The Official Hot Rod Thread - Part 4: Burnouts for Distance

[femurphy77]

Not sure which heads you used. 3 bars? 4bar? Explorer?
I wouldn't port match it that big it will likely kill a lot of velocity. I would definitely clean it up and smooth it out. Not sure what gasket that is, does it fit the heads? I use paper to make a stencil not the gasket.

If you dont it will cause a vortices at the coupling point if there is any over lap. Dont have to go up in the runner very far to disrupt velocity.

Yeah I know, but those gaskets may be bigger than the heads as well. I make a template of the head then use that not the gasket

I would not go that thin in these particular areas for sure.
View attachment 133681

The heads are old school iron D00E factory heads, very similar in port size at least to the cast iron dart heads although not sure which generation. Yeah I'm not wanting to really hog them out as this is a street car 99.9% of the team (including AC ) and yeah my bigger concern was the turbulence at the wide transition. The corner pointed out is thin but there's a chunk of aluminum across the rest of the highlighted area.

We'll see how it goes.

 

[churchmouse]

Yeah I know, but those gaskets may be bigger than the heads as well. I make a template of the head then use that not the gasket

I would not go that thin in these particular areas for sure.
View attachment 133681

ah thats a red flag.

 

[Jaybird1980]

The heads are old school iron D00E factory heads, very similar in port size at least to the cast iron dart heads although not sure which generation. Yeah I'm not wanting to really hog them out as this is a street car 99.9% of the team (including AC ) and yeah my bigger concern was the turbulence at the wide transition. The corner pointed out is thin but there's a chunk of aluminum across the rest of the highlighted area.

We'll see how it goes.

Is it a 351? Thought those were off of the 351W

This is the method I use.

Making Porting Templates - EECTuning.org

eectuning.org

 

[churchmouse]

This is the method I use.

Making Porting Templates - EECTuning.org

eectuning.org

I have seen that method used.
If you match to the gasket you have chosen it is easy enough just dont get crazy when you pick the gasket.
Usually the manifold (if after market) is the larger more specific shape of the 2. Matching to shape and size can be a plus over all.
But again I run Bow Ties.

 

[maxwelhse]

No knock on your friend and his major efforts but in my day the Olds and Buicks ruled the stock/super stock wars driven properly. They were and still are beasts in the automatic classes.
I owned a brand new 1970 W-30 (bought in 71) that was "Factory" rated at 430 HP if memory serves and it did a lot better on the chassis dyno than you friends before it was even broke in. Chet Elliots Sunoco in Speedway had an in floor dyno and we used it often. I worked at the station part time when needed basically for free just to use the shop/Dyno. My Olds rolled off 310 RWHP after a few timing/jet tweaks. So I figure something was missing from your friend equation. We saw this a lot with folks rolling their own. And again, no knocks from me. If you never try you will never know.

Oh, I wasn't saying he was the world's foremost Olds expert or the benchmark. Quite the contrary. My point was that pretty much anybody can bolt that stuff on to a 454 and make twice the power, which is why people do exactly that. Better power out of an Olds isn't easy.

To port match or not to port match? It's a GT40 intake which is supposedly a $1400 intake on the used market. Putting it on the 'vert, came with the engine I'm putting in the 'vert, it's not supposed to be a fire breather but personally I don't see any harm in it.

View attachment 133673


View attachment 133674

The heads have been ported and blended quite nicely and the amount of mismatch is apparent in this photo.

$1400? You have the tubular GT40 or the cast? Asking because I have the cast, and if it's that much money, it's for sale. I also have 3 bar (I think) heads off of a '95 Cobra and it's all been gasket matched and ported. I can look up the Felpro part numbers used for the match if you have the same hardware.

 

[churchmouse]

Oh, I wasn't saying he was the world's foremost Olds expert or the benchmark. Quite the contrary. My point was that pretty much anybody can bolt that stuff on to a 454 and make twice the power, which is why people do exactly that. Better power out of an Olds isn't easy.



$1400? You have the tubular GT40 or the cast? Asking because I have the cast, and if it's that much money, it's for sale. I also have 3 bar (I think) heads off of a '95 Cobra and it's all been gasket matched and ported. I can look up the Felpro part numbers used for the match if you have the same hardware.

Yes sir. You have to work at it with an Olds/Poncho.

And truth is we have watched the home chef actually slow a decent car down with bad choices and most were
Chevy's...
Some folks wont listen. They want to figure it out on their own. Fun to watch.

Are those Ford parts that expensive.....

 

[Jaybird1980]

Are those Ford parts that expensive.....

That's what I was wondering. Those things were everywhere years ago.

 

[maxwelhse]

Yes sir. You have to work at it with an Olds/Poncho.

And truth is we have watched the home chef actually slow a decent car down with bad choices and most were
Chevy's...
Some folks wont listen. They want to figure it out on their own. Fun to watch.

Are those Ford parts that expensive.....

