The CNN Democrat Debate Thread

[Cygnus]

I agree tha Bernie and Biden won the debate.
Webb is a conservate Democrat. A rare bread these days....

Chaffee to Cooper: You're being really rough. LOL. Did he not know what office he is running for. I didn;t expect much from the governor of the armpit of Massaachusetts.

 

[bwframe]

I thought O'Malley's closing remarks were pretty good. Overall, I wouldn't be uncomfortable with any of these candidates running for the office of president. And that's good news because there is no way the republican group can pull a win in 2016 with the position the GOP has currently put the country in. They lost more voters this week when Mitch McConnell talked about cutting back on social security and changing medicare.

 

[bulletsmith]

Omalley makes me angry. Silly guy to his left is just forgettable. Hillary = yikes. Bernie has a few interesting ideas but not enough. Web, said a few good things. I always have this thing about feeling that I want a military person in office. I just think that nobody who has not served has the right to send our kids into battle.

 

[Spyco]

I'm with bulletsmith on this. Unfortunately the ballot is going to boil down to Bernie and Hillary. So O'malley , forgettable guy, and Webb will fall of the face of media. Of the 2 who will duke it out, I'd have to side with Sanders. Can't trust Hillary.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

In any of the free stuff for everybody talk, was there any discussion on where in the Constitution, it's permitted? Or discussion on whether it's even the role of the federal government to be handing out college educations?

This is adult conversation?

Out of all of them Webb is the least scary. he seems to lean to right a lot. But that just ansures he won't get the nomination.

Old Bernie works the crowd better then all of them. He is telling them what they want to hear. "Vote for me and get free . I'll make all millionaires look like crooks that are taking all your money!!" I'll take it back and give it to you. Now what disenchanted young American youth wouldn't find that appealing?? Makes me wanna

Well, he want to give away free higher education at community colleges. Sounds freaken awesome until you look at how many college educated unemployed people there are. Creating jobs that you can work at is a higher priority. You aren't going to see more high paying jobs under him. You will see less. The $15 an hour minimum wage thing is only going to un employ people.

I agree with the point about college, like somehow a degree is a golden ticket to a job, it's not. There are many paths to a good paying job. I disagree though that a 15 dollar minimum wage will lead to less higher paying jobs. You'll lose some low paying jobs but I think there are a lot of companies that would just have to suck it up and make up the costs some other place. Which are of course the hidden costs of a higher minimum wage.

Well, I'm glad I wasn't the only INGOr to watch it.

Very interesting.

For the record, as of right now, the night of the debate, their averages in the polls by RealClearPolitics is:

Clinton 43.3%
Bernie 25.1%
Biden 17.4% (and he hasn't even announced yet!)
Webb 0.9%
O'Malley 0.4%
Chaffee 0.3%

It will be very interesting to see where the numbers stack after this debate. As much as I disagree with Bernie on some issues, he also targets some real problems as well. What amazed me was that in discussing his "free" college for everyone he HAD A PLAN TO PAY FOR IT! I am not supporting him on this, but this is really fiscally responsible to figure out a way to pay for something you want to buy. I didn't hear anyone else on any topic mention paying for a plan.

And he isn't horrible on guns. He isn't great, but he'd be better than all the rest, except probably Webb.

Anywho's... I can't wait until this time next week to see the new numbers.

Regards,

Doug

 

[funeralweb]

The last question (paraphrasing): "Who have you made enemies with that you're most proud of?"

Hillary: (Paraphrasing again) "Pretty much everyone my fellow debaters already mentioned, a few more organizations and "Republicans". She didn't single the dozen-plus folks currently running for prez as GOP candy dates, she simply said "Republicans". Anyone else catch that? I doubt that sound bite will ever see the light of day.

 

[MisterChester]

In any of the free stuff for everybody talk, was there any discussion on where in the Constitution, it's permitted? Or discussion on whether it's even the role of the federal government to be handing out college educations?

This is adult conversation?

If it is not expressly forbidden, is it permitted?

 

[jamil]

If it is not expressly forbidden, is it permitted?

Ask the founders? There's plenty written on the subject.

I't just an exercise though. It doesn't matter anymore. Original intent is so far from people's minds that "constitutional" no longer means in accordance with the constitution. Today a "constitutional" law effectively means there are enough judges that like the law.

 

[funeralweb]

Anyone else think of Phil Hartman's unfortunate characterization of the late great Adm. Stockdale every time Mayor/Sen./Gov. Chafee was permitted to speak?

