State Militia ?

[Thor]

That is stuff that could actually work. Therefore, it will never be enacted.

Well, certainly not if it never gets to the floor. I recommended it to my state rep with a very draft draft of the proposal and he ran with it...right into a short term where it didn't get read in committee. This is the kind of thing that could be brought to the floor if enough INGO or just IN residents said it was a good idea to their reps...

Won't happen without us...

 

[Kutnupe14]

Maybe a tax rebate if you buy the Hoosier Millita Approved Rifle Variant.

Just to assist in the standardization. Buy a ar15/m16, rem 700, 1911, etc etc get to claim it (one credit per person, per type) on your taxes as a deduction.

Why would any govt essentially fund the sale of arms that potentially (no actually), is meant to used against them? I'm not trying to be a negative nancy guys (even though I am), I just want you guys to understand the politics of it. If we put this plan to a vote, it would be beat like oriental rug after a dust storm.

 

[Thor]

A militia that arms and trains itself would pose a problem to a professional army for about 10 minutes.... 10 sec if it's US force. The best chance for an insurgency force in the modern world, when taking on a national govt, is to sway a large portion of the military to your side. This ain't 1776. Modern militaries, even outside of the US are the real deal.

US military would make a major hurt on the US if they decided to actually do that. Then again...1.4M in the military including all maintainers, deployed, naval, etc makes a really small force in IN. If they are going to really KILL us, then 80M or more weapons holders biding their time may be the winning number.

If you think I am advocating the INV reestablishment as a means to beat the US military though you are mistaken. I am advocating this as a means to reestablish ownership of the republic and responsibility for it's defense as well as defense of your home and person. It is a potential for the state to use to defend itself in emergencies but it is also a lifestyle to bring order to society. Almost, you know, an inalienable right...

 

[Thor]

Why would any govt essentially fund the sale of arms that potentially (no actually), is meant to used against them? .

Because they are Americans?

 

[Bluejeeper]

Well, certainly not if it never gets to the floor. I recommended it to my state rep with a very draft draft of the proposal and he ran with it...right into a short term where it didn't get read in committee. This is the kind of thing that could be brought to the floor if enough INGO or just IN residents said it was a good idea to their reps...

Won't happen without us...

Yup.

We have to be the ones to get it out there

 

[BogWalker]

Why would any govt essentially fund the sale of arms that potentially (no actually), is meant to used against them? I'm not trying to be a negative nancy guys (even though I am), I just want you guys to understand the politics of it. If we put this plan to a vote, it would be beat like oriental rug after a dust storm.

I never understood why so many militia advocates want to create them to be used against the government. I always thought of them as a last/first defense against foreign invaders. If they're started with the idea of fighting our own government, you aren't training a militia. You're training an insurgency.

 

[Thor]

I never understood why so many militia advocates want to create them to be used against the government. I always thought of them as a last/first defense against foreign invaders. If they're started with the idea of fighting our own government, you aren't training a militia. You're training an insurgency.

Thank you...this day the internet is yours.

 

[Kutnupe14]

US military would make a major hurt on the US if they decided to actually do that. Then again...1.4M in the military including all maintainers, deployed, naval, etc makes a really small force in IN. If they are going to really KILL us, then 80M or more weapons holders biding their time may be the winning number.

If you think I am advocating the INV reestablishment as a means to beat the US military though you are mistaken. I am advocating this as a means to reestablish ownership of the republic and responsibility for it's defense as well as defense of your home and person. It is a potential for the state to use to defend itself in emergencies but it is also a lifestyle to bring order to society. Almost, you know, an inalienable right...

They wouldn't want to eliminate us, they would want to subjugate us. I know some guys in that 80 million, and though they are my friends, I roll my eyes when they talk tactics. Let be honest these "movement" is full of old guys, fat guys, a internet warriors with tricked out ARs.
Look at it this way, during the Battle of Berlin, the defense of the city fell upon 700k regular soldiers, and 30 Volkssturm (militia)divisions. They were dug in, had legit military grade weaponry, and honestly had a fair game plan. And they knew, after all they things their nation had did east, what was in store for them. The Russians steamrolled them.

 

[Kutnupe14]

I never understood why so many militia advocates want to create them to be used against the government. I always thought of them as a last/first defense against foreign invaders. If they're started with the idea of fighting our own government, you aren't training a militia. You're training an insurgency.

+10000000000000000000000000 but that's a second thought to most

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

Yes, and Perpich recognizes this duality (first page of the opinion). But, if the federal government is supreme, then ultimately the National Guard does not belong to the state.

Just let that marinate.


