Stay put or bug out?

[7.62]

This can not be a definite anwser without being giving specific details of a scenerio. For example the people who said they are staying would change thier mind if they was in the center of a chemical attack.

I may stay and am prepared to do so. I am also prepared to bug out!

 

[sloughfoot]

Interesting. I was just thinking about threads similar to this that have come up in the past. I have learned a lot from the past threads.

Just to check again, what do those who intend to stay put have in mind for those on the move that would cross their path? Travelers, trespassers, etc.

Be careful with your answer, because if you are on the move, you could be the traveler, trespassers to some trigger happy fool.

As for me, I would try to be a good neighbor to all. The instant anybody proves to be unworthy of my kindness, things will change right now.

I will always be looking for well equipped and supplied allies. No matter where they come from.

 

[bwframe]

Be careful with your answer, because if you are on the move, you could be the traveler, trespassers to some trigger happy fool.

My point exactly. If I happen to be the one on the move, lots of trigger happy posters have changed my game plan. I was angry to start with, now I'm just wiser...

 

[hondatech2k2]

Well, being that I live in the Indy metro area.... I would leave as soon as the SHTF and head south to a more wooded and secluded area. The problem is: Over a million people in the Indy metro area + panic + food crisis + water crisis + vandalism + gangs= GTFO

 

[bwframe]

... I would leave as soon as the SHTF and head south to a more wooded and secluded area.

Now you see, that is a huge fear for us that live in those wooded and secluded areas. We would like for you to come up with a better plan.

 

[ar15_dude]

Here is what I wrote and was published in survivalblog.com some time ago on this topic:

I want to write about something that I believe is a core tenet of the Survival and Preparation (S&P) culture, but is often misunderstood, misapplied and has a high probability of failing, and that is “the bug-out”. I am prompted to write this after reading so many S&P-related books, blogs and forums where individuals are indicating that their primary plan, and the focus of their preparations, is bugging-out. The common discussion topics of bug-out vehicles (BOV), bug-out bags (BOB), bug-out land (BOL), etc, and the overall S&P lexicon confirm the importance placed on the bug-out concept. Although well organized and executed, a 1600 mile bug-out is portrayed by some of “the Group” in the book Patriots.

Don’t misunderstand, bugging-out does have a role in S&P: if your residence becomes completely uninhabitable, for any number of reasons (earthquake, radiation, toxins, fire, destruction, war, etc.), then relocation is mandatory. In these cases, being prepared to mobilize and relocate yourself, your family, and some resources is vitally important. Such situations force the prepper to implement Plan B. The problems with bugging-out are both numerous and severe, and are to be avoided or countermeasured if possible:
· only a small, finite quantity of supplies can be transported
· dependency on replenishing supplies is created
· a good place to relocate may not be found or actually available even if prearranged.
· it may not be possible to travel (impassable roads, vehicle failure)
· you may not be welcomed by the residents of where you relocate or in the territory that you pass through
· an operational BOV creates an attractive target if it appears to be transporting anything of value and due to the minimal security that can be provided

It has been well established by this blog and many S&P defacto leaders that outside of a few specific circumstances, the primary plan, Plan A, should always be to bug-in. Staying at your primary home has many advantages:

• more food/fuel/shelter resources can be available
• the facility can be better maintained due to your frequent access
• better established social connections and greater access to shared resources
• less need for transportation and transportation fuel
• avoids health and safety risks associated with travel
• higher levels of security are possible

The problem arises when lack of adequate, fundamental preparation results in the need to bug-out, when it otherwise could have been avoided. In other words, Plan A (bugging-in at your primary home) must be abandoned unnecessarily and prematurely, and Plan B (the secondary and far worse choice) becomes the only option, due to the prepper’s own actions/inactions.

People frequently write about how their urban home would be unsustainable, over-ran, or likely destroyed in many potential scenarios. Therefore their preps focus on bugging-out. When times are good and relative tranquility prevails, there are many attractions to an urban lifestyle, with job availability at the top of the list. Recognizing the added risk and difficulty of post-SHTF survival in the urban setting, preppers often abandon bug-in preparations, relegating themselves to bugging-out. Different life choices, such as small town or rural living, or taking extraordinary efforts to prepare their urban home, increase the viability of Plan A. For me and many others, the post-SHTF advantages of rural life are secondary to the quality of life enjoyed in these slower-paced environs.