 

[Birds Away]

I thought O'Malley's closing remarks were pretty good. Overall, I wouldn't be uncomfortable with any of these candidates running for the office of president. And that's good news because there is no way the republican group can pull a win in 2016 with the position the GOP has currently put the country in. They lost more voters this week when Mitch McConnell talked about cutting back on social security and changing medicare.

I am not a fan of his particular brand of tyranny.

 

[Jludo]

In any of the free stuff for everybody talk, was there any discussion on where in the Constitution, it's permitted? Or discussion on whether it's even the role of the federal government to be handing out college educations?

This is adult conversation?

With Bernie he tells you exactly what you're gonna get, unlike the Republicans who pay lip service to the Constitution to get elected then do whatever they want once in office. Libertarians are the only ones you're going to get who strictly follow the Constitution yet people won't vote for them because they are unelectable because people won't vote for them because they are unelectable...

 

[Jludo]

I am not a fan of his particular brand of tyranny.

Me either, O'Malley was the most statist of anyone on the stage.

 

[jamil]

With Bernie he tells you exactly what you're gonna get, unlike the Republicans who pay lip service to the Constitution to get elected then do whatever they want once in office. Libertarians are the only ones you're going to get who strictly follow the Constitution yet people won't vote for them because they are unelectable because people won't vote for them because they are unelectable...

Has it occurred to you that people don't vote for Libertarian candidates because libertarians don't represent their views? Anymore, the general public wants tyranny. They just disagree on whose.

ETA: it seems the largest constituents of libertarians are people who only want to smoke pot legally.

 

[Libertarian01]

In any of the free stuff for everybody talk, was there any discussion on where in the Constitution, it's permitted? Or discussion on whether it's even the role of the federal government to be handing out college educations?

This is adult conversation?

I would humbly submit that this could be considered covered under Article I, Section 8 as follows "...to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defense and general Welfare of the United States..."

I know we don't like it and would prefer it to be narrowly defined, but the authority to pay for the general welfare does exist, and education could be considered such in a more liberal definition.

Regards,

Doug

PS - I don't like it either. I only acknowledge that it exists.

 

[dwagner3701]

The "General Welfare" clause had nothing to do with the public welfare system.
The public welfare system was created by the democrats. They started pushing for it in 1880.

 

[JTScribe]

I would humbly submit that this could be considered covered under Article I, Section 8 as follows "...to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defense and general Welfare of the United States..."

I know we don't like it and would prefer it to be narrowly defined, but the authority to pay for the general welfare does exist, and education could be considered such in a more liberal definition.

Regards,

Doug

PS - I don't like it either. I only acknowledge that it exists.

Sometimes I wish they'd been a little more blunt and a little less eloquent.

Madison, on 'general welfare':

If Congress can employ money indefinitely to the general welfare, and are the sole judges of the general welfare, they may take the care of religion into their own hands; they may appoint teachers in every State, county, and parish and pay them out of the public treasury; they may take into their own hands the education of children, establishing in like manner schools throughout the Union; they may assume the provision of the poor . . . Were the power of Congress to be established in the latitude contended for, it would subvert the very foundations, and transmute the very nature of the limited government established by the people of America.

General welfare from the founder's perspective should have meant for the benefit of all, not to certain interest groups. I know I certainly don't get any benefit out of SNAP.

 

[ArcadiaGP]

Some laughed at Jim Webb last night. For perspective, read his Navy Cross, Silver Star citations. A great American

Valor awards for James Henry Webb , Jr.

I'd vote for Webb over a few of the GOP candidates.

 

[MisterChester]

With Bernie he tells you exactly what you're gonna get, unlike the Republicans who pay lip service to the Constitution to get elected then do whatever they want once in office. Libertarians are the only ones you're going to get who strictly follow the Constitution yet people won't vote for them because they are unelectable because people won't vote for them because they are unelectable...

I don't agree with a number of Bernie's views but he made plenty of excellent points. Wall Street does indeed run congress, not the people. His "for the people, by the people" sentiment is true. Many of the GOP candidates and Hillary don't want people in positions of power to question the authority big money has on our government.

 

[Jludo]

Bernies position is to break up the big banks but I think its even more simple than that, simply refuse to bail out the big banks when they get in trouble. They threaten economic collapse to save their own hides but id rather see them fail and watch the pieces fall where they may.

 

[Jludo]

Has it occurred to you that people don't vote for Libertarian candidates because libertarians don't represent their views? Anymore, the general public wants tyranny. They just disagree on whose.

ETA: it seems the largest constituents of libertarians are people who only want to smoke pot legally.

Yea I never claimed the majority of people wanted to follow the Constitution, I'm just saying for those complaining that no one follows the Constitution there is a party that adheres strictly.