The Trump Presidency will be in the top 10 in our nation's history

[DoggyDaddy]

There are a few things that argue against a bottoms-up approach.
It is a major issue in a number of large cities. And it's the same issue.
Bottoms-up takes too long.
If it was viewed as a problem locally, something would have been done already.

A black man living in city XYZ that has implemented comprehensive reform should not have to worry about crossing into anothe city that hasn't implemented reform. That is a civil rights violation in my view.

And that's exactly what we have today.

So what's the answer? Again, the cities that have the lion's share of the problem are democrat-led cities. Why lay this problem at Trump's feet? I'd be fine with cutting off any and all federal funding to those cities until they get their houses in order. That might light a fire under their collective butts, and that could be done immediately. Do you think the Dems in the House and Senate would agree to it?

 

[jamil]

So the fix is to elect non-racists? And to do that they have to be from the other party? Thanks for straightening that out.

I think there is more than an even chance that the Senate will be turned over in this election.

Obviously this is bull****. The D party is every bit as full of real ass racists as the R party. It just manifests more subtly as virtuous signaling. But what he was saying that there's no such thing as systemic racism, and I mostly agree with that. Systemic racism is a system where the group is "racist" without identifying any individual racists. It's unfalsifiable. It's a figment of critical race theory which is nonsense.

I only say "mostly" agree, because I think if there could be an example of systemic racism, I think it would be stop-n-frisk. But attaching "racism" to "systemic" doesn't actually make the system racist. The elements that make up real ass racism are absent. It's not outcome that makes something racist. It's intent. So for stop-n-frisk, it's true enough that it systemically disadvantages certain races. That's not actually racism by itself. Now if it were the case that a person with power concocted the whole idea for racist purposes, it would be a racist policy slipped in under the nose of non-racists. That would actually be racist and we could point to an actual racist who is responsible.

 

[Alpo]

So what's the answer? Again, the cities that have the lion's share of the problem are democrat-led cities. Why lay this problem at Trump's feet? I'd be fine with cutting off any and all federal funding to those cities until they get their houses in order. That might light a fire under their collective butts, and that could be done immediately. Do you think the Dems in the House and Senate would agree to it?

If these protests and riots had happened under a democrat administration, I'd say the same thing: This needs to be driven from the top. Leadership. Don't tell me how well the streets of the emirates or Jerusalem are doing when the streets of Atlanta or Kenosha are burning. Get going on comprehensive reforms. And an effective national effort would include the bully pulpit AND keeping a tight grip on Federal funds.

 

[jamil]

There are a few things that argue against a bottoms-up approach.
It is a major issue in a number of large cities. And it's the same issue.
Bottoms-up takes too long.
If it was viewed as a problem locally, something would have been done already.

A black man living in city XYZ that has implemented comprehensive reform should not have to worry about crossing into anothe city that hasn't implemented reform. That is a civil rights violation in my view.

And that's exactly what we have today.

There isn't exactly one solution, and only one solution. It's a major issue in many large cities for sure. Louisville needs some reform badly. Louisville cops tend to be *******s. What needs to happen in Louisville may not be the problem everywhere. And that seems to be the solution the left proposes. A top down solution which assumes that the problem is, cops are just racist. Undoubtedly some, maybe many are. That's not gonna fix the *******s in Louisville. They don't seem to care black or white. The ones who are *******s are *******s to everyone. Of course not all of them are.

I think you need to make a better case that there is actually racism deeply embedded in most police forces, and that it's not just some individual racist cops.

 

[jamil]

If these protests and riots had happened under a democrat administration, I'd say the same thing: This needs to be driven from the top. Leadership. Don't tell me how well the streets of the emirates are doing when the streets of Atlanta or Kenosha are burning. Get going on comprehensive reforms. And an effective national effort would include the bully pulpit AND keeping a tight grip on Federal funds.

Again, they're not rioting for rational reasons. A black man who was running at police with a knife was shot by white officers. If one of those officers had been black I have no doubt he'd have shot too. There is no evidence yet that the incident had anything to do with the officer's attitudes about black people. People who run at cops with knives tend to get shot regardless of their race.

 

[Alpo]

One of the LEO's here mentioned something like 18,000 different law enforcement "entities" here in the USA.

I'm not waiting for 18,000 of them to decide what to do. Federal leadership is needed.

 

[jamil]

One of the LEO's here mentioned something like 18,000 different law enforcement "entities" here in the USA.

I'm not waiting for 18,000 of them to decide what to do. Federal leadership is needed.

First, it doesn't matter whether you wait or not. It's not up to you. There are more sides to it than yours. What's wrong in one town isn't necessarily the thing that's wrong in another. With top-down approaches we end up with ideological solutions that won't work across the board, or even at all. Do you really think sensitivity training will help? That's the kinds of solutions we get. What about defund the police. Lot's of ideologues on your side of the isle want that one.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

If these protests and riots had happened under a democrat administration, I'd say the same thing: This needs to be driven from the top. Leadership. Don't tell me how well the streets of the emirates or Jerusalem are doing when the streets of Atlanta or Kenosha are burning. Get going on comprehensive reforms. And an effective national effort would include the bully pulpit AND keeping a tight grip on Federal funds.