The math doesn’t support bugging-out. If one assumes that there are 305 million Americans and about 2.3 trillion acres within the US, it sounds promising that there are 7.4 acres available to each American to which to bug-out. So a family of four should get almost 30 acres, right? Taking a closer look, inhospitable open cultivated farmland, open pasture, desert, wet lands, and bodies of water can largely be eliminated as places to which to relocate. Although these places could be inhabited, they are less attractive than “heading for the hills” as is often cited as the bug-out plan. What about the nation’s forests? There are about 747 million acres of forest that appear to be available for relocation. Data suggest there are 50 million “rural” Americans, and 255 million “urban” Americans. So we have some part of 255 million people that currently reside in about 60 million urban acres, looking to relocate on something like 757 million forested acres, which is about 3 acres per refugee. Not only is this not much space in which to live and forage, but:
· there will be great demand for suitable locations close to urban centers
· space will not be assigned, so there will be competition for choice space
· in a hunting-gathering mode, refugees will be forced to cover a wide area (hundreds of acres) in search of sustenance
· rural folks already are there, feel (and have legal) ownership, and are willing to protect their Plan A bug-in position

In conclusion, I advise that one of two actions be taken to reduce the need for depending on a bug-out strategy:
1) Commit to and prepare for bugging-in, regardless of your current residency. Fortify your home, stock up on supplies there, and implement countermeasures to unique urban challenges. “Improvise, adapt, overcome” as necessary.
2) Relocate to a place where bugging-in can be more practically implemented in as many scenarios as possible.

[FONT=&quot]In the future, I hope to read about more plans and preparations for bugging-in, and less for bugging-out. [/FONT]

 

[MerKWorK]

I will start by saying that bugging out should only be a choice of necessity. While I do believe everyone should have a well stocked and thought out bug out bag, vehicle etc...just in case. I also think that every pantry should be brimming with food. Alternative heat and light should be in place and sanity and water needs thought out.
Chaos is caused mostly be unpreparedness. In saying that, I will also say that bug out bag toting refugees will be the next welfare class in a SHTF role. Foraging is a fantasy, your indefinite camping trip will only last so long. And no one is going to welcome you with open arms, as you invade their area as a refugee. So how do you restock that B.O.B.?

Get to work making your home a self sustainable and somewhat defensible place. Not everyone can live in the boons, that would make them cities. So do what you can where you are and plan for any and every eventuality. Just use your brain and read history. This has all happened before!!!

 

[justjoe]

it will depend entirely on the situation. Primary residence is about 40 miles from major city. Have 60-90 days of food and water that does not depend on utilities, genny on hand and plenty of basics, including ammo. Secondary location is 50 miles north and way out in the boonies. Riverfront home with good, clean water and will soon, read as soon as money allows, completely self-sustaining along with group of close friends, most are vets, to oversee if we are not there. Hardest part will be getting family members there as we are scattered, although most are within 50 miles of one or other location. Biggest factor will be cause of shtf as to stay or bugout.

 

[hondatech2k2]

Now you see, that is a huge fear for us that live in those wooded and secluded areas. We would like for you to come up with a better plan.

Well lucky for you, I already have a spot picked out... that is nowhere near anyone....and completely in the deep of it.

 

[stchas]

When I first got into preparedness I thought that getting my family and heading deep into the woods would be our plan of action. I live off the beaten path so to speak in Brazil and my wife's parents and grand parents live in our little cul-de-sac (literally 2 houses to my left are her parents and 3 to my right are her grandparents)

Taking into consideration that neither of them "prep" I have kind of taken it upon myself to try and feed and protect the whole lot in a SHTF situation. With 8 people, possibly more if her sisters showed up, we will be digging our heels in and staying put. Leaving would be an absolute last resort. I can't imagine trying to move upwards of 15 people to the woods or another location. I have BOBs packed for my family if needed and am currently working on extras and have no desire to ever use them.

 

[flagtag]

Well, being that I live in the Indy metro area.... I would leave as soon as the SHTF and head south to a more wooded and secluded area. The problem is: Over a million people in the Indy metro area + panic + food crisis + water crisis + vandalism + gangs= GTFO

Problems is: many of those people will be thinking the same thing. You won't be alone.

 

[bwframe]

...I already have a spot picked out... that is nowhere near anyone....and completely in the deep of it.

