something like, "Do you know how fast you were going?" "Oh, about 60." "I clocked you at 63 coming over that hill." "Yeah, give or take."
As opposed to responding, "I've been going 55 the whole trip. I wouldn't even think about speeding, offisah."

Everybody knows that you shouldn't try to lie about how fast you were going because that just isn't going to help, so it makes more sense that that is what wtf was thinking of when he wrote that. I don't believe that not telling the officer you are carrying is what he was after, especially since there's no way he can know you are being dishonest, whereas he already knows how fast you were going.

I mean, It doesn't really matter one way or the other to me. I was just speaking up because you were a bit abrasive and came down kinda hard on the guy when what wtf said wasn't really grounds for claiming his attitude was responsible for common anti-LEO sentiment. If nothing else, give him the benefit of the doubt until he explicitly says something that really seals his coffin about it. That's what I try to do.

Caleb

 

[DoubleTap Tactical]

The truth shall set u free.............(maybe with a ticket)

 

[Roadie]

As a driver with any sense, we'd be even wiser to obey all traffic laws so we don't get pulled over in the first place! Eh, boss?

True in theory, in practice? eh
Ever try driving exactly 55?

 

[Joe Williams]

True in theory, in practice? eh
Ever try driving exactly 55?

Only through a school zone!

YouTube - I can't drive 55

 

[Dsgnr_81]

"It's just that I've never seen anybody carrying guns like that."

So how WERE you carrying em?

 

[rhino]

I tried to give you positive rep for the message below (#88) and for your previous (#86), but apparently I gave you rep for something else too recently.

I approve.

Couldn't agree more.

As an officer, it's a good general rule that you do not want someone else handling a loaded firearm in your presnece.

As a good gun owner, it's a good general rule that you do not want to hand someone else YOUR loaded firearm.

As a human being with a grain of common sense, it's a good general assumption that the situation would be a lot safer for everyone if everyone's firearms stayed right where they were before the "encounter" happened.

 

[femurphy77]

Pulled over once since I started to carry, the situation didn't dictate telling; he didn't ask, I didn't tell. Had a search seemed forthcoming then I would have "outed" myself.

 

[IndyMonkey]

Quick question: I've had my LTCH for a while, and my wife just got hers. She asked me, and I didn't know: What do you tell the police officer here in Indiana if you get pulled over? What does the law require? Do you say nothing, or do you hand him the pink paper with your driver's license and mention it?

I dont say anything about the gun. If they have ran the plate they already know that I have a carry permit.

Im not big on police offices being armed tax collectors.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

So how WERE you carrying em?

Same way I always do, primary, 1911, on right side, secondary, Kahr P9, on the left side with a .38 on the left ankle (but I don't think he saw that one).

Of course, as rhino will tell you, I always dress like this when carrying:

Girlfriend hates it when I call her "Heather".