They didn't used to be that expensive. I bought my stuff 15 years ago expressly because it was cheap stuff from the '90s that no one wanted anymore. I made the conscious choice that I couldn't afford to build my car with the "good" stuff, so I was going to build it with what would have been period correct stuff. This was also right about the same time I decided not to try to turn it into some half-way drag car. It's too nice for that. If I want to go "fast", it will be an LS. Like the prior conversation, it's just too cheap/easy to make power with them to refuse.

 

[femurphy77]

Oh, I wasn't saying he was the world's foremost Olds expert or the benchmark. Quite the contrary. My point was that pretty much anybody can bolt that stuff on to a 454 and make twice the power, which is why people do exactly that. Better power out of an Olds isn't easy.



$1400? You have the tubular GT40 or the cast? Asking because I have the cast, and if it's that much money, it's for sale. I also have 3 bar (I think) heads off of a '95 Cobra and it's all been gasket matched and ported. I can look up the Felpro part numbers used for the match if you have the same hardware.

Totally tubular dude!

 

[femurphy77]

Is it a 351? Thought those were off of the 351W

This is the method I use.

Making Porting Templates - EECTuning.org

eectuning.org

I believe they're 302, they have "302" in the rocker area cast in from the factory and they also don't have the extra manifold holes in the water passage areas like the 351 requires.

 

[maxwelhse]

Totally tubular dude!

Yep, that would be the more rare setup then. Those were always a bit pricey.

So the Chebbieman can play along...

What I have:



vs. the more rare/valuable tubular setup:



Guys like the fabricated version because they could easily cut it open and really port the snot out of it if they wanted. I think they were '93 Cobra only...?

 

[Jaybird1980]

I believe they're 302, they have "302" in the rocker area cast in from the factory and they also don't have the extra manifold holes in the water passage areas like the 351 requires.

I must of remembered wrong, happens more than not with me. Lol

 

[churchmouse]

Yep, that would be the more rare setup then. Those were always a bit pricey.

So the Chebbieman can play along...

What I have:

View attachment 133688

vs. the more rare/valuable tubular setup:

View attachment 133689

Guys like the fabricated version because they could easily cut it open and really port the snot out of it if they wanted. I think they were '93 Cobra only...?

one time there was a process being used on these running an abrasive paste through it to smooth it out and increase area. Some kind of paste honing process and the name escapes me but I believe Kenny Brown used it on some of his pieces.

 

[maxwelhse]

one time there was a process being used on these running an abrasive paste through it to smooth it out and increase area. Some kind of paste honing process and the name escapes me but I believe Kenny Brown used it on some of his pieces.

Extrude honing. Allegedly mine has been done, but I really doubt it. Standard ePay shenanigans. It is what it is now.

 

[femurphy77]

Yep, that would be the more rare setup then. Those were always a bit pricey.

So the Chebbieman can play along...

What I have:

View attachment 133688

vs. the more rare/valuable tubular setup:

View attachment 133689

Guys like the fabricated version because they could easily cut it open and really port the snot out of it if they wanted. I think they were '93 Cobra only...?

I think they may have been on the Lightnings as well. I only remembered the kid telling me it was "special" when I bought the package. Only found out recently what the price tag is. (I only gave $400 IIRC for the engine, tremec, 4:11 posi rear, fiberglass hood, full 3" exhaust, aluminum radiator, tires/wheels, complete wiring harness all out of a 93 notch mustang. Sold off everything for about 3 grand and still have the engine.

 

[maxwelhse]

I think they may have been on the Lightnings as well. I only remembered the kid telling me it was "special" when I bought the package. Only found out recently what the price tag is. (I only gave $400 IIRC for the engine, tremec, 4:11 posi rear, fiberglass hood, full 3" exhaust, aluminum radiator, tires/wheels, complete wiring harness all out of a 93 notch mustang. Sold off everything for about 3 grand and still have the engine.

Digging a little deeper and knocking the cobwebs out... It looks like the tubular style was only used on Lightnings as OEM. They were available aftermarket for awhile with a different lower for 302s, then FRPP discontinued them for of the Cobra manifold (so what I have). I forgot what a mess all that was. It also looks like there's a good value difference between Lightning and after market GT40s.

And that was a burning good deal. Kid have a drug dealer literally pointing a gun at his head during the transaction? Wow.

 

[ChristianPatriot]

Yes I did pay for the Cleetus McFarland Freedom 500 pay-per-view....


Watching it right now

 

[churchmouse]

Yes Extrude Honing. Thats it.

 

[femurphy77]

Digging a little deeper and knocking the cobwebs out... It looks like the tubular style was only used on Lightnings as OEM. They were available aftermarket for awhile with a different lower for 302s, then FRPP discontinued them for of the Cobra manifold (so what I have). I forgot what a mess all that was. It also looks like there's a good value difference between Lightning and after market GT40s.

And that was a burning good deal. Kid have a drug dealer literally pointing a gun at his head during the transaction? Wow.

Almost, bill collectors.

 

[maxwelhse]

Almost, bill collectors.

This is going to sound horrible... but... I think we're going to see more of those days coming and I wouldn't mind some good deals.