That is what big city folks often believe.
Those of us that live rural will tell you that is highly unlikely in Indiana.

 

[Kimber]

my wife and i each have a BOB, and it is only for getting us back to residence if shtf in a hurry and we were at work. she works in the medical feild i work construction.
have the home front set up for now food water ammo. will be buying property 20 acres in the next month or two. plan on building secure home brick and mortor plan on going underground when things get really bad. so our plan is to bug in. if you plan on leaving you need to pay attention to everything, leave early and be discreet.

 

[sentinelrepublic]

bugging in, live in the burbs.If things get bad it will take a while for it to spread to the burbs. There would be no police presence cause they'd be in the bigger cities. By the time we'd need police, I have a feeling that thered be a neigborhood patrol in place.
If I lived in an aprtment complex ANYWHERE, or in indianapolis.....I'd bug the hell out to my parents or inlaws house in the burbs...The only time I'd competely go paul bunyan is if all law biding citizens in my area were completley routed by crime or the UN....

 

[warangelcometh]

I think if you have a place that is easily fortifiable, have access to food and water and medical supplies - then stay put. Water and food are heavy to carry and you probably won't get as far as you would like. Unless you've already started prepping another bug out location it would be easier to fortify and supply what you have. Although if you are in an apartment or multi family dwelling you really need to have an alternate place for bug out. Bullets, beans and band aides brother.

 

[7th Stepper]

Horse? Did you say and really mean HORSE???? I'll take it! I'll take it! I'll take it!!!!

Talk about an alternate means of transportation, all you need is a saddle,(you can get them with rifle slings attached near the horn) bridle, and possibly a wagon (if it's trained to pull), and you won't have to rely on gas, oil, or any type of vehicle maintenance, ins, or over-hauls. Just a fenced yard to put it in, hay (which is relatively cheap, especially if the farmers with already bailed hay bug out) and a small shelter to house it in for when it gets cold.

I can think of a gazillion reasons I'd want to keep it, heck, if it gets to cold outside, I can put it in one of the spare bedrooms! Bill'd have a fit, but he'd see the wisdom of it eventually. For that matter, I can train his dog to pull a cart, that's an easy one. So......if you really want/need to get rid of him/her in that type of situation, drop me a line/text/PM, etc., and I'll take it off your hands for free!
7th Stepper
PS: What breed? From the weight it sounds like an old time "stock quarter" or a "draft" horse of some sort. Just curious.

 

[gunman41mag]

I'm in the big city, would like to leave for the country, but since I would need an 18 wheeler to move all my guns, bullets, reloaders, gunpowder. It doesn't look to like that is going to happen, so I mite as well make my home my FORT

 

[Rickshaw]

Stay put as long as possible. Join with neighbors and defend each other.

 

[Kart29]

Join with neighbors and defend each other.

Thank God somebody finally mentioned some sense of civic duty to help their neighbors in an emergency situation.

Good grief! It seems like our entire society is now a nation of minutewimps instead of minutemen. All we do is prepare to head for the hills when a threat appears. The right thing to do is to prepare to help yourself and to also prepare to help your neighbors. Not only will we all be best served by working together with our neighbors and helping each other out, but it's just the right thing to do. I guess "they" were right when they called this the "me first" generation.

The only thing I can imagine that could possibly induce me to "bug out" is a nuclear fallout situation. And I'm not going to sit around wasting my time and worrying about that.

 

[Josh922]

Thank God somebody finally mentioned some sense of civic duty to help their neighbors in an emergency situation.

Good grief! It seems like our entire society is now a nation of minutewimps instead of minutemen. All we do is prepare to head for the hills when a threat appears. The right thing to do is to prepare to help yourself and to also prepare to help your neighbors. Not only will we all be best served by working together with our neighbors and helping each other out, but it's just the right thing to do. I guess "they" were right when they called this the "me first" generation.

The only thing I can imagine that could possibly induce me to "bug out" is a nuclear fallout situation. And I'm not going to sit around wasting my time and worrying about that.

i agree. plus in my eyes if you bug out you run the chance of getting killed on the way to your bug out location if the country is in dismay and people are going crazy in the streets, whose to say they wont hold you up at gun point with 4 or 5 other people? they'll take your vehicle, your weapons and everything else you have in your car. for me and my buds bugging out is plan B. stay put unless that nukes a'comin.