The (Semi) Official Trump Election/Inauguration thread...

[Bennettjh]

Argue with SCOTUS.

We are generally thought of as a democratic republic. The words, though not interchangeable, are used in that manner in the normal course of talking about America. And it has been so for over 100 years.

You're joking right? Well, if not, a republic is a type of democracy. The are several definitions of democracy. I suppose you had "direct democracy" in mind.

Yeah I get all that. I shouldn't have said it has nothing to do with it because it does. It just seems like he would say "republic" not "democracy".

 

[Bennettjh]

Kut: It's a point used by the opposition to keep the conversation from moving forward on subtantive issues.

Much like "Well Obama....."

Pardon me for holding up progress.

 

[Alpo]

I suppose you'd have to go back to the first half of the 20th Century to see whether people used the term "republic" in its proper context. My sense from slightly after that time is that democracy was generally understood by most people to be what America was all about and a republic was the finer nuance of how the system worked.

Our last Bush president used "democracy" quite a bit, if I recall, when speaking of what America was bringing to the world. I'm sure he meant republicanism.

 

[Bennettjh]

My sense from slightly after that time is that democracy was generally understood by most people to be what America was all about and a republic was the finer nuance of how the system worked.

I agree with you. I guess I'm just a die-hard "it's a Republic" guy.

 

[Alpo]

Yeah, and I get really bothered by "loose" when people mean "lose".

No harm, no foul.

 

[ghitch75]

"I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."


i see it as a Republic......

 

[ArcadiaGP]

Finally, I can pay more for everything I buy.

Trump team floats possibility of an early executive action to impose tariffs on foreign imports, sources say - CNNPolitics.com

 

[OakRiver]

An alternative to what? To an oligarchy? To corporations who decide to offshore the companies to avoid taxation? To board members who renounce their citizenship for a Nevis passport?

To what to whom does an oligarchy owe its allegiance?

Are we now officially an oligarchy instead of a constitutional republic?

 

[foszoe]

Finally, I can pay more for everything I buy.

Trump team floats possibility of an early executive action to impose tariffs on foreign imports, sources say - CNNPolitics.com

Lots of people do to say they buy local so I am sure there are those who are willing to pay more because it is made locally.

 

[Alpo]

Are we now officially an oligarchy instead of a constitutional republic?

There is another member of this forum that, rather than making declarative statements, tends to ask questions in response. This is not The Paper Chase. If you have something to say about oligarchies and concentration of wealth in relation to Brandeis' views 3 generations ago, I'd be glad to read it. I won't respond to a series of questions.

 

[OakRiver]

There is another member of this forum that, rather than making declarative statements, tends to ask questions in response. This is not The Paper Chase. If you have something to say about oligarchies and concentration of wealth in relation to Brandeis' views 3 generations ago, I'd be glad to read it. I won't respond to a series of questions.

When you decide to progress the conversation on from more than the quote of a Justice, strawmen, and obfuscation I look forward to a discussion.

Until then you may continue to lament the oligarchy that the US is not.

 

[Alpo]

When you decide to progress the conversation on from more than the quote of a Justice, strawmen, and obfuscation I look forward to a discussion.

Until then you may continue to lament the oligarchy that the US is not.

Yeah, we should have had Hilary and her Wall Street connections in the White House. I'm sure she would have curbed any billionaires from actively seeking to to influence govt for their benefit, not the people. Oh, and put a stop to any undue influence from lobbying groups. Instead they would be rebranded as charitable foundations much like her own.

Setting your attempts at declarative pejorative-rich statements aside for the moment, that was your first remark after the Brandeis image, I believe. How do you define a government comprised of these attributes? (Feel free to Google wealth distribution, wage history or other economic data as necessary. Don't forget the effects of Citizens United and the restrictions to liberty imposed by the Patriot Act [along with the NSA's disregard of even those limitations]).

I'll take the liberty in assuming 2 things: That Trump is different in a major way (but being a billionaire and hiring billionaires to run the government might stress that issue to its breaking point)

And that I think Hillary was a better answer.

 

[PistolBob]

And that I think Hillary was a better answer.

SMH...I just don't see it.

 

[ArcadiaGP]

Obama administration ending program once used to track mostly Arab and Muslim men - CNNPolitics.com

 

[OakRiver]

Setting your attempts at declarative pejorative-rich statements aside for the moment, that was your first remark after the Brandeis image, I believe. How do you define a government comprised of these attributes? (Feel free to Google wealth distribution, wage history or other economic data as necessary. Don't forget the effects of Citizens United and the restrictions to liberty imposed by the Patriot Act [along with the NSA's disregard of even those limitations]).

I'll take the liberty in assuming 2 things: That Trump is different in a major way (but being a billionaire and hiring billionaires to run the government might stress that issue to its breaking point)

And that I think Hillary was a better answer.

I apologize that you misread that statement, which I assumed to be so blatant in its sarcasm that purple was not needed. Evidently I misjudged and apologize for your misreading of my intent.

You still have yet to establish that de facto or de jure that the United States is in fact an oligarchy. The presence of billionaires in positions of power is not ipso facto proof that the country is an oligarchy. While the United States, and many other countries across the globe, may exhibit some traits that are common in oligarchies by any objective definition the United States falls short of what would traditionally be considered an oligarchy. Your protests are misplaced and you are tilting at windmills.

Now that we have finished pulling teeth and gotten you to actually begin to state your argument what is your proposed solution to this fauxligarchy?

 

[OakRiver]

Obama administration ending program once used to track mostly Arab and Muslim men - CNNPolitics.com

I think the most important news associated with this is that clearly the US government has found a way to time travel; after all we were told that under a Trump Administration that Muslims would be subjected to monitoring

 

[Alpo]

SMH...I just don't see it.

You misread this.

 

[Alpo]

I apologize that you misread that statement, which I assumed to be so blatant in its sarcasm that purple was not needed. Evidently I misjudged and apologize for your misreading of my intent.

You still have yet to establish that de facto or de jure that the United States is in fact an oligarchy. The presence of billionaires in positions of power is not ipso facto proof that the country is an oligarchy. While the United States, and many other countries across the globe, may exhibit some traits that are common in oligarchies by any objective definition the United States falls short of what would traditionally be considered an oligarchy. Your protests are misplaced and you are tilting at windmills.

Now that we have finished pulling teeth and gotten you to actually begin to state your argument what is your proposed solution to this fauxligarchy?

You are a bit binary. It is not EITHER a democracy OR oligarchy. It is a range. A degree. Not an absolute.

To reduce my rights, freedoms and privileges by degree does not one day switch me from citizen to slave, but as the frog was cooked, over time those rights and privileges are lost so that I am no longer the free man I used to be. Power in the hands of a few is contrary to what our founders envisioned, yet we get closer to that every day.

I'm not in a question answering mood, however. Make your own views known. I do not enjoy socratic dialogue as I don't see you as my mentor or student.

 

[Kutnupe14]

I think the most important news associated with this is that clearly the US government has found a way to time travel; after all we were told that under a Trump Administration that Muslims would be subjected to monitoring

The noteworthy difference being that It has been implied that Trump's registry would solely to Muslims regards to whether they are citizens or not. Experts have pretty much stated that if this is applied to the citizens of a particular nation (ALL), then it would pass constitutional muster. However citing individual religions would not.

 

[ArcadiaGP]

Sean Spicer named Press Secretary, and Assistant to the President