Can the student think of any other areas of public policy where this logic can be applied? Discuss in the space provided below.

 

[cobber]

You want the State of Indiana, out of a budget of 14.4B, to write checks for Abrams tanks at 6M a whack, and to maintain them, crew them, and buy fuel? And you want aircraft on top of that?

Where will this money come from? Maybe we tax politicians per lie? Indiana will have the greatest military on Earth.

Pentagon hand-me-downs? Re personal weapons, the State didn't buy mine for me. Can I count on that check now, seeing as I am an official Indiana Militia Man?

A militia that arms and trains itself would pose a problem to a professional army for about 10 minutes.... 10 sec if it's US force. The best chance for an insurgency force in the modern world, when taking on a national govt, is to sway a large portion of the military to your side. This ain't 1776. Modern militaries, even outside of the US are the real deal.

Not advocating anything, but why would a militia go toe-to-toe against an "invader" unless it was in their best interest to do so?

 

[Thor]

They wouldn't want to eliminate us, they would want to subjugate us. I know some guys in that 80 million, and though they are my friends, I roll my eyes when they talk tactics. Let be honest these "movement" is full of old guys, fat guys, a internet warriors with tricked out ARs.
Look at it this way, during the Battle of Berlin, the defense of the city fell upon 700k regular soldiers, and 30 Volkssturm (militia)divisions. They were dug in, had legit military grade weaponry, and honestly had a fair game plan. And they knew, after all they things their nation had did east, what was in store for them. The Russians steamrolled them.

If you are assuming the only thing this is built for is nation on nation conflict you are obviously missing the point. The Mayberry Sheriffs office can't withstand the Russian hordes either but it doesn't mean Andy and Barney didn't have a job to do. If you want to talk about the Russian hordes that can make it to IN to fight a war the INV would probably do pretty good. If you want to talk about fighting some horde in another country there's plenty of time to equip and train...we don't own enough strategic lift capability to get everyone to the fight at once anyway.

Now, if you just don't want to see an organized state militia that's another topic.

Just because someone may be carrying a few years and maybe a few pounds more than they used to does not mean that they can be of no use. They may not be the best, or scariest, but does not mean they can't own their own piece of ground, or help move debris, or help feed people displaced by a disaster. This is a good day for that type of discussion anyway....Dec 16, 1811 is the anniversary of the earthquake in IN that was so violent it rerouted the Mississippi River...how would that look today? Chicago and Gary would be laid flat, roads would be destroyed, power and water would be done...who ya gonna call? Might help to have that list handy. Might help if they knew their responsibilities and were apt to act on them instead of waiting around for the gubmint to do it for them because lets face it they are just old and fat and there's some really witty fit person who will take care of it for them.

 

[Thor]

+10000000000000000000000000 but that's a second thought to most

If you think so then you're not listening to this discussion, you're hearing one you had someplace else. Since the INV would be called up and organized by local and state authorities, since it's authorized under our founding documents, why would this be considered AGAINST the state? This if for and about Indiana and its citizens.

 

[Thor]

Pentagon hand-me-downs?

That would be an excellent use for them...at least as far as firearms are concerned. When it comes to vehicles you start to drive the bill that Kirk was refering to.

Even crew served weapons are expensive. A 7.62NATO belt fed weapon costs something like $23 a second to feed. Personal weapons are a more reasonable and achievable goal IMHO.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Can the student think of any other areas of public policy where this logic can be applied? Discuss in the space provided below.

Have you joined the INGOtarians in reading parts of the Constitution out of existence?

 

[Bill of Rights]

...Chicago ... would be laid flat...

Don't tease...

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Pentagon hand-me-downs? Re personal weapons, the State didn't buy mine for me. Can I count on that check now, seeing as I am an official Indiana Militia Man?

Good grief, you want another 12 pages of ranting against the 1033 program?

 

[BigMoose]

Who says we need M1 abrams..... the fuel bill alone would bankrupt the state in a second.

I say we go old school. M60 patton, M14 rifle, alice gear, and retired marine drill instructors!

When do we invade Illinois? Er I guess invade isn't PC anymore, okay when do we LIBERATE Illinois??

 

[Kutnupe14]

Not advocating anything, but why would a militia go toe-to-toe against an "invader" unless it was in their best interest to do so?

That's fair, but an incredibly remote possibility. The idea of a foreign invader crossing an ocean whipping the navy, and then whipping the other branches..... WITHOUT a nuclear solution, and leaving the people as legitimate line of defense is some Red Dawn type nonsense.
I guess intergalactic alien invasion defense might be a possibility.

 

[Rookie]

So, I shouldn't practice yelling WOLVERINES daily?