Uvalde Texas Killing

[chipbennett]

This is the time line I got so far from news media...correct or add as needed.
1. Shooter was outside the school for 12 minutes before entering a unlocked door.
2. No officer at the school or the ones chasing him engaged him.
3. Some police entered the building.....and did nothing for 1 HOUR.
4. During that 1 HOUR parents were being handcuffed, tazed and takin into custody because they wanted to get to their kids becasue police were doing NOTHING.
5. After that 1 HOUR of doing nothing a Border Agent arriving on the scene went into room and finally killed the idiot.
6. When police were asked why they never engaged and why they waited 1 HOUR before stopping him the Police spokesman said he would "CIRCLE BACK." on that question.
Why was the school backdoor unlocked, why didn't police call the school for a lockdown during that 12 minutes when they refused to engage and why did they not go in but wait and entire HOUR before finally engaging......questions that need answered. Feel free to use the word cowards and inept. Now the conspiracy people will be saying this was all pre planned and anti-gun liberal police wanted this to all happen to further the liberal agenda to take away guns.

There is a evil going on here, not just with these shooters. But professional people are now calling the Governor of TX and anyone not getting rid of "assault rifles" as being narcissists, so to the liberals, half the country are now narcissists and can't be trusted anymore and "something" must be done about these people that have guns. Right now IMHO I have never seen more liberals more worked up to take away the 2A. And we have way too many liberals in this country, and RINO's that will cave.

We know, thanks to Castle Rock v Gonzalez, according to SCOTUS, that law enforcement officers have no specific responsibility to protect anyone. We also know, thanks to federal law, that law-abiding citizens are prevented from acting in their own defense inside of schools, due to the Gun Free School Zones Act.

The way I see it, either we need to compel LEO to act in defense of victims in these scenarios (and hold them responsible for that defense), or we need to eliminate so-called "gun free zones", so that law-abiding, would-be victims are no longer legally constrained from acting in their own self-defense.

I'm fine with not compelling LEO to run into harm's way in an active shooter scenario. But if we're not going to do that, then creating statutorily compelled defenseless victims is (all the more) morally repugnant.

 

[chipbennett]

Having seen this in countless "secure" factories, I'm going with block of wood in the door holding it open slightly to get in and out easier. That would explain his entry and the door being locked later.

That block of wood is now long gone.

If that door was propped open in violation of school security policy, then the person who violated that policy should be held responsible for everything that happened as a result. That person should serve 100% of the prison sentence that would have been served by the shooter had he survived/been convicted.

 

[BigRed]

Active shooter training held at Uvalda High school in March of this year

Chilling images show students at Salvador Ramos’ HS pretending to be dead during active-shooter drill

Ruben Ruiz, a Uvalde school district cop and husband of slain Robb Elementary teacher Eva Mireles, held the chillingly prophetic drill on March 22 at Uvalde High School.

nypost.com

I always find it interesting how often "drills" take place not long before "active shooter" events.

I seem to recall drills taking place not long before Sandy Hook.

 

[KittySlayer]

Was that why Grandma got shot --- did she have a Key she didn't turn in when she left ??

Grandma would only have a key if there was yet another security failure by the administration of the school to collect all keys from a departing employee and if not collected change the locks. Heck, getting the Do Not Duplicate key is the first thing on the checklist that I am going through today for a departing employee.

I am going with the block of wood so the teachers had their hands free to light their cigarettes when going outside to smoke.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Same guy?

Two teens arrested in 'mass casualty' plot in 2018 targeting a Uvalde middle school

One of the students had numerous writings and drawings which depicted weapons capable of causing mass destruction. He wrote about being "God-like" and killing police and other persons.

www.kens5.com

 

[Doug]

Regarding the training...

Did that training consist of "stay away until the S.W.A.T. team arrives and prevent anyone from interfering with the shooter?"

 

[KG1]

Whatever happened the shooter gained easy access through a door that he shouldn't have been able to. Serious breach of security.

 

[DragonGunner]

We know, thanks to Castle Rock v Gonzalez, according to SCOTUS, that law enforcement officers have no specific responsibility to protect anyone. We also know, thanks to federal law, that law-abiding citizens are prevented from acting in their own defense inside of schools, due to the Gun Free School Zones Act.

The way I see it, either we need to compel LEO to act in defense of victims in these scenarios (and hold them responsible for that defense), or we need to eliminate so-called "gun free zones", so that law-abiding, would-be victims are no longer legally constrained from acting in their own self-defense.

I'm fine with not compelling LEO to run into harm's way in an active shooter scenario. But if we're not going to do that, then creating statutorily compelled defenseless victims is (all the more) morally repugnant.

I'm told TX all teachers can carry in schools.....? Probably not true yet, but was told that. Agree with you though. Didn't FL convict that security "cop" for not going in and engaging a shooter at a school?

 

[Cameramonkey]

I'm told TX all teachers can carry in schools.....? Probably not true yet, but was told that. Agree with you though. Didn't FL convict that security "cop" for not going in and engaging a shooter at a school?

I think he was just fired.

EDIT: Wrong. He's currently awaiting trial for felony child neglect it appears. My bet is he gets off based on the various SCOTUS cases like Castle Rock.

Judge says case against former Parkland school resource officer Scot Peterson can go to trial | CNN

A Florida judge ruled Thursday that a case may proceed against former Broward County Sheriff's Deputy Scot Peterson, a school resource officer who was widely criticized after he failed to confront a shooter during the deadly massacre at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School in February 2018.

www.cnn.com

 

[Keith_Indy]

From my understanding from a variety of sources,

The shooter entered through a door from the teachers parking lot. Not sure if unlocked or it was already open

The shooter entered an empty, unlocked classroom, which had door to the adjoining classroom with students and teacher. Shooter possibly locked those doors as he went through them.