Again, who has the grip on those Federal funds? Doesn't matter what Trump says from his bully pulpit if the ones controlling the purse strings aren't going to close that purse. Trump has already suggested cutting funding to the cities that have the biggest problems and he is met with resistance from the Democrats in Congress. He's also suggested sending in Federal law enforcement and he was met with resistance from those cities' leaders. This is not a "Trump problem".

 

[Alpo]

Again, they're not rioting for rational reasons. A black man who was running at police with a knife was shot by white officers. If one of those officers had been black I have no doubt he'd have shot too. There is no evidence yet that the incident had anything to do with the officer's attitudes about black people. People who run at cops with knives tend to get shot regardless of their race.

The statistics aren't in your favor Jamil. In this particular incident....perhaps. I'd say more likely than not.

But, when you start stacking them up....there is a problem and it's now gotten to the point of political awareness and national coverage. It is not going away this time. Nor should it.

Because for every "probably good shoot" in Philly, there's a bad shoot in Waukegan against a black man and woman sitting in their car across the street from their own house. Unarmed.

It has to stop.

 

[KG1]

So what's the answer? Again, the cities that have the lion's share of the problem are democrat-led cities. Why lay this problem at Trump's feet? I'd be fine with cutting off any and all federal funding to those cities until they get their houses in order. That might light a fire under their collective butts, and that could be done immediately. Do you think the Dems in the House and Senate would agree to it?

I believe the Trump administration has been sued or threatened to be sued over cutting federal funding.

 

[jamil]

Again, the streets of America's cities are burning because the leadership in those cities don't want to stop it for political reasons. Take Louisville for example. When Mayor Fischsmell thought it was politically advantageous to let things go, he let it go. They burned and looted downtown Louisville. Well, when it became obvious to Mayor Fischsmell that it's not politically advantageous to just let it go, he directed the police to stop it, and they pretty much did. Of course, since there are so many *******s, some cops were *******s about it. But then two of their officers were shot, so there's that. Point is, if there is a will to stop it, it gets stopped. If there's not a will to stop it, well we call that Portland.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

I believe the Trump administration has been sued or threatened to be sued over cutting federal funding.

Shocking isn't it? "Don't tell us what to do! But give us money so we can keep doing what's not working!"

 

[jamil]

The statistics aren't in your favor Jamil. In this particular incident....perhaps. I'd say more likely than not.

But, when you start stacking them up....there is a problem and it's now gotten to the point of political awareness and national coverage. It is not going away this time. Nor should it.

Because for every "probably good shoot" in Philly, there's a bad shoot in Waukegan against a black man and woman sitting in their car across the street from their own house. Unarmed.

It has to stop.

Okay. How many of the cases that we've see are due to race? Go ahead. List them. Surely of the many cases made public--because now EVERY shooting where a black man is shot by white cops is made public--you should have no problems identifying the racism.

When you normalize for population makeup, black people are no more likely to be shot by cops per encounter than white people. I'm not saying there aren't racist cops, or people who've created some racist policies. I just don't see that it's systemic.

 

[jamil]

Oh. And to address "it has to stop". How do you stop a black man from running in a threatening manner towards police? What else were police supposed to do? The video seems to show that they had just gotten there, and then some dude runs at them with a knife. Should they just be stabbed? Some people from your side of the isle suggest that.

 

[KG1]

Shocking isn't it? "Don't tell us what to do! But give us money so we can keep doing what's not working!"

Defund the Police but don't defund us.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

Oh. And to address "it has to stop". How do you stop a black man from running in a threatening manner towards police? What else were police supposed to do? The video seems to show that they had just gotten there, and then some dude runs at them with a knife. Should they just be stabbed? Some people from your side of the isle suggest that.

Well duh. You shoot them in the leg! Or add a psychiatrist couch to the SWAT team arsenal and talk it out.

 

[Alpo]

Okay. How many of the cases that we've see are due to race? Go ahead. List them. Surely of the many cases made public--because now EVERY shooting where a black man is shot by white cops is made public--you should have no problems identifying the racism.

When you normalize for population makeup, black people are no more likely to be shot by cops per encounter than white people. I'm not saying there aren't racist cops, or people who've created some racist policies. I just don't see that it's systemic.

I'm not following you down your rabbit hole.

You can look at statistics as well as I. Black women, for example, represent 28% of the unarmed deaths at the hands of police and yet represent 12% of the population. It isn't just Breonna, amigo.

Source. https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2020/investigations/police-shootings-women/

 

[KG1]

Well duh. You shoot them in the leg! Or add a psychiatrist couch to the SWAT team arsenal and talk it out.

That there is real reform according to some on the left.

 

[NKBJ]

The chicoms have been funneling money to who
for what purposes?

 

[Alpo]

Oh. And to address "it has to stop". How do you stop a black man from running in a threatening manner towards police? What else were police supposed to do? The video seems to show that they had just gotten there, and then some dude runs at them with a knife. Should they just be stabbed? Some people from your side of the isle suggest that.

We'll need better video to see if he was running at them. The one I saw, whcih was shaky, sort of showed him angling past the cops. But I'm not gonna argue this one. I said Philly has a low shoot rate. If you want to be anecdotal, find another player.