Now, think of this…

They had to use a key to open the door, so I don't know having breeching tools would have made any difference.

The first three people in the stack that breached the classroom got hit.

1st person had the shield
2nd person received an injury
3rd person had his cap grazed by a bullet

And those were the BORTAC counter-terrorism trained guys. I’ll leave it to others to do the coulda, woulda, shoulda or think they could have done better, and wait for a more thorough official timeline.

It will be the same ol’, same ol’ as far as politics goes, it’s an election year after all. Can’t let a crisis go to waste, gotta BLAME THE OTHER AND DO SOMETHING.

How about we wait for the innocents to be buried and the investigation to complete before we start ascribing blame?

Because the ultimate person responsible is dead, an alienated misfit with mental issues. Whatever 'signal' and intervention that would have prevented this, was missed long before the shooting occurred.

No solution is perfect, everything involves trade-offs and nobody is perfect. Someone will prop open the door to bring in supplies.

Wrong place, wrong time.

 

[DragonGunner]

I think he was just fired.

EDIT: Wrong. He's currently awaiting trial for felony child neglect it appears. My bet is he gets off based on the various SCOTUS cases like Castle Rock.

Judge says case against former Parkland school resource officer Scot Peterson can go to trial | CNN

A Florida judge ruled Thursday that a case may proceed against former Broward County Sheriff's Deputy Scot Peterson, a school resource officer who was widely criticized after he failed to confront a shooter during the deadly massacre at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School in February 2018.

www.cnn.com

Well I read that TX does allow teachers to have guns IF, the school district clears it, they are licensed and believe the school then has to be part of a US Marshal Program.....otherwise no carry for teachers......it appears TX is now wanting to push past all the red tape now.

 

[KG1]

The only thing we have to go by as far as the door the shooter initially entered thru is that it was unlocked, and the shooter entered unencumbered. This according to a Texas LE media briefing. Why that door was not locked remains to be determined/disclosed.

 

[rooster]

I always find it interesting how often "drills" take place not long before "active shooter" events.

I seem to recall drills taking place not long before Sandy Hook.

You are correct. I remember cnn getting caught playing footage from that drill or another one and saying it was “live” footage

 

[Ark]

From my understanding from a variety of sources,

The shooter entered through a door from the teachers parking lot. Not sure if unlocked or it was already open

The shooter entered an empty, unlocked classroom, which had door to the adjoining classroom with students and teacher. Shooter possibly locked those doors as he went through them.

Now, think of this…

They had to use a key to open the door, so I don't know having breeching tools would have made any difference.

The first three people in the stack that breached the classroom got hit.

1st person had the shield
2nd person received an injury
3rd person had his cap grazed by a bullet

And those were the BORTAC counter-terrorism trained guys. I’ll leave it to others to do the coulda, woulda, shoulda or think they could have done better, and wait for a more thorough official timeline.

It will be the same ol’, same ol’ as far as politics goes, it’s an election year after all. Can’t let a crisis go to waste, gotta BLAME THE OTHER AND DO SOMETHING.

How about we wait for the innocents to be buried and the investigation to complete before we start ascribing blame?

Because the ultimate person responsible is dead, an alienated misfit with mental issues. Whatever 'signal' and intervention that would have prevented this, was missed long before the shooting occurred.

No solution is perfect, everything involves trade-offs and nobody is perfect. Someone will prop open the door to bring in supplies.

Wrong place, wrong time.

There's screwups all over this incident, but those guys gritting their teeth and hitting the fatal funnel against a prepared shooter with a rifle is some serious man ****. Should have never gotten to that point in the first place, but those BP guys appear to have been ready and willing to eat lead to get him.

 

[chipbennett]

Same guy?

Two teens arrested in 'mass casualty' plot in 2018 targeting a Uvalde middle school

One of the students had numerous writings and drawings which depicted weapons capable of causing mass destruction. He wrote about being "God-like" and killing police and other persons.

www.kens5.com

Could the shooter have passed a NICS check at 18 with that on his record at 14?

 

[chipbennett]

No solution is perfect, everything involves trade-offs and nobody is perfect. Someone will prop open the door to bring in supplies.

No. Just, no. There are other ways to bring in supplies. That door locks from the outside specifically as a security measure. Circumventing that security measure exposes the school to the risk of exactly what happened. So, if that circumvention did, in fact, take place, heads need to roll (figuratively speaking).

 

[Ingomike]

If that door was propped open in violation of school security policy, then the person who violated that policy should be held responsible for everything that happened as a result. That person should serve 100% of the prison sentence that would have been served by the shooter had he survived/been convicted.

I have seen hundreds of “blocks of wood” and they generally are a collective thing not a single person thing. That said they are often used by smokers to take their quick smoke breaks. (Not sure if teachers get smoke breaks.)

 

[SEIndSAM]

'You're All Gonna Die': 10-Year-Old Survivor of Uvalde Attack Recounts Horror Inside Classroom

www.msn.com

'You're All Gonna Die': 10-Year-Old Survivor of Uvalde Attack Recounts Horror Inside Classroom.​

 

[TheGrumpyGuy]

Did the shooter know the door to be unlocked or was it sheer chance that he picked an unlocked door? Facts might change but the timeline and decisions of action, or lack thereof, make the local law enforcement look very bad like part of the plan.

FIFY

 

[chipbennett]

I have seen hundreds of “blocks of wood” and they generally are a collective thing not a single person thing. That said they are often used by smokers to take their quick smoke breaks. (Not sure if teachers get smoke breaks.)

One would think, a mere two months after "active shooter" drills at the school, the "collective" would have the mindset to self-police such an egregious breach